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Salamandre
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posted February 27, 2018 12:18 PM |
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@artu,
And this is how every discussion about guns or immigration turns out, Trump. I linked you that his approval ratings are better than May, Merkel and Macron, while all those 3 are painted as saviors of our universe and Trump is painted as an idiot. Approval/disapproval ratings = people with brains. For each link I will find about Trump having better employment rate you will find a link proving is not true, if we take in consideration other parameters, and this is why I specified "politics" at the end of my post.
Because this is how it works, one side says one thing, the other side is supposed to counter it by all means, and for the normal viewer, to find the absolute truth behind those poles becomes an endless labyrinth. That's why is reality which should be considered, and from what we observe, America is internationally (Isis?) and economically not doing worse under Trump, and we were told it will be a disaster, the end of the world.
Beside, I am myself kinda disappointing about him, as on the core issues I supported him - build the wall and deport all illegals, he is backing. Both actions were however symbolic about which direction our world is going to.
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JollyJoker
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posted February 27, 2018 12:27 PM |
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted February 27, 2018 12:34 PM |
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FiveThirtyEight, sometimes referred to as 538, is a website that focuses on opinion poll analysis, politics, economics, and sports blogging.
"On the eve of the 2016 election their forecast gave Hillary Clinton a 71% chance of winning and Donald Trump a 29% chance"
Great polling site, wonder where they pick the viewers, probably directly from democrat house.
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fred79
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posted February 27, 2018 12:42 PM |
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Edited by fred79 at 12:47, 27 Feb 2018.
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JollyJoker said:
I suppose, you'll have to teach us at gunpoint, otherwise we'll stubbornly reject your pearls of wisdom.
i wouldn't expect anything less from an anti-gun advocate. to you, ALL gun owners are criminals or spree killers waiting for their turn. it's utterly asinine to think that. there are literally MILLIONS of gun owners who AREN'T a danger to society, but only to people wanting to harm them or their loved ones(as ANY civilized individual SHOULD be).
your comment only reveals your absolute lack of understanding of even this basic fact.
@ all anti-gun advocates: understand, that your feelings on this matter changes absolutely nothing. the u.s. will have guns as long as it stands. the sooner you realize and find a way to COPE with this, the sooner you can move on to actually HELP SOLVING the issue of armed attacks. which countries with civilians who DON'T have access to guns, are facing, as well.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted February 27, 2018 12:55 PM |
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Edited by Minion at 13:02, 27 Feb 2018.
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@Sal. Sorry but normally when you win the popular vote by a large margin it actually means you win the election. In a normal democracy that is 
They did get the popular vote rather close to right:
Hillary Clinton 48.5% (48.2% was what happened)
Donald Trump 44.9% (46.1 was what happened)
@fred. lol it is amusing you always attack some red herring about people who want to get rid of all guns. It is unbelievable. I haven't met a single person like that on this forum at least, not that I remember meeting one anywhere else either.
So dear pro-gun people, no matter how much you want automatic rifles in the hands of kids, IT WILL END SOME DAY. People in america are fed up with these weapons that kill people so easily, 90% want tighter regulations!!!! You can be as blindly pro-gun and rant and rave all week long but times will eventually change. Mark my words. 
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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Zenofex
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Kreegan-atheist
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posted February 27, 2018 01:03 PM |
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Quote:
ALL gun owners are criminals or spree killers waiting for their turn. it's utterly asinine to think that.
Don't you think that even 1 in 1000 is too many?
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fred79
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted February 27, 2018 01:07 PM |
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Zenofex said:
Don't you think that even 1 in 1000 is too many?
1 in 100 people are going to do what they want, regardless. "too many" is a symptom of society. the more people you have, the more issues that those people bring are going to exist. that's common sense.
@ minion: ok. whatever you say, boss. lol.
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Zenofex
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Kreegan-atheist
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posted February 27, 2018 01:10 PM |
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In this case you should have approximately 5 times more mass shootings in China but that's not the case, is it?
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fred79
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posted February 27, 2018 01:13 PM |
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china is a completely different culture and environment; those people are RULED OVER by their government, and they aren't allowed to own firearms(guess why one makes the other possible?). that's not even close to a decent rebuttal, man.
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JollyJoker
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posted February 27, 2018 01:14 PM |
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Salamandre said:
FiveThirtyEight, sometimes referred to as 538, is a website that focuses on opinion poll analysis, politics, economics, and sports blogging.
"On the eve of the 2016 election their forecast gave Hillary Clinton a 71% chance of winning and Donald Trump a 29% chance"
Great polling site, wonder where they pick the viewers, probably directly from democrat house.
Keep in mind that they base PREDICTIONS on the evaluation of polls made by OTHERS (and in this table the polls are listed).
But it's like talking against a wall here - I mean, if you were pro Trump because he peomised to build a wall along the Mexican border, you just should take a look at the BERLIN wall which has had a length of 168 Kilometers. In its 28 years of existance, over 5.000 flights were managed, although the wall was heavily guarded.
The US-Mexican border is 3150 Kilometers in length or 19 times as long.
Plus - there is the coast line...
I mean, did you stop thinking or something? A WALL? Christ...
They can't even keep their PRISON walls tight.
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fred79
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posted February 27, 2018 01:19 PM |
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JollyJoker said:
They can't even keep their PRISON walls tight.
are you referring to the u.s.? and if so, wtf? this statement makes zero sense. you anti-gun guys' arguments and viewpoints are exceptionally... lost.
