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| Thread: So. You guys still think Trump is no problem? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 · «PREV |
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Salamandre
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posted April 22, 2025 08:44 PM |
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Okay, fair enough. When this war will be over, I will return to this comment and compare what Trump could have obtain for Ukraine, with what will be left of Ukraine within the current EU non-existent strategy.
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blizzard
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posted April 22, 2025 09:23 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 21:56, 22 Apr 2025.
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Older institutions are (mostly) opposed to Trump. So, the Nobel Peace Prize, which has been around the block many times, is something Trump would be unlikely to get for anything. That's not a meaningful example of Trump being persecuted and targeted in a special way, because who cares? It's a prize that people get. It's like getting an Oscar or a getting a Pulitzer. The world doesn't stand still when somebody gets a Nobel.
You might not consider him "mainstream media" but Joe Rogan is very much a mainstream figure, he gets a ridiculously massive amount of people tuning into him, and he has endorsed Trump without (usually) being an overtly political figure. That is one example of a show with a ton of cultural weight being in the Trump arena. Many of the older institutions and older programs do not enjoy the cultural weight that they once did and it doesn't matter as much as it once did that they don't like Trump.
So, saying that the cards are stacked against Trump is simply not true if you're going to be selective about who does or doesn't endorse and support him. The reality is that Trumpism has very substantial reach in pop culture and in media, with all the power that comes with that. An armada of pro-Trump podcasters means that Trump's positions can be passed on beyond the Trump presidency or beyond whatever is left of his lifespan.
edit: When I say "institution", I mean it as a social mechanism through which culture and ideas are transmitted through the generations. Many institutions might not like Trump, but their institutional power as institutions is itself very much weakened.
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Salamandre
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posted April 22, 2025 09:58 PM |
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I never said cards are stacked against him, I said the Mainstream, which means dominant medias, as CNN and MSNBC for example, are fanatically against him. Therefore people who like and will vote for Trump will turn to something else, as Joe Rogan, Piers Morgan (mostly balanced debate but slightly pro-Trump and very keen on democrat lies), Russel Brand (brilliant), Peterson (quite a religious nut since last year but he liked Trump), The Daily Wire, to name a few and so. Fox News too, when they don't chicken out, which they did a lot. That is 40 millions subscribers in all (not counting Fox News which is what, 70 millions?). Then Musk buying Tweeter and removing the censure was the last deadly hit, hence the hate he receives right now. Fair enough, nobody should force anyone to follow a specific source of information or opinion.
Anyway, this is how things will evolve from now, the dominance of state medias is on the decline, not hard to guess why.
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blizzard
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posted April 22, 2025 10:31 PM |
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Edited by blizzard at 22:48, 22 Apr 2025.
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Well, older institutions are stuck in the position of advocating uncool things, like working on a carbon neutral/carbon negative civilization or at least moving in that general direction. Promoting and following international law, including putting limits to national sovereignty in subject to those laws and agreements. It's not necessarily super attractive stuff. It's more along the lines of brushing and flossing, and the dental hygienist telling you that you're gonna need root canals and crowns if you don't behave yourself.
And then Trump shows up as the proverbial "**** the police" charismatic gangster boss who is opposed to these institutions with their uncool ideas and their restrictive attitude towards human activity, and he starts talking about how badass things can be under his watch, and it is very appealing to anybody who is in the market for a quick backtracking to the 1980s.
edit: But, on the Ukraine thing, I do agree with you that a peace settlement is worth a shot and the EU strategy is failing. They want to out-attrition Putin by funding the war for several more years, which is devastating for Ukraine. Trump is suing for peace for his own reasons (REEs and a deeper decoupling from China that he started in 2016) but despite that, it could still lead to a positive outcome. As for the extortion part: things can always be rewritten down the road.
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Salamandre
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posted April 22, 2025 11:59 PM |
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The climate protection "uncool" narrative is a fake posture which most of its defenders abandon when it threatens their own survival or simply comfort. You have all those famous comedians, or Prince Harris, Al Gore, bragging about how we should care about, then 2 minutes later they jump in their personal jet or carbon-emitting super yachts, for some entertainment trip then they all live in multiple energy-intensive mansions. You have Germany who was such an ardent defender of climate change, and then decided to punish Russians who provided 50% of the coal, and guess what, Germany is now destroying villages and wind farms so they can expand and use up to full production ... coal mines.
I don't even need to mention the energy trade restrictions in Europe, which lead to a total rip off of the consumer - thousands of businesses destroyed as well ; we were supposed to produce the cleanest and cheaper nuclear energy ever yet our energy prices went up by 60% in just 2 years.
I am not a climate change denier, I am fully aware of the threat, but at this point, what we need is money to invest in new energy and not hypocrite zealots disowning all their convictions at the first challenge.
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blizzard
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posted April 23, 2025 12:08 AM |
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Edited by blizzard at 00:14, 23 Apr 2025.
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Well, there are people like Greta who actually took a solar barge (or something) when she was touring NYC, if intense authenticity is really that important to you.
It isn't to me. I don't care that Al Gore uses a jet when he's travelling to conferences and such where there are thousands of people in attendance. I don't expect him to be traveling around in an algae-powered blimp. And I would think that the Paris Accord is not THAT hard to abide by. It's not even very demanding and it gives a generous timeline to follow. It's an initial document to start getting nation-state working together on something, but Trump doesn't even want to do that, because he wants impoverished countries to be beholden to identical standards as the US, so the Paris Accord is unfair in his book.
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Salamandre
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posted April 23, 2025 12:33 AM |
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Looks like there is always a valid reason to get exempt of the restrictions you want to impose on others.
