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| Thread: Does the American left want a dictatorship? | |
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted July 28, 2011 08:14 AM |
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Does the American left want a dictatorship?
Does the American left want a dictatorship? Check out the applause and encouragement the crowd gives Obama when he says he is tempted to ignore Congress and the Constitution and do his own thing.
Clicky
The checks and balances in the Constitution are there for a reason. The founding fathers knew government has a tendency to grab all the power it can get and oppress the people. The Congress has the power of the purse and the presidency needs to respect that. For a president even in jest to say he is tempted to take dictatorial actions is frightening.
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Warmonger
Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
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posted July 28, 2011 08:30 AM |
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USA is probably the only country with the dominating role of president, who isn't a dictator at the same time. I see no threat here.
On the other hand, they ridiculous argument about finances shows huge irresponsibility. It's suprising how USA goverment leads to bankrupcy with such ease - and it will affect the entire world, unfortunatelly.
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Insanity
Known Hero
Brain cells killa
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posted July 28, 2011 11:57 AM |
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Edited by Insanity at 11:58, 28 Jul 2011.
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dictatorship ? u make it sound like american congress is selected by the peepz and isnt a joke anyway ? LOLzzz, good for obama
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shyranis
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted July 28, 2011 12:15 PM |
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George W. Bush had also said he wanted to be a dictator.
Many Presidents have echoed similar sentiments.
It's not a left or right thing, it's a power trip among the nation's figurehead, nothing more.
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Darkshadow
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Cerise Princess
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posted July 28, 2011 12:17 PM |
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Quote:
George W. Bush had also said he wanted to be a dictator.
Many Presidents have echoed similar sentiments.
It's not a left or right thing, it's a power trip among the nation's figurehead, nothing more.
GW Bush also said a few times how he was a "war president"
And the GOP was all like "HELL YEAH WE GONNA HAVE US SOME WAR!"
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted July 28, 2011 01:27 PM |
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Obama wasn't being cereal.
For the record, neither was George Bush.
President's don't need to be cereal all the time.
Lettuce be realtors here Elodin: of course being a dictator has a tempting aspect to it. He was just saying that to demonstrate a point.
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Shyranis
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted July 28, 2011 02:40 PM |
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Edited by Shyranis at 14:41, 28 Jul 2011.
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Glenn Beck actually reminds me a lot of Alex Jones. Except Alex Jones at least doesn't ignore and overhypes the crazy stuff from both parties rather than being so partisan and only hyping Democrats or (very rarely) Republicans that agree with democrats for a moment or two. Interesting but I'm not one of those wide eyed types that would really try and listen to that stuff as there really is a bit of exaggeration going into it to make people look worse.
Fox never would touch Alex Jones with a 10 mile pole while Bush was in office, but after Obama came to office suddenly he was invited to speak fairly often against the President and his policies.
Interesting huh?
Here's Alex's site which from the handful of times I've seen it has always been critical of whoever is in power at the time mostly but also takes any weird stuff said by any party member, government agency or powerful person and blows it up. He also throws in whatever other weird stuff he can find so people can get angry about them, like "Genetic Genocide: Humanity’s Greatest Threat" or "Jackson Lee: Let’s ‘Have a Hearing on Right-Wing Extremists, Ideologues’" or "Obama to Approve ‘Al-Qaeda Embassy’ in Washington"
With Glenn the accusations are always "Liberal Media/Leftists/Marxist/People I disagree with, does crazy thing that you should get angry about". "New leftist idea: give fat kids to government" Or its all some sort of conspiracy against US Conservatives like "Norway tragedy: media blames U.S. conservatives" or "Media quick to call shooter a ‘right wing, Christian extremist’" meanwhile accusing the teenagers shot and killed of being like the Hitler Youth.
That being said, I give Glenn Beck and Alex Jones the respect they deserve. I respect them for standing up for what they believe is right, but I don't exactly agree with them in many ways.
In Glenn, I see many of the same traits and the same manner of alarmism as Alex. Thus I honestly tend to ignore a lot of what he says unless it's to determine if he really said something some way or not. Because I rarely have time to actually read or listen to what he actually says, I also ignore any smears directed at him over his use of words. Though clearly, that doesn't stop him from doing the same to other people as he has done over many years. As the monolithic corporate media as a whole has done over the years.
As I say, this isn't really a problem of "left and right" but more of a problem with a pretend left and right governing as it always has. That's the stupid thing about politics though, so many people follow both of these parties as though they were the God's honest truth and enrich people who cater to their half of the divided masses. I don't blame Glenn for picking one side and sticking to it. It's been a sound business plan and gotten him very rich. More power to him for that.
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del_diablo
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Manifest
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posted July 28, 2011 03:51 PM |
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"American Left"? Last time I checked Obama was a Democrat, or a fascist by the European standards.
But that is irrelevant trivialities.
70-80% of the defence budget can be cut, without even touching the personel stationed, and wikipedia states $685.1 billion as the 2010 "cost".
