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| Thread: Why god??? Why the disastors???!!!! |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted March 01, 2008 04:36 PM |
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Edited by Celfious at 16:46, 01 Mar 2008.
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Why god??? Why the disastors???!!!!
Just think about this for a moment, and expound, expell, or e... elope 
Someone once asked me to explain to the survivors of a tsunami, that there is a God. A month or two later I found myself asking a question.
I was pondering... Why? How could there be a God with pain, suffering, agony, addiction, disease, destructive technology (bear in mind the destructive weapons are humanity made) natural disastor, animals and insects eating eachother, humans eating the defenceless, ect??? WHY?
Suddenly from the noises in the room (real people were there talking) I heard "CANE AND ABEL" I do not believe in them personaly, but their story held the awnser to the question "why god?"
It was then, like in instant flash a packed meaningful realization came to mind. Free will, human instinct, and the will of man (similar things where not the same) are all imperfect. We are destined to mess up from time to time, create factions, power struggles, wars, defences, organize, ect. We are destined to mess up but dont worry we are destined to get back on our feet too, as individuals.
But look. Just look at the humanity half of reality. IT...IS...VERY...IMPERFECT! How could something so imperfect fit into a perfect "flawless" world??
At the same time, the world without humanities doings, is far more perfect than we are, so all in all we fit into this organized mess of a world.
PS. This is not my invented realization. This is a realization I had that was already made available to anyone, and has probably been accessed before, before me.
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What are you up to
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted March 03, 2008 04:15 PM |
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What, am I missing something? lol God wouldnt put such imperfection in a perfect world until we knew better or something. It's simple. I guess no one cares what I had to say thats cool.
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted March 03, 2008 04:34 PM |
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That's just life for you. It's not perfect and never will be perfect. Bad things happen to good people, often for no good reason at all.
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The giant has awakened
You drink my blood and drown
Wrath and raving I will not stop
You'll never take me down
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 03, 2008 05:18 PM |
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1. Technology isn't a bad thing... ever looked at it the other way arround? Nothing has made our lifes more convenient and comfortable than technology.
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Free will, human instinct, and the will of man (similar things where not the same) are all imperfect.
Are you kiding me?? You are 25... you should have had many experiences with humans by now right? And you get this basic fact about humans..... now?!?
The way I see it it's really simple.
Humans are weak by nature. But we have the gift of reasoning, thus comes the responsibility to rise above our animal instincts (which make us imperfect) because we have the power to do so. But it is easier to live by your instincts than by your reason therefore 90% (if not much more) of humanity is weak. That is not really a bad thing but they just don't use their reason as they are supposed to. They just use their reason to satisfy their insticts which makes them even more "animalish" (is there an adjective for animal...?) than animals (I'm copying Mephistopheles from Goethes Faust here incase anyone noticed).
Hehee... Don't know what took you so long to realize that humans are faaaar far away from being "strong" (or whatever you would call the oposite of imperfect).
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"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted March 03, 2008 05:22 PM |
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Just think about this for a moment, and expound, expell, or e... elope
You would be better off if you put one of those 'E's instead of the 'O' in disastors...
See, mate, it seems what you're suffering from is one of the most common needs of mankind - the need to believe. You want to believe in a God, but there's a lot of what at least seems as irrationalities. On the other side, you don't want to believe that there ISN'T a God, cause you feel one deep inside you.
So, unable to do anything else about it, you think. And you come up with explanations. Just like me, or any of those people who participate in that "I gave up on believing in God" thread, or every curious man from the dawn of time.
It's completely natural and rational. All the explanations you think up. And many others. Yet we can't know it for sure.
But, until mankind finds an explanation (if it ever does), we think and believe.  That's all we can do for now.
Cheers.
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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violent_flower
Promising
Supreme Hero
Almost there.
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posted March 03, 2008 05:33 PM |
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It depends on why you are forcing yourself to believe. Your desire is to do what? Have faith that you will pass through this life and onto a better one? One where your God coddles your fears, wants, and desires? Or are you just trying to figure out why you are here and the only sane thing is to believe we have purpose beyond the animalist way we live our lives?
Less time trying to figure it all out and more time enjoying life and just being a good person would suit you better….
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Learn how to duck and weave because I will throw truth at you all day!
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 03, 2008 05:57 PM |
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You want to believe in a God, but there's a lot of what at least seems as irrationalities.
For once without being ironic nor sarcastic: where is the problem?
Honestly I don't see how all the "irrationalities" are ways to rationally make you stop beliveing in god (or anything else). All the "irrationalities" on earth are caused by humans. And as Celfious has just figured out humans are the cause for all those (simply because they are human). I see how they can convince you to stop beliveing in god but I don't see how they rationaly or irationaly should make you stop (Somehow that was the point I saw in your post I guess I missunderstood or didn't I?).
