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| Thread: Heroes Specials Makeover | |
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Arcax
Promising
Famous Hero
Its quite hot inside...
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posted February 21, 2009 06:11 PM |
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Edited by Arcax at 16:53, 23 Feb 2009.
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Heroes Specials Makeover
Hero Specials
I would like to see in HoMM6 some improvements in hero specialties system. The Attack/Defense and in some cases Initiative/Health points bonuses in HoMM5 are fine but hero doesnt have much influence in that process, except the fact he only owns it. The process of making creature stronger is totally passive and there's no tactic included.
Here are my ideas:
1 General balance
Every faction will have minimum 5 "creature - specialised" heroes. Each of them will be specialised in different type of native creature(Without tier 6&7)
2 Hero specials makeover
The real thing. The hero after leveling up can decide if he wants to make an offensive oriented creature or defensive.We will have 4 domains for investing special, creature "experience points".
1st Domain - Aggression
Attack - For every 2 levels, hero will have an opportunity to improve Attack of creature by +1;
Damage - For every 10 levels, hero will have an opportunity to improve Damage outcome of creature by +20%(rounded at least to 1)
2nd Domain - Defiance
Defense - For every 2 levels, hero will have an opportunity to improve Defense of creature by +1;
Vitality - For every 10 levels, hero will have an opportunity to improve Health Points of creature by +10%
3rd Domain - Rapidity
Speed - For every 15 levels, hero hero will have an opportunity to improve Speed of creature by +1 or;
Initiative - For every 15 levels, hero will have an opportunity to improve Initiative of creature by +1
4th Domain - Ability
It will be more tricky.After every 10 levels hero will have an opportunity to implement a new ability for his creature. He will have an acces to a new special skill granting him "tutoring" his special creature an ability:
Preceptor - 2% chance to appear for every faction - The hero for every 10 levels can tutor his specialised creature 1 ability from a special list.
Perks for Preceptor:
Endurance Tutor  It unlocks extra skills for tutoring : Slow resitance, Stun Resistance, Weakening resistance
Berserk Tutor It unlocks extra skills for tutoring : Battlerage,Formation(attacking the nearby enemy when its attacked by ally - sth like Lizard Bite from HoMM5),Fierce Retaliation
Elemental Tutor It unlocks extra skills for tutoring : 50% resistance to Fire,Water,or Earth
Basic Preceptor - Hero can learn his creature a low-leveled skill like : No melee penalty,Bash,Assault
Advanced Perceptor - Hero can learn his creature a medium-leveled skill like : Crippling Wound, Regeneration,Dash
Expert Perceptor - Hero can learn his creature a high-leveled skill like : No range-penalty,Immune to mind control,Cleave
Where's the snag? The hero must face a creature(either by having it in army or fighting against it)with a skill from a special ability list to unlock it for his creature. Something like Sylvan's favoured enemy list.If the hero has some of the Preceptor perks, he can use them without meeting any creature equipped with abilities from "Tutor" perks.
Thanks to that system you can decide if your creature will be offensive or defensive oriented. After leveling up a special window will appear showing you what can you upgrade.For example:
Your hero achieved level 10
You have 1Point to improve Attack or Defense of your creature
You have 1Point to improve Damage or Vitality of your creature
Preceptor
You can learn your creature one of those abilities:
Rage,Fierce Retaliation,Assault,No melee penalty
The "Creature points" can stack. If you want to improve yor creature later, after deep medidation or before final battle.
I think it would be great to have such an element in HoMM6
To put it simple:
1 point to Attack/Defense - per every 2 levels
1 point to Damage/Vitality - per every 10 levels
1 point to Speed/Initiative - per every 15 levels
What's more the points gained from the more powerful levels like Vitality and Damage doesnt count as those low-leveled. Its like totally different class. So on level 10 we can put one point to Vitality, at the same time increasing the Attack... phew
I hope i decimated it a bit
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Ednaguy
Supreme Hero
My water just broke! No, wait.
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posted February 21, 2009 06:41 PM |
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Great idea 
But it would very easy get unbalanced when a lvl 1 creature gets +3 damage, so IMO you should use % instead of exact values.
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"Edna, there's a special, tiny, tiny place in hell, waiting just for you... "
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted February 21, 2009 09:22 PM |
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Awesome idea
And I agree with Edna, percentages are needed for damage and health.
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Arcax
Promising
Famous Hero
Its quite hot inside...
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posted February 21, 2009 10:25 PM |
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Thanks guys(and girls)
You're right Ill fix it
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veco
Legendary Hero
who am I?
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posted February 23, 2009 11:08 AM |
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Edited by veco at 11:09, 23 Feb 2009.
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It's adding a new layer of hero development and I like it
There probably wouls be some balance issues e.g.
I wouldn't take 50% one element resistance because others are way better. Maybe if it was 50% Magic proof I'd consider it.
