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| Thread: Nival: impulsive or planner? (or Ubisoft) |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted June 04, 2007 11:50 PM |
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Nival: impulsive or planner? (or Ubisoft)
I've been wandering how much Nival do plan and how much they just throw them self into . I remember AGES Ago they said: There will be no orcs. We are now getting orcs. If there had not been any orcs, it would be very odd, because Dark messiah , the related in story to this, had orcs and if Nival said: NO ORCS! Then DM had to change story and that would have been ugly! - So were they scaring us? or were Ubisoft pushing them?
What partnership did they have with Arkane studios(Dark messiah), did they plan everything together? Lets hope so!
Dwarves, here I do think they planned something but how much? thet released again, a bugged game . With no sounds to the dwarves, that took 2 patches to fix. Bad nival! We got new things, but we were to get a snowape, never seen it. What happended? Ubisoft or just a "Naah not going to work" feeling...
Alternative upgrades: What I would see as an Impulsive idea, they were surfing the forums, saw a guy who said: "I WANT ALTERNATIVE UPGRADES" and thousand agreeing - They jumped on board and are now doing there best to please us. As we can see the creativty is high, Fire breather, Arch demon, Hellmare, Anger treant, Rainbow "gay" dragon... I don't think they planned this to well, way to impulsive! Again what part did Ubisoft have in this? who wanted this more?
My question is covered in a long opening, how planned where they? As i see it , they should have releashed HoMM V original now! with all these great ideas! Because they could have organized it all better and less bugs ... But again what was the deadline! It must have been tight, because we got a half done game! - Whos fault? is there anyone to blame - Hope you understand the point of this
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Don't walk behind me; I may not
lead. Don't walk in front of me;
I may not follow. Just walk
beside me and be my friend.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted June 05, 2007 12:00 AM |
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Edited by Elvin at 00:02, 05 Jun 2007.
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I understand what you are saying and actually believe part of it is true. About the orcs they could have planned something else but were bashed by all these stonghold fans. Whatever happened they were pressured about it and might have had a change of plans. Just think about it, why would stronghold a core faction be left out for an expansion? Ok maybe they wanted just 6 factions in the original and found them the most dull. Still...
In any case only an insider would know as ubi would never reveal such information. About the names I think that's Nival's part as they developed the game and it wouldn't make sense if ubi babysitted them with names. About important things yes but that's not even practical.
The possibility that ubi made them work in too short deadlines is also a distinct possibility. Fabrice's motivation to keep patching monthly as well as the rushed early release speaks volumes - it was planned and that's how they were going to make amends.
The expansions were planned way ahead, it's the content that was originally planned that eludes us.
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Map also hosted on Moddb
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted June 05, 2007 12:29 AM |
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On the bottom line, I'm not really sure it matters, and sometimes I think it would be really nice for people to have a bit more positive look on the whole project, rather than questioning and bickering at the developer's feelings all the time. So what if they called it Arch Demon and I think it's a lame name, doesn't really affect gameplay, and in the end, that's what's more important.
About the Orcs, like I stated otherwise, it seems to me that Nival changed their original plans on that. The fans wanted Orcs really badly, however, and the headed our wishes - we should be happy that they listen to us. If they got the idea for third upgrades from some fans, well, so much for the better. I know that there are some things I would really like to see in the game myself, probably even more than alternative upgrades, but that's kind of besides the point.
And about the endless discussion with the game release ... Christ, what would we rather have, them releasing the game with some bugs and then doing patches when they are reported, or them holding back the game for another year to search for more bugs and game-test it? I know that I myself appreciate the fact that they did not hold back the game - even with the bugs - and I'm quite impressed with, if not the frequency of the patches, then the extend of the patches [complete changes in Necromancy, for instance].
Sorry for the rant ...
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What will happen now?
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted June 05, 2007 02:39 AM |
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Just noticed another bug, it's not big, but it's annoying. When the Skeleton is hit, it grunts like the Peasant. And when the Grim Raider dies, it whinnies like a horse. Go figure. On the whole "there will be no orcs" you've got Blizz saying it won't be SC2, etc. They may have not wanted to reveal it, or at first they may have not planned on adding another expansion- the successfulness could've suprised them.
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted June 05, 2007 02:45 AM |
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Isn't impulsiveness a good thing? That means that the game is more than just a chore, and they care enough about it to gamble.
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 07:03 AM |
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Meh people will be always complaining. Im happy what have been done and even more happy with whats comming. There are always things to improve but lets see both sides , not olny this bad. I still have many wishes and ideas but they will drown in flood of posts here anyway. If we want to do something instead of complaining and wishing we can write down our ideas and send them to ubi maybe it will help them in doing homm VI or maybe they change something in another patches.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 08:06 AM |
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of course they are impulsive.. or greedy, take your pick 
"we won't do orc" -- no way, we wouldn't,but we just want the $$$$$$$$$$$$!
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 12:55 PM |
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Ill just try to reply to a couple of you,
Orc talk, Well, they should have planned the orcs from the beginning, because they are in DM, which never was to be questioned! And DM is the future of HoMM , so why would they remove orcs when they were the big part of DM! ... That is what i dont understand
Alci: Fine, some bugs - But to wait 2 months for a patch... Long time, we waited 2 months after releash for Dwavf sounds, that saddens me...