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Less time trying to figure it all out and more time enjoying life and just being a good person would suit you better….
How does "figureing it all out" conflict with being a good person ? Besides there is nothing wrong with "figureing it all out" in the end someone may come to a conclusion that makes him happy. And that would be a good thing wouldn't it? Besides it is far better to spend time "figureing it all out" by yourself than just buying something someone has already done for you. From my point of view Celfious is doing this exactly the right way.
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"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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violent_flower
Promising
Supreme Hero
Almost there.
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posted March 03, 2008 06:20 PM |
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He if that is what floats your Ark then by all means jump on the bandwagon and float down your river of hope...K? My point is that some people are just always trying to figure it out and analyze everything to death. Why not just enjoy?? Your scouring faces and need to jump on me is really cute.. Just don’t jump to hard, I’m feeling a bit green today… Alrighty then!!!
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Learn how to duck and weave because I will throw truth at you all day!
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 03, 2008 06:28 PM |
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Your scouring faces and need to jump on me is really cute.. !!!
I by all means do not want to jump on you. Your opinion simply conflicts with mine and all I'm doing is presenting mine point of view on the same subject. I thougth we were discussing not jumping on each other...
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My point is that some people are just always trying to figure it out and analyze everything to death. Why not just enjoy??
Because all that analyzeing may actually get you somewhere?? And that result may be helpful to you and maybe even to other people?
There is nothing wrong with simply enjoying yourself but analyzing may actually solve problems.
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"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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violent_flower
Promising
Supreme Hero
Almost there.
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posted March 03, 2008 06:39 PM |
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Because all that analyzeing may actually get you somewhere?? And that result may be helpful to you and maybe even to other people?
There is nothing wrong with simply enjoying yourself but analyzing may actually solve problems.Quote:
Analyzing the reality of your problems is not what I'm referring to. But analyzing what will happen to you when you die, is there a God or not or the thousands of other biblical questions gets you the same answer every time.. WE WON'T KNOW UNTIL WE KICK THE BUCKET!!. People have been studying this for freaking ever!!! So the constant threads of whether you believe or not or why are we here. Who cares just live life to the fullest...
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Learn how to duck and weave because I will throw truth at you all day!
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted March 03, 2008 06:45 PM |
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If you don't care, why are you so bothered that people study and hypothesize about the unknown?
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The giant has awakened
You drink my blood and drown
Wrath and raving I will not stop
You'll never take me down
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Orodruin
Adventuring Hero
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posted March 03, 2008 07:14 PM |
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I was pondering... Why? How could there be a God with pain, suffering, agony, addiction, disease, destructive technology (bear in mind the destructive weapons are humanity made) natural disastor, animals and insects eating eachother, humans eating the defenceless, ect??? WHY?
So how should it be than, should every animal, plant, fungus, bacteria etcetera on earth reproduce themselves freely, with no kind of control or harmony? It would be a disaster!!!! Who are we to judge the so called "imperfections" of nature, its self organizing system must be kept this way in order to maintain equlibrium, even when changing. Besides, we are nothing but microscopic dots in the universe and we dream to know at least 1/1000000000 of its imensity.
Now, a lot PERSONALLY speaking, i don't think there is a god that wants us to do good things ecetera etcetera, there is, indeed, many unexplainable things out there, and many peoples and civilizations created divine beings and/or myths to clear them. Of course, i'm not saying christians or muslims or anyone are mistaken, they all have versions to fullfill their doubts, which can not be proven wrong or right, another reason for me to not just "pick up" one to worship. About the post again, it would be nice not to destroy a forest in order to build tower and stand up on its celling saying: look, it's nature, right below us! Instead we should be living inside the forest, trying to figure out all we can, including ourselves.
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted March 03, 2008 07:39 PM |
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@Azagal
Oh, it can't make you stop believing in God. Far from that. But it does make you wonder, doesn't it? That was my point.
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Your scouring faces and need to jump on me is really cute..
Well that could've been misinterpreted in a fun way
But that's for the "Try not to talk about sex" topic.
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WE WON'T KNOW UNTIL WE KICK THE BUCKET!!
And perhaps not even then That's what makes it fun. And stops people from shooting themselves just to see what's on the other side
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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violent_flower
Promising
Supreme Hero
Almost there.
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posted March 03, 2008 08:09 PM |
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If you don't care, why are you so bothered that people study and hypothesize about the unknown? Quote:
Not bothered my dear, just don’t get the obsession is all…. It is like saying what if I get hit by a bus tomorrow, so what if??? Flipidy dodah!!
BAK you dirty boy you!!!
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Learn how to duck and weave because I will throw truth at you all day!
