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| Thread: Primary skill analysis: Nature Magic | |
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Preserver
Promising
Famous Hero
Elemental Druid
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posted October 18, 2001 09:46 PM |
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Primary skill analysis: Nature Magic
Hehe Djive, I'm stealing your thread... Okay, here goes:
According to the secondary skills of the other magic schools, the secondary skills to Nature Magic could be categorized like this:
Herbalism: Increase the amount of spellpoints available.
Meditation & Summoning: Increases specific specialities of nature magic and post battle effects.
The primary skill (called Nature Magic) allows you to learn:
Level 1 nature spells by basic
Level 2 nature spells by advanced
Level 3 nature spells by expert
Level 4 nature spells by master
Level 5 nature spells by grandmaster
Examples of Heroes 3 spells that could fit (mostly earth and water): Visions, View Air, View Earth, Summon X, Stoneskin, Water walk, Earthquake and Town portal. (if you come up with more just say, and I'll add it.)
Herbalism should, going after it's name, also have something to do with healing (Life Magic). But it doesn't seem to be that way. Of course it's also logical that nature mana is only getable by gathering/studying/using herbs. This also sounds very druidic to me:
"Ryland Junior! Make me my tea, or I will never get those spellpoints!" 
Summoning is the art of spellcasting woodland creatures (and others?) into the battlefield to support your "real army" (from green MtG; creature hordes/tokens). This will, together with the creature portal and the post battle effect (recruit/summons monsters in the neighbouring area), make one of Preserve's strength, to have many, and different creatures. Exactly how the summoning skill will work, I'm not sure, but it'll probably increase the amount of creatures summoned and decrease the casting cost of summoning spells.
Meditation, well I should say I have no clue, but I had some thoughts though: The most logical to me would be meditation to build up magic resistance, but since this is already a combat skill, Meditation probably means something else. If we take the Preserve specialities, we've got:
1: Being big in numbers and various species, which then means various abilities. (creature portal and the post battle recruitment bonus)
2: Having more creatures on the battlefield than on the adventure map, to surprise the enemy (summoning)
3: Luck (rainbow and fountain structures. Maybe some fortune spells? Or are they going to Life Magic?)
Then, I think this so called "nature" magic misses something. What about enchanting the forest itself to provide a first line of defense? Besides the possibility of a summon dendroid spell, Nature Magic needs real "nature" spells like those in MtG. Here the meditation comes in; by meditating, the heroes would get a "link" to nature, which allows them to have the natural powers fighting on their side. Both as "Slow", "Tangle" and "Root" spells. And also a spell to turn battlefield objects into creatures like trees into dendroids etc. This will also make a logic advancement for Preserve on wilderness terrain (with those battlefield obstacles). This could be a logic explanation on the word meditation as a skill to support that kind of spells (like the summoning skill supporting summoning). Maybe everything is messed up, and meditation is increasing spell points, while herbalism is spell affecting? I don't know...
Anyway, Nature Magic are well placed in the magic circle. With the beneficial, blessing and healing Life Magic on one side and the hostile and damaging Chaos Magic on the other. This way, there will be a great variation of spells in the Preserve besides the nature spells.
Please tell what your thoughts about nature magic is. What do you think and what would you like? (and other ideas for what the secondary skills do...)
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- The only alert the invaders had was the rustling of leaves on a day without wind -
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niteshade
Known Hero
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posted October 18, 2001 10:22 PM |
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I strongly suspect that meditation is the spell point skill and herbalism is the spell power skill. Summoning we already know is a pre (or post?) battle skill.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted October 18, 2001 10:53 PM |
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Someone stole my thread!!!!
err... wait... I gave Preserver my premission as well as supplying him with some of the information. 
i actually listed a few more water spells as candidates: Ice Bolt and Frost Ring. The reason for this were:
* Nature is allied to Chaos (which specializes in direct damage)
* I didn't want to put general direct damage spells in Life or Order.
* In MtG, green actually have some direct damage spells (usually targetted at flyers). Examples are Hurricane, Winter Blast and Squall Monger.
* Also ice and snow seemed like Nature phenomenon to me and seemed more appropriate than the other damage spells.
(Then again this is all guess-work)
It's noteworthy that of the secondary skills some of them really seem to be connected with a specific spell or purpose.
For Chaos Magic, Pyromancy should come with a Fireball spell. For Death magic, Demonology should come with a demon summoning spell. For Nature magic, I'm not sure. I'd agree with Nightshade that Meditation probably increases spellpoints. But then what could Herbalsim do?
Create a thorny hedge sealing of the battle field? Bind a creature stack to the ground in vines?
Some of the Luck oriented skills seems to go to haven and Life magic. Though, some could probably remain in the Preserve and Nature magic.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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Jenova
Famous Hero
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posted October 23, 2001 05:13 PM |
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What sort of "damage" spells does Nature have (Fireball, Lightning Bolt, Cold Ray, where have these all gone now?)? And I'd love to see what Herbalism does.. Sounds very "mysticism-ish" to me. And I shun that skill.
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niteshade
Known Hero
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posted October 23, 2001 05:50 PM |
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It may not have any damage spells. 3do did say that they are trying to avoid having a bunch of spells that all do the same thing, ie lightning bolt and cold ray. And that they want to make each school of magic really unique. So it could very well be that only say chaos and death have damage spells. But who knows.
