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| Thread: Asking about strategy | |
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feelgood76
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 10, 2003 02:47 PM |
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Asking about strategy
Hi.. this is my first post. I`m a newbie in this game. I`ve played Heroes 3, but because heroes 4 is completely different from I`m still struggling to play this game.
I`m playing the Emilia campaign. It`s still easy now. I can win but with lots of reload. How do I play without reload ? And I need 5 months to complete one scenario. Is this okay ?
I hope someone could enligthen me:
1. What to do in the first day and week ?
2. Do we need to have level 4 creature ASAP ?
3. Does city hall important ?
4. How to play this game fast ?
There are still many questions I`d like to ask but this is enough. Maybe someone could give me the thread worth reading about the early strategy.
I`d like to search but with 56K, it`ll take so long before I can read. Sorry for asking.
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BoogieMan
Famous Hero
The John of Spades
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posted September 10, 2003 03:03 PM |
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Never feel bad for asking, feelgood 
I can't describe a near-flawless first week strategy for Heroes 4 'cause I haven't played it much. What I can tell you is that Emilia's campaign is about the easiest of them because of the efficiency of genies+illusions against the AI.
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The BoogieMan wrote ... and saw that it was good.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted September 10, 2003 07:47 PM |
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When starting out on the game you do need to RELOAD the game in order to learn it. If you don't take a chance against a seemingly superior enemy you won't really develope your knowledge about the game.
Do try to avoid doing the same mistakes several times, though.
I've played through many of the campaigns on Champion difficulty, and the overall forumla is to be as aggressive as humanly possible, while minimizing your own losses. (losses should often be none at all.)
With a level 1 Hero you need to develope the Hero and the army will be stronger than the Hero you have. So if it's the first scenario you do need to recruit some creatures to begin with. For Order Town, build and recruit Halflings early on. Always build for Genies as they are much better than Nagas.
Once you get going though, the formula is to build, build and build and forfeiting to recruit. The only exception is genies since you want these as soon as possible. And it's likely to take you a while to build your level 4 anyway.
Dwarves and your level 2 creatures should be left unrecruited, and they could very well remain so for a long time.
The primary thing you need to do is to learn how to minimize losses. For Order: Genies are the key to almost all of the strategy, they are the troops you must use and protect over any other. Do not enter a Combat where you can expect to lose your Genies. Split your Genies and use several stacks of them in each Combat. One big stack and one or several stacks with just one Genie. The single stacks will be casting slow, cowardice, mirth, or song of peace. The big stacks ice bolt or create illusion.
For your Heroes develop the Combat skill as quickly as possible to Grand Master (but the subskills are not that important, though also useful.) Soak damage with your Heroes, buy Immortality potions and use them.
For the carry-over Heroes: invest all you can in Tuition structures and learning. Let them take all the altars and jewels that lie around.
Certain enemies are much more dangerous than others. Avoid facing them unless you are appropriately equipped to handle them. The list of dangerous enemies includes mainly spellcasters with direct damage spells like: Magi, Genies, Water Elementals and Fairy Dragons.
If you have a 100% Magic Resitant Hero then all of the above will be slaughtered easily by the Hero alone
Ranged attackers will cause higher losses than non-ranged, and be particularly careful with Cyclopses due to their area attack. Ballista (and Catapults) can also be a pain since Forgetfulness doesn't affect them.
Don't enter combat with Black Dragons with Genies.
1. Build for Genies. I'd say it's your number one priority until you have them. Recruit a Lord to give you more income and increase creature production in town.
2. While useful, I'd say it's more important to care for your Heroes and buy Treasury, Alchemist shop and the tuition building. Since the level 3 Genies are so strong in Order I'd say the level 4 is a secondary consideration, especially since you have to waste 15.000 Gold, 20 wood and 20 Ore to get the Castle. (In the Emilia Campaign I think you are also forced to go for Titans which takes way too long.)
3. City Hall places fairly low, but before the level 4 dwelling. Better to recruit more lords and ladies. If you have a few learning stones close, then their Estates skill will soon give more money than the City Hall.
4. You have to experiment and RELOAD to do that. When playing Order, the Genies and the Heroes are your keys to success.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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feelgood76
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 11, 2003 11:51 AM |
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Thanks
Thanks for your reply,
It`s ok to reload. Now I feel better. How do you play on Champion given that we have no resource early and stronger enemies and monsters ?
My strategy now is go to at least to level 3 ASAP then build for money. I like my hero to have combat, nobility and magic. Do you think scouting is important for Emilia ?
When playing I`ll bring dwarves and magi also. Are you saying that I can win without them. Genies are weak and when facing any ranged attacker they can be beateen easily. I`ll try this way tonight.
Thanks again.
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streetspirit
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 12, 2003 12:18 PM |
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Quote:
Thanks for your reply,
It`s ok to reload. Now I feel better. How do you play on Champion given that we have no resource early and stronger enemies and monsters ?
My strategy now is go to at least to level 3 ASAP then build for money. I like my hero to have combat, nobility and magic. Do you think scouting is important for Emilia ?