Daystar: Yes indeed great to be impulsive, but they don't seem to always have thought everything through, like this alternative thing - Great idea, but they seem to have been rushing into it... But lets see how it works out.
feluniozbunio: great idea, but don't think they would be into the game, atleast not untill HoMM6 (if there is going to be one)
Doomforge: He kind of have a point, he just hid it in Humor ... Hmm... I hope its all about what they want to do and not Greed...
____________
Don't walk behind me; I may not
lead. Don't walk in front of me;
I may not follow. Just walk
beside me and be my friend.
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted June 05, 2007 02:04 PM |
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I doubt it. I heard about Ubisoft (overlords) telling Nival (actual creators) not to bother making an orc terrain set. Nival insisted. I think this is because they really care about the game, and are striving to improve it. I just hope they don't add too many new gameplay features. Alternate upgrades are alright, but if this happens every single time it could change too much.
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted June 05, 2007 02:08 PM |
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Yes and Fabrice said it was ubi that insisted so it's one's word vs the other. Forget about that, we can't know for sure.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 02:17 PM |
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oww come on, if they keep barking at each other, how can they actually make a team? ~~
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 02:24 PM |
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Quote:
oww come on, if they keep barking at each other, how can they actually make a team? ~~
Hmm... If they don't like eachother, I don't HoMM6 will be made by Nival and not in a near future by any means!
____________
Don't walk behind me; I may not
lead. Don't walk in front of me;
I may not follow. Just walk
beside me and be my friend.
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PhoenixReborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted June 05, 2007 03:39 PM |
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Concerning the terrain it doesn't matter who is making who do it as long as we get it in the game.
That's one of the basic tenets of the game, each faction has it's own terrain on which it moves better.
We'll never know the relationship between the two of them, and I don't care as long as they keep fixing the game.
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 05:06 PM |
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Quote:
Concerning the terrain it doesn't matter who is making who do it as long as we get it in the game.
That's one of the basic tenets of the game, each faction has it's own terrain on which it moves better.
We'll never know the relationship between the two of them, and I don't care as long as they keep fixing the game.
This is offtopic, but I made this topic i can do it! ... But what would that terrain just look like? Orcs = desert or more wasteland . but i seem to compare those...
____________
Don't walk behind me; I may not
lead. Don't walk in front of me;
I may not follow. Just walk
beside me and be my friend.
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PhoenixReborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted June 05, 2007 10:28 PM |
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I'm not sure what the terrain would be, but I did think of something that indicates planning.
Until the latest patches, Necromancy was based around skeleton archers. The change into raising any creature works better with alternative upgrades, especially now that we know the skeleton alternative is a walker.
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Gnoll_Mage
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted June 05, 2007 11:58 PM |
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Quote:
On the bottom line, I'm not really sure it matters, and sometimes I think it would be really nice for people to have a bit more positive look on the whole project, rather than questioning and bickering at the developer's feelings all the time. So what if they called it Arch Demon and I think it's a lame name, doesn't really affect gameplay, and in the end, that's what's more important.
About the Orcs, like I stated otherwise, it seems to me that Nival changed their original plans on that. The fans wanted Orcs really badly, however, and the headed our wishes - we should be happy that they listen to us. If they got the idea for third upgrades from some fans, well, so much for the better. I know that there are some things I would really like to see in the game myself, probably even more than alternative upgrades, but that's kind of besides the point.
And about the endless discussion with the game release ... Christ, what would we rather have, them releasing the game with some bugs and then doing patches when they are reported, or them holding back the game for another year to search for more bugs and game-test it? I know that I myself appreciate the fact that they did not hold back the game - even with the bugs - and I'm quite impressed with, if not the frequency of the patches, then the extend of the patches [complete changes in Necromancy, for instance].
Sorry for the rant ...
 
It often annoys me to see people whining about the release of the game - I can't help but put myself in the position of the developers, and thinking that I wouldn't be best pleased to see continual complaints about what I've spent time doing. I know they're doing this to make money, but, well, they are human after all. I suspect Ubival are a little impulsive and are listening to us a little - the Orc example is a good demonstration of this.
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Moonlith
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
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posted June 06, 2007 12:15 AM |
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The way I figure it goes, is that Ubisoft is the one caring for the profits it will make. If a concept doesn't seem profitable, it aint gonna happen. Hence why you see so many "Succes formulas" these days like Lord of the Rings or Spiderman and that kind of crap; they know it will sell, ensured profits.
The developers themselves probably put their hearts into it and do care about the quality, not as much the profits as they will just get their paychecks, not the profits.
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feluniozbunio
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted June 06, 2007 12:29 AM |
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Actually i agree with ubisoft .. why do we need additional terrain type when we got already many of them.. they could use their time better than working on new terrain
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted June 06, 2007 03:08 AM |
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They're already doing that.
I wonder what else they have instore for us...
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted June 06, 2007 10:32 AM |
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Quote:
the Orc example is a good demonstration of this.
No one seem to see my point here? Do they - The orcs could not have been a impulsive idea - Dark Messiah! PLAY IT! Learn the future story... An you will learn that Orcs can NOT have been an impulsive idea! I think they played us around!
____________
Don't walk behind me; I may not
lead. Don't walk in front of me;
I may not follow. Just walk
beside me and be my friend.
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