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Darion
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 23, 2001 10:29 PM |
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Well... couldn't they have some basic damage spells that have different effects? Such as.. um.... well maybe they have a spell called like... ... ... ensnare okay. So they hurl a bolt of green energy that does damage, and has a chance of ensnaring the enemy for one round (cannot move, but can still retaliate or shoot) as opposed to life's basic damage spell, lightray that has a chance of blinding the target.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted October 23, 2001 10:55 PM |
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When it comes to damage spells my reasoning was this.
Chaos (Asylum) specializes in it. This we know.
Life and Death have direct damage vs. the other type of army. (Destroy Undead and Death Ripple.)
The schools allied with Chaos (Nature and Death) may have some additional damaging spells, but not that many. The towns that are not allied would have no direct damage at all, or the direct damage would have to be severly restricted to be only usable on some type of creatures.
Since cold (winter) damage and damage to fliers was part of green in MtG, and green corresponds to nature (Preserve) I allocated the "frost" direct damage spells to green.
I'm not up to date with the latest MtG expansion, but as far a I know neither blue nor white has any direct damage spells in that game. The closest I know is the white spell called "Swords to Plowshares", which removes a creature from the game and gives the owner life equal to the creature's toughness.
Both green and black has some spells for direct damage, and red has the bulk of the direct damage spells.
Then again, the Heroes designers may have made their own ditributions and decisions on which schools should have damage spells. Likely we will see at least one or perhaps two schools that have no direct damage, or perhaps only a single spell.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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UnkaHaakon
Responsible
Famous Hero
happily tilting at windmills
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posted October 23, 2001 11:21 PM |
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Here's something to consider in this discussion. In HOMM3, fairy dragons were noted as spellcasters. How might these views of Nature magic apply to them?
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Some people say the glass is half full..Some people say it's half empty... I say "What're you asking me to drink?"
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted January 20, 2002 10:55 PM |
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EDited: An updated version of spells and skills for Nature Magic.
Prerequisites for skills:
Basic Nature Magic for Advanced Summoning
Advanced Nature Magic for Master Summoning
Expert Nature Magic for Grandmaster Summoning
Basic Herbalism for Advanced Nature Magi.
Advanced Herbalism and Basic Meditation for Expert Nature Magic
Expert Herbalism and Expert Meditation for Master Nature Magic
Grandmaster Herbalism and Grandmaster Meditation for Grandmaster Nature Magic
Basic Nature Magic
Hero can cast level 1 Nature Magic spells.
Spells:Giant Strength(B), Pathfinding, Speed(B), Stoneskin(B), Summon Leprechaun(S), Summon Sprite(S), Summon Wolf(S), Terrain Walk(B)
Advanced Nature Magic
Hero can cast level 2 Nature Magic spells.
Spells: Fortune(B), Quicksand, Snake Strike(B), Summon Elf(S), SummonSatyr(S), Summon White Tiger(S), Wasp Swarm(C)
Expert Nature Magic
Hero can cast level 3 Nature Magic spells.
Spells: Ani-magic, Mass Speed(B), Summon Air Elemental(S), Summon Earth Elemental(S), Summon Fire Elemental(S), Summon Water Elemental(S), Water Walk
Master Nature Magic
Hero can cast level 4 Nature Magic spells.
Spells: Mass Fortune(B), Mass Snake Strike(B), Summon Griffin(S), Summon Unicorn(S), Summon Waspwort(S)
Grandmaster Nature Magic
Hero can cast level 5 Nature Magic spells.
Spells: Dragon Strength(B), Summon Faerie Dragon(S), Summon Mantis(S), Summon Phoenix(S).
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Basic Herbalism: +5 mana and +10% efficiency of Nature spells.
Advanced Herbalism: +10 mana, +20% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers 1 mana/day
Expert Herbalism:+15 mana, +30% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers 1 mana/day.
Master Herbalism: +20 mana, +40% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers 2 mana/day
Grandmaster Herbalism: +25 mana, +50% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers s mana/day
Basic Meditation: +5 mana and +10% efficiency of Nature spells.
Advanced Meditation: +10 mana, +20% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers 1 mana/day
Expert Meditation:+15 mana, +30% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers 1 mana/day.
Master Meditation: +20 mana, +40% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers 2 mana/day
Grandmaster Meditation: +25 mana, +50% efficiency of Nature spells, recovers s mana/day
****
Basic Summoning
The hero can summon Leprechauns, Sprites and Wolves. Experience points of the summoned creatures cannot be higher than 20+10% per level.
Advanced Summoning
The hero can summon Leprechauns, Sprites and Wolves. Experience points of the summoned creatures cannot be higher than 40+10% per level .
Expert Summoning
The hero can summon Elfs, Satyrs and White Tigers. Experience points of the summoned creatures cannot be higher than 60+10% per level .
Master Summoning
The hero can summon Elfs, Satyrs and White Tigers. Experience points of the summoned creatures cannot be higher than 80+10% per level .
Grandmaster Summoning
The hero can summon Fire, Air, Water and Earth Elementals. Experience points of the summoned creatures cannot be higher than 100+10% per level.
Moderator's note:This topic has been closed, as it refers to an older version of the game. To discuss Heroes 3, please go to Library Of Enlightenment, to discuss Heroes 4, please go to War Room Of Axeoth.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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