Byt cutting 300-400 billion of that, you suddenly have some money to get rid of the dept.
And then to the next issue: Taxes. By increasing the taxes on the rich population, Obama can get another several hundred billions out of thin air, and it won't even affect the economy.
Wikipedia also cites that the debt is "$14.46 trillion", which means that by doing the army cut(that would just hit research) and increasing the taxes Obama would have gotten rid of the debt in a few years years.
But why does Obama then want "a bit of dictatorish powers"?
The democrats cave in the the Republicans if they so much as say "No, we don't like that".
And the Republicans also uses the entire "we can default on the national debt" as a threat, which is a crime. Nevermind that perhaps half othe Democrats also like to use it as a threat.
Obama has not gotten what he wanted of his healthcare reform trough either.
And then we got senators bribing each other and adding large insane earmarks to bills(backscratching they call it?).
He has the choice of vetoing entire bills, or letting the corruption pass. He has no real power beyond being a galleon figure.
He can't even start a general corruption search against the entire Senate and Congress! It is something essential, and he is not even allowed.
Random citizens are not allowed to do that either.
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Azagal
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Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted July 28, 2011 04:43 PM |
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Quote:
Last time I checked Obama was a Democrat, or a fascist by the European standards.
Excuse me? Are we living in the same Europe?
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted July 28, 2011 04:53 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Last time I checked Obama was a Democrat, or a fascist by the European standards.
Excuse me? Are we living in the same Europe?
Yes.
Just place the democrats on your countries political line, and you will only find that the fascists and the rightwing nutjobs in the parties that stand roughly on the same place.
It is just that you do not think about it.
Then again: Europa is huge.
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Azagal
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Smooth Snake
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posted July 28, 2011 06:32 PM |
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Edited by Azagal at 18:57, 28 Jul 2011.
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Quote:
Just place the democrats on your countries political line, and you will only find that the fascists and the rightwing nutjobs in the parties that stand roughly on the same place.
Unfortunately I don't understand what you're trying to say. Care to elaborate? I'm half German and there is an actually facist party in my country while the majority of the parties here are central with left or right orientations. I like to believe I know what makes a facist party facist and Obama is by no stretch of the imagination a facist. You have to be bit more spefic than "but he is, put it on a line". You were afterall talking about European standards.
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del_diablo
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Manifest
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posted July 28, 2011 06:43 PM |
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This is all the Norwegian political parties who actually has managed to get seats after elections.
A classic "leftwing, rightwing" sliding scale.
FRP is our "rightwing party", and we usually consider them fascists.
BUT both the democrats and the republicans would be more to the Right than FRP.
And that is what I mean.
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The_Gootch
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Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
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posted July 29, 2011 05:23 AM |
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I think the reader comments were very instructive regarding the type of people who take Glenn Beck seriously.
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Miru
Supreme Hero
A leaf in the river of time
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posted July 29, 2011 05:35 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Just place the democrats on your countries political line, and you will only find that the fascists and the rightwing nutjobs in the parties that stand roughly on the same place.
Unfortunately I don't understand what you're trying to say. Care to elaborate? I'm half German and there is an actually facist party in my country while the majority of the parties here are central with left or right orientations. I like to believe I know what makes a facist party facist and Obama is by no stretch of the imagination a facist. You have to be bit more spefic than "but he is, put it on a line". You were afterall talking about European standards.
He means that the European far right wing is equatable to the American left wing; the European left wing is flaming liberal by American standards and the American right wing is Laissez-Faire by European standards.
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shyranis
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted July 29, 2011 10:35 AM |
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Edited by shyranis at 16:53, 29 Jul 2011.
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And then there is Canada... stuck in the middle.
Edit: Also Elodin, I believe the American Far-Left and the American Far-Right both want benevolent dictators that can not possibly exist. As neither of those sides can possibly stand to talk rationally to people on either side of the isle and eventually resort to violence when disenfranchised long enough.
You've even admitted wanting a benevolent dictator at some point, right?
This story is really just about taking words echoes by nearly every president and trying to make it seem like it's unique to this particular one.
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Elodin
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posted July 29, 2011 05:35 PM |
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Quote:
Edit: Also Elodin, I believe the American Far-Left and the American Far-Right both want benevolent dictators that can not possibly exist. As neither of those sides can possibly stand to talk rationally to people on either side of the isle and eventually resort to violence when disenfranchised long enough.
You've even admitted wanting a benevolent dictator at some point, right?
No, I've not said I want a dictator. I've always warned against the government's tendency to grab power and I've always said I want a small government with limited power. Like the Constitution set up. Unfortunately the Constitution is pretty much ignored by activist judges.
I'm unaware of any conservative who wants a dictator. Conservatives want a return to the Constitution.
Also, from what I have seen over the years conservative protests tend to be peaceful. It is the left that has a tendency to get violent in protests as in overturning cars and burning buildings.
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