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted February 27, 2018 01:23 PM |
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fred79 said:
china is a completely different culture and environment; those people are RULED OVER by their government, and they aren't allowed to own firearms(guess why one makes the other possible?). that's not even close to a decent rebuttal, man.
We are talking about mass shootings, right? So, Chinese are not allowed to own firearms (not sure if this is true in all cases but that's beside the point) and they don't have mass shootings despite what you said that "it's a matter of quantity" or whatever. I really don't want to get myself involved in one of those ridiculous arguments how the average US citizen will protect his freedom from the government with shotguns vs. tanks and aircraft but ruling out the "oppression" factor the statistics is quite obvious - less guns per capita = less fatalities from madmen deciding to have fun or whatever.
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JollyJoker
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posted February 27, 2018 01:26 PM |
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Salamandre
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Wog refugee
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posted February 27, 2018 01:38 PM |
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Minion said:
@Sal. Sorry but normally when you win the popular vote by a large margin it actually means you win the election. In a normal democracy that is
I understand this argument, really.
But you should also understand the basic mechanics of how popular vote worked in this particular case: democrats promised to regularize 11 millions of illegal aliens, mostly Hispanic, and this is how you artificially raise your voting score by millions, you don't think that their families and communities will agree with the law advocating deportation, do you?
The question is how this vote represents America's interests, outside the electoral business and trickery. One side proposed fraud apology in order to gain support. In my book, this is not how normal democracy works, a democracy still have a constitution to respect.
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fred79
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posted February 27, 2018 01:39 PM |
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@ zeno: i've already explained everything you argue there and more, ad nauseam. i'd suggest to go back and read my posts so that you can get your answers there.
@ jj: despite our incarcerated population, only a MINISCULE percentage ever escape(and usually, they are rounded right back up). so i don't know where you're going with that. like nearly all of this bullcrap i've having to plow through from you guys. 
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JollyJoker
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posted February 27, 2018 02:32 PM |
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It's simple, actually. No wall will ever be impenetrable, no prison wall, not the Berlin wall, and especially no wall that would be 2.000 miles long. It just fills the pockets of the wall builders and increases the price to cross it; you know, greasing the palms of those who look the other way, building more elaborate means to cross, like long tunnels and so on.
That is, actually buying the idea of a border wall between the US and Mexico is... well, I don't want to offend anyone, but it's not something that speaks of having thought this through.
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fred79
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posted February 27, 2018 02:39 PM |
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/off-topic @ jj:
the only reason trump's even thinking of a wall, is because of the millions of illegal immigrants in this country. which is a real problem. which the democrats apparently think, all should be coddled with LEGAL taxpayer money. which frankly, any law-abiding american would take issue with.
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markkur
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Once upon a time
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posted February 27, 2018 03:11 PM |
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Zenofex said:
Well, for starters you could educate the kids that shooting at people is bad and arming the teachers who are supposed to explain them that will achieve exactly the opposite. It'll be like an alcoholic trying to teach his son not to drink.
That would be a form of common-sense and far too many parents want the State to keep taking up that responsibility. All around me (and I do not get around much ) parents of all ages, ignore the quality-time investment needed in being with their children (beyond telling them what they do wrong) and depend on electronics to teach and entertain their kids at home.
The breakdown of the American family has been horrific and it runs across all aspects of society.
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JollyJoker
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posted February 27, 2018 03:11 PM |
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fred79 said:
/off-topic @ jj:
the only reason trump's even thinking of a wall, is because of the millions of illegal immigrants in this country. which is a real problem. which the democrats apparently think, all should be coddled with LEGAL taxpayer money. which frankly, any law-abiding american would take issue with.
I was referring to Sal saying:
Quote:
Beside, I am myself kinda disappointing about him, as on the core issues I supported him - build the wall and deport all illegals, he is backing. Both actions were however symbolic about which direction our world is going to.
My problem is that "thinking of a wall" is already discrediting him in a big way - and obviously everyone BELIEVING or AGREEING with the notion.
I mean, ok, maybe Germany has the advantage of having seen a wall in action for 28 years - a wall, mind you, that was guarded HEAVILY with everything there is and which had a total length of some 110 miles, and was guarded on a normal day AT ANY TIME by 2.300 soldiers of the NVA (of a total contingent of 11.500), who had order to shoot everyone fleeing (and they did shoot killing 150-250 people in that time (no exact figures known)), but STILL over 5000 flights were successful.
Mexican border is 2.000 miles long - you really think you can pay 220.000 people guarding the border, 45.000 on duty all the time? And still not seal it off completely?
They will just dig tunnels, come by boat - or bribe gaurds.
It's a brain fart, and everyone wasting a second though on it, is extremely gullible.
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fred79
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posted February 27, 2018 03:28 PM |
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/still off-topic:
dude, billions of our tax dollars are in military spending and foreign aid alone. if we shifted that cash for a year or so to a wall; a wall could be built, no problem. the only REAL issue, is getting rid of all the illegal immigrants.
the tunnels that have been dug from mexico into the states, have been primarily for moving drugs, and not people. it's an ongoing struggle with our law enforcement, to keep illegals and illegal things out of the u.s. and it's an uphill battle, considering that many politicians only look at illegal immigrants as just another voting demographic to target.
at least a wall could be an important first step in dealing with the illegal immigration issue in the states. we have to do SOMETHING about it. democrats would have them all legalized, just to add more votes. in fact, i think it was actually proven that hillary had garnered a percentage of her votes from illegal immigrants. that's telling, right there, which side of the fence a law-abiding american should be on; regarding that issue.
but we're off-topic. we're most likely to BE off-topic, until the next shooting.
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This thread is pages long: 