Also I think Assault should be a medium-leveled skill and Regeneration a low-level one but those are details.
As aweosome as the idea is it would take a lot of effort implementing it in an interesting way and making it fairly balanced so it'll stay in the wishes list I suppose 
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none of my business.
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted February 23, 2009 11:11 AM |
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Great
Yet what about a fifth domain for moral and luck or so?
Like, every five levels you can grant your creature +1 moral/luck
And could a Preceptor also, instead of giving a new ability, remove a negative one (like Ice vulnerability or Cowardice)?
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Arcax
Promising
Famous Hero
Its quite hot inside...
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posted February 23, 2009 04:39 PM |
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Edited by Arcax at 18:27, 24 Mar 2009.
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@veco Ive made Perceptor in a great haste and maybe I was too careless adding those abilities but I have to agree on the point of assault. Double attacking, lucky hydras would be painful. On the other hand Perceptor is just a suggestion which will never be brought to life... or maybe(yeah in my dreams) when Nival is not in charge of HoMM6 who knows...
@jiriki - Luck & Morale as a new element of my system - why not? But note that it will mostly depend on Luck and Morale system in HoMM6 . For example :If the 5 points of luck wont be the maximum value of available luck giving you a chance of dealing double damage 50% of times, being at the same time the highest value available from skills, artifacts or map locations; the value of luck from the specialised hero will grant you a 60-100% chance to deal double damage and it will be sth like super luck... Maybe 100% will overdo a bit but 80% of Special-Hero-Luck would be sth imba new or maybe just average for heroes not familiar with luck (maybe Necros?)
About removing the non-wanted abilities... Never thought about it but does it will be really so important? There is really small amount of crappy abilities(in HoMM6-we will see)but creating a God-like unit without defects Maybe my system of implementing abilities will be based on swaping abilites and exchanging for example Cowardice for Cleave heh
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Nebdar
Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
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posted March 23, 2009 10:16 PM |
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Edited by Nebdar at 22:17, 23 Mar 2009.
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I was having an similar idea in my brain/imaginaton whatever 
The creatures gaining expirence, when they change their appearance also changes.... Differrent kind of armor and other items on them...
But back to the topic: there also should be at 20th level or so that you can undo your changes and reaarange your bonuses..(at 25th level you can do it everywhere (of course not in battles or maybe yes the methamorphosis activated ability once in a battle  )any time before that once per day) The appearance of the creatures should change with the new skills...(so you would be making an completly new unit )
At level 30-35th you can change the original stats and abilities to some point. And finnaly at 40th level or so and with the reintroduction with HOMM 4 Nobility/governor system you could remake as an governor of one town the dwelling so that your custom made creatures will dwell there, so that they could be used by any hero....(of course to change the stats/abilities of the creatures you would have to revisit the town)
And by the way great idea Arcax
Thanks for inspiration to post
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted March 23, 2009 11:55 PM |
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Seems to be an awfully complex and narrow solution to a non-existant problem, that could otherwise be solved by creature experience (with, of course, relevant heroes boosting a creature's per-battle experience gain). Besides, what do you do if you've tutored a small group of creatures and it merges with a larger group, does it still keep the bonuses?
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Nebdar
Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
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posted March 24, 2009 12:14 AM |
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Of course th rest of bigger group would be tutored..
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted March 24, 2009 05:23 AM |
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This is where the whole thing runs into problems though, as opposed to straight stack experience.
It makes no sense for creatures to lose those extra stats and abilities when they're moved away from the hero, yet if they don't lose them and they're joined with another stack of the same creatures... At some point you're going to have to do something that either seems unrealistic and stupid, or else is overpowering.
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Arcax
Promising
Famous Hero
Its quite hot inside...
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posted March 24, 2009 06:27 PM |
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Quote:
The creatures gaining expirence, when they change their appearance also changes...
Thought about it several times but its a total rip off from Disciples dont you think?
Quote:
But back to the topic: there also should be at 20th level or so that you can undo your changes and reaarange your bonuses..(at 25th level you can do it everywhere (of course not in battles or maybe yes the methamorphosis activated ability once in a battle )any time before that once per day) The appearance of the creatures should change with the new skills...(so you would be making an completly new unit )
Well why not? Its maybe too complex but maybe it'll come with expansion to HoMM6. Creatures and Skills - Expansion Pack
Quote:
At level 30-35th you can change the original stats and abilities to some point. And finnaly at 40th level or so and with the reintroduction with HOMM 4 Nobility/governor system you could remake as an governor of one town the dwelling so that your custom made creatures will dwell there, so that they could be used by any hero....(of course to change the stats/abilities of the creatures you would have to revisit the town)
Oh my poor head... I dont think that at level 30 or 40 you will really care about your creature that much(Im not even mentioning that level 40 will be quite impossible to achieve...)
Quote:
And by the way great idea Arcax
Thanks for inspiration to post
Your welcome Im glad to hear
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