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted March 03, 2008 09:46 PM |
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I always knew humans were imperfect, and I always knew the world was imperfect but I never put them together as the awsner to "why god, do these bad things happen naturally (and unaturaly)?"
And in my book, it is spelled, disastor
And for the deeper questions, I'll get back to you tommorow.
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What are you up to
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ismail222
Known Hero
The Cataclysm
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posted March 03, 2008 09:50 PM |
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Would life really be called life if there were nothing wrong with it??
We would then be a bunch of happy people with the most boring *life* ever,life is all about being hard and catastrophic.
And after all,almost all the disasters are man made,with technology nature gets ruined and for what...for the sake of making just another useless piece of killing.
And I think many would agree that the most disastrous thing is war.And war is so weird,I mean c'mon even animals which has no brains don't do that to their own kind,IMO people should be refered to as which in that case cause of the mindless killing and the inhumanity that the humans lack greatly.
And I'm not saying that all people are bad there are of course good people who make life better,only the mindless people any race or any genre or any faith it doesn't matter,are the people who make life bad and painful.
But after all,what can ya do but hope for a better world??This is life and it must be lived one way or another untill the final peace of death.(that's pleasent  )
Anyway,that's just my opinion and I mean no offence to anyone .
____________
Ppl griveing,Ppl
Deceving,Ppl lying,Ppl dying
One Word : Life
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted March 03, 2008 10:00 PM |
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And in my book, it is spelled, disastor
Lol.
Well, can't argue with My Book
Another fun fact about humanity, other people's grammar or rules are utterly powerless whenever someone mentions My Book. Apparently, the thing most commonly referred to as My Book is a powerful ancient artifact that allows people to surpass any rule in existence by quoting it.
The Bible is NOTHING compared to it. "Not in my book..."
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted March 03, 2008 10:14 PM |
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Reading a little about irrationality, and rationality, and beliefe in god or no god, is it possible to believe neither? But we could probably leave the belief in God debate in the "I gave up believing in God" thread.
I read some more of the thread, and saw something about over analizing. Over analizing (however its spelled) brought me to two known 99.9% possible facts about the existance of a God (God I mean in a very broad vuage sense as it could be one, many, or one and many, or something else) and this thread is the result of fact #2
(The following is rambunctious and scrambled read only with vigulance [if those are the proper words])
The main point I came up with (which was not my invention) incase anyone was confused. The reason bad things happen is because it wouldnt make sense for imperfections like us humans, to be in a perfect world. This is a decent explanation... I mean, can you imagine "us" in a world where there was hunger for only fruits, animals never ate eachother, cold was tolerable, hot aswell, no tornadoes of devestation, ect... There is a lot of unknown which was explained to me by this foundation of belief. I concede there may be no god, but thats another thread, and my honest appraisal of the situation is that its a .00000000000001 chance reality would turn out as is from a godless variety of existance, but the universe could be 9999999 times as large as that chance too.
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What are you up to
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gallow
Bad-mannered
Known Hero
Avenger
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posted March 04, 2008 12:02 AM |
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[ there is, indeed, many unexplainable things out there, and many peoples and civilizations created divine beings and/or myths to clear them.
yes,really there is many things that are hided from our eyes,thats true,for example secret societys,then maybe area51,they have very good secrets of course perhaps shocking for the society or revelations that could be of great help but of great lose to them(money,business etc)There is in Toledo,Spain a cave/room,that was built by king solomon of israel around 1030 b.c and inside is deposited treasures from those times,a table that he built and information contained in scrolls,a spanish king named Rodrigo once got inside,of course he sent a group of ppl to make the entrance to it,and all those who came in escaped from the cave horrorized,it was a great noice,like something smashing the floor some statue fell,and it says the king saw in a scroll the moor invasion to spain,after that he left and covered it again,so in a certain day in the future would be opened again.In Toledo is know for the many tunnels it has underground ,but the most surprising is that the local goberment dont want to make it public,they show the turistic part of it,not all,some walls are taped by concrete,not for the public.I know 2 persons,archeologist that are working in this,they discovered a possible entrance to it only bad thing is that they need some money to finance the project but they are in that(already one had problems with the local gob. because he wanted to make it public),hope they find it out the name of that cave is in spanish:Cueva de hercules or Hercule´s cave,originally in really called solomon´s cave,and believe there is a lot more things that one day will come to the light and for the people  actually i cant type all here,it is very extense info,anyway he always use this passage:
"For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad." Luke 8:17
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ByteBandit
Promising
Famous Hero
Soul Merchant
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posted June 26, 2008 03:55 AM |
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You can't blame God for all the earthquakes, twisters, floods and so on. No. It's been happening on this planet for the last 65 Billion years or so. It's called planet evolution.
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