When playing I`ll bring dwarves and magi also. Are you saying that I can win without them. Genies are weak and when facing any ranged attacker they can be beateen easily. I`ll try this way tonight.
Thanks again.
it's definitely ok to reload so that you'll have a better understanding of the game... optimize your performance... be most efficient with your movements...
about scouting, it could be your last priority for emilia... order magic, tactics, nobility, combat and scouting plus the genies would be a great combination...
about not bringing dwarves and magi, yes you can win... your genies will cast the spells to improve your hero... your hero attacks and takes damage... may die but with the potion of immortality becomes alive again... in effect, you didn't lose gold in recruiting useless creatures...
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EmperorSly
Known Hero
Destroyer of Liver
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posted September 12, 2003 02:34 PM |
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how to play fast...
Unless you play on very high difficulty, speed is the key to being fast  That is, ground that can be covered in a day. Two important things to keep that up: take along only the fastest creatures (in case of order, genies and dragon golems and heroes) and have pathfinding. With genies and dragon golems only and GM pathfinding, you can walk 45 squares a day even in swamp. Now think how what you can walk with dwarves and no pathfinding -- about 20 on grass and 10 in swamp! Thats 2 - 4.5 times less... When having a few weeks supply of genies and hero that knows good magic, you wouldnt ever miss those halflings or magi that stayed home.
How to get GM pathfinding and good magic fast? Simple rule: sharing the gained experience between two heroes gives you much more total levels than giving it all to one hero. For what it takes to build a level 20 hero, you can build about 2 level 16 heroes. So have one for magic only and another for pathfinding. However, in campaign it might be a bad idea, since only one would carry over. Therefore you might want to give all exp to emilia. Just make sure she tops order magic and pathfinding (i.e. scouting) as fast as possible -- dont take any of the other crap. Nobility is useful but not as necessary as pathfinding. Combat helps to absorb physical damage, but a good magic hero shouldnt have to do that anyway: with enough hypnotization and mass slowing and other wicked stuff like songofpeacing genies you can make sure no enemy ever gets near your hero (or if they do you have your immortality potion ready). Start thinking about combat only after you have GM Order Magic and GM Pathfinding.
Neo: "You mean I could dodge bullets?"
Morpheus: "No. When you are ready, you won't have to..."
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted September 12, 2003 11:23 PM |
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Edited By: Djive on 12 Sep 2003
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Emilia's Campaign is one of the very few that I haven't played yet on Champion.
On Champion and first Scenario simply accept that some enemies are simply too tough for you and leave these for later. Prioritize your targets after the strength and composition of the armies you face. Also value the losses after what you stand to gain. If you stand to gain access to a Genie dwelling, then you can accept some losses just to get access to it.
On ranged attackers (only), use four stacks of Genies. Three casts Song of Peace on the opponents ranged units, the last stack casts Ice Bolt or Create Illusion to decimate the enemy or add your own troops. Use Heroes to shield your Genies. (Compact formation, with heroes in the front spots.) If your Heroes can take one round of fire then begin by slowing the Enemy with Genies. If Heroes have forgetfulness then use that immediately. (It leaves Geni stacks free to cast other spells like Mirth while the opponent advances.)
If you don't have three Heroes with enough durability then Gold Golems or Dwarves makes a good last troop. They should only defend to begin with, and should be split away after combat as to not hamper your movement.
You should not need Magi and Dwarves to win. Myself I could be tempted to use Halflings because of their ranged attack, but since they should be one of the front stacks you will likely lose some of them since they will be permissible targets for enemy fire.
Scouting is better than Nobility on Emilia, to get access to Nobility hire Lords and Ladies in Tavern. (Avoid taking the Seamanship skill, as I recall it's not helpful.)
I'd take Death, Order, Life, Combat, and Scouting on Emilia. (Your dwarf hero has Tactics IIRC and the skill doesn't stack. For last scenario you won't have the dwarf helper, but you will get access to another carryover hero instead so pay attention to the scenario descriptions.)
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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Delfontes
Known Hero
Sorcerer Extraordinaire
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posted September 29, 2003 11:20 PM |
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My favorite tactic with her, and later Solymr is kinda cheap .
Work on Order magic, naturally, and combat. (I worked on order and life first, and regretted it).
Basically I'd have her all by herself so the enemy would be in 1 big stack if it was one creature type.
Cast slow on that creature (level 2 order spell).
Start shooting it with an arrow or frost bolt if you don't do much damage with a bow. (cast forgetfullness first if it is a ranged creature)
When it gets close, cast teleport (level 3 order spell) on it and shove it way in the corner of the map.
Repeat forever . Anything not magic resistant dies eventually this way, hehehe
Later on when she is a bit higher you can go against whole armies. Just cast mass slow, and berserk/hypnotise etc. Use teleport liberally to keep things accross the map from you.
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted October 02, 2003 11:46 AM |
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I used the tactics/startegy Djive sketched above, in a game yesterday (first map on Emilia campaign), and I've never done as well on a campaign before!
Thanks!
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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