Also Kilimanjaro got 9 feet of snow this year, so Al Gore who predicted no snow at all by 2016, should maybe refund the listeners to his conferences, then purchase a canoe, as his 20 feet increasing in sea level prediction didn't occur neither. Yep, the same guy selling the idea that Trump is fabricating reality. Good time for a oar.
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blizzard
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posted April 23, 2025 02:44 AM |
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Edited by blizzard at 02:51, 23 Apr 2025.
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Ban air travel? Which document is that in? This is a strawman.
Why does it matter if Al Gore said something inaccurate once upon a time? (assuming what you said is true; I'll give you the benefit of the doubt) That defuncts the trends that we are moving in? He is willing to correct and amend himself, like you would expect from an adult. We are 5 years past the previous election and Trump is still in pretend mode that he got robbed, just like he is in pretend mode on a number of things.
It's not just about temperature increases. The acidiifcation of the oceans from absorbing higher proportions of carbon has been throwing biomes out of wack, and throwing biomes out of wack has other effects, etc. The Earth is a significantly less healthy system today than it was 50 years ago. It is the sort of thing you should expect during a period of higher volcanic activity... when there is no period right now.
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JollyJoker
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posted April 23, 2025 08:32 AM |
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Salamandre said:
You have Germany who was such an ardent defender of climate change, and then decided to punish Russians who provided 50% of the coal, and guess what, Germany is now destroying villages and wind farms so they can expand and use up to full production ... coal mines.
Fake news. In 2023 SEVEN wind turbines were demolished by German energy corp RWE. This was done to get to dig out more waste (not coal), because the area is supposed to become a sea (planned in 1990).
In other news, due to the gas problems, the deal with RWE was, that 2 blocks of one coal plant were not shut down as planned in 2022, but instead will be shut down this year. For that RWE will shut down its last coal plant in 2030 instead of 2038.
Don't believe everything you want to believe. In 2024 Germany has covered 59.4% of its energy usage by renewable sources. 2023 it were 56%. The one small snag is, that Germany had about a 6% import/export deficit (tripling from 2023).
Which simply means there is a shortfall of energy (still) when its dark and windless, known problem, needs addressing.
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Salamandre
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posted April 23, 2025 09:39 AM |
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Ghost
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posted April 23, 2025 09:47 AM |
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A German government doesn't tell to German JJ? I don't read sources..
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JollyJoker
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posted April 23, 2025 10:04 AM |
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It's like I wrote. Yes, they dismantled 7 wind turbines - but they would have gone anyway, since the whole area is to become a lake and they need to heap up earth to make slopes for said lake. Due to gas shortage 2 blocks of one coal plant run 3 years longer, but for that another plant will be shut down in 2030 instead of 2038.
Sometimes "they demolish a windpark for brown coal" is simply propaganda because it leaves out context.
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Salamandre
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posted April 23, 2025 11:29 PM |
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Pol
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posted April 24, 2025 11:45 AM |
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That's futile, you are speaking about Tauruses and USA forbids their transfer.
And these wouldn't be ready for the transfer anyway.
Germany government first would need to order new batch of Tauruses, preferably without any USA or Swiss parts and they also need to checking and upgrading their current ones.
And yes, UA is in dire need of LR and AA systems, as the supply from USA is going down. USA is even pushing EU to stop their supplies. Such is current idea of USA long lasting peace.
So first things first. Germany don't have any Tauruses to offer now. And don't even do any steps, to have them ready at any later moment.
And obviously you can't fight with chancellor fire tongue.
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Salamandre
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posted April 24, 2025 12:51 PM |
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I don't think what Germany can or can't give is relevant, but what Ukraine estimated as necessary in order to hold terrain. 372 billion euros until 2029, which is, as they ask, 0,5% of each EU NATO member GDP. And no, is not only about Tauruses (3rd point in the demand), but all combat aircraft (4th).
But : they already gave endless estimations since 2022, one after another, and every-time it came as insufficient. Maybe it's time to look from another perspective.
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JollyJoker
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posted April 24, 2025 05:30 PM |
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Wrong thread, but still:
The American "plan" is unacceptable, for the following reasons:
1) Russia has to do nothing;
2) Ukraine has to accept the current territory loss as permanent - which it can't do expressis verbis due to their constitution. There could be something like a moratorium for Crimea to be negotiated anew in, say, 10 years.
3) No safety guarantees by and from the US. The "plan" mentions vaguely safety guarantees by the Europeans - but that is obviously something the Europeans would have to deal with and accept in some way.
4) For doing nothing at all the USA want control over the nuclear plant Saporishshya AND a very favorable resource deal with the rest Ukraine.
In short - it's ridiculous for both Ukraine AND Europeans. Because IF Europeans would have to guarantee safety THEY would deserve any resource and reconstruction deal.
As far as I know, the CDU with Chancellor in spe Merz favors giving Ukraine Taurus - but with the twist, that Ukrainians are supposed to learn handling them first, and in agreement with Britain and France, so that no German soldiers would be needed to shoot the things.
Note, that the German GREEN party is in favor of giving Taurus to the Ukraine as well.
So it looks like we DO have Taurus to offer.
For me, the fact that the GREEN party of Germany is in favor not only of supporting Ukraine AND giving them Taurus speaks volumes about the seriousness of the Russian threat to all of Europe.
My stance is, I'm in favor to support Ukraine as long as they are willing to fight.
I EDIT this to add, that now even DIE LINKE (The Left) is extremely critical of Trump's proposal. They call it "a deal with Putin, nothing else".
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