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| Thread: List of improvements (for Limbic) | |
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Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
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posted December 16, 2015 11:57 AM |
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Edited by Antalyan at 20:01, 16 Dec 2015.
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List of improvements (for Limbic)
Unlike some other people I met here I still believe in the future of H7. This game has a potential and has been improved a lot since the release. The biggest problem was surely not delaying the release date as we requested. We will not forgive Ubi it but it's just a time to move on. There is no reason why should catastrophical game release mean bad game in final.
From the things I have seen so far, I liked broui's list of improvements the most so I decided to past it here too (below), just for the case you have not seen it yet (and it is also much easier to reply to the parts of it here than in the official forum).
I would be very glad if gomaki could pass it to the developers responsible for the concrete parts and elements of the game. I think most of these things would help to improve this game a lot.
Broui's list of improvements - from MMH official forum (Going forward)
EDIT: improved according to comments and my personal wishes
1.) More artifact slots needed.
A. Pouch or Backpack (3 slots) There are those kinds of items (purse of gold, any resource producing item, etc) that do not need to be held all the time to be used. They ought to be in a pouch on the belt or simply active but in the backpack. I suggest 3 such pouches.
B. Rings. (2 slots) It shouldn't be a matter of a choice between a glove/gauntlet or a ring. A ring can be on the finger and the hand can still wear a glove. I'd suggest 2 being a max for the rings, but should be separate slots than the glove.
2.) Starting bonuses - In Heroes past, at the start of each map, we could choose between 3 starting bonuses - usually more creatures, resources or an artifact. No reason that should have gone away - especially in campaign and scenario maps
3.) "One or more Heroes still has movement. Are you sure you want to end your turn?" Please save us from boneheaded, accidental day ending by adding a popup confirmation regarding the end of the turn.
4.) Creature Specializations - Some creature specializations seem rather passive next to others. Some ideas below to help create a more unique creature:
Air Elementals. I like the strike and return but feel the lightening is missing. How about a small % chance of a lightening strike and even smaller chance of Chain Lightening upon melee attacks.
Kappas Add an upgraded Kappa that can propel itself across the screen as it did in H6.
Pixies and Dryads are too similar. Give Pixies the spell "Wasp Swarm" which does a small amount of damage, but can distract shooters for a round (so they can't shoot).
Sandstone Golem: They're mindless automotons, yes? Why not unlimited (or mostly) retaliation?
5.) Heropedia. Cool and necessary. Woefully incomplete. Need a good deal of game mechanics in there. I still don't have a handle on most of the faction specific skills (Meta Magic, Blood Fury, etc). A more in-depth description in the Heropedia (as well as other aspects of the game) would be welcome.
6.) Make Campaign and Scenario Heroes available once completed. Ultimately, the more heroes available, the better. H6 was actually best with this.
7.) Skill Wheel. - The biggest problem is it is too rigid/fixed. Fixed wheels almost make certain that campaigns won't be replayed much. Variety and random elements are among the most important features of any Heroes game. It would say that it is likely that few players old and new are really satisfied with the skill wheels as they are, though we may have a wide variety of suggestions to improve them. So, rather than rehash old arguments (no matter how valid) I'd like to offer a few guiding principles:
Every Hero Different: Every Hero should have a different set of skills available, none with the exact same 10. Solmyr proves this. Variety my friends. Variety. Even if two heroes share the same 10 skills, change from hero to hero what skills can be expert, master and gm. Carbon copies with a different portrait doesn't make a different hero.
Class Definition: Define the skills required for each class. Surely all 10 don't define a class. Which ones do? Example: A Paladin currently can GM Righteousness, Diplomacy, and Defense. They can Master Warfare, Light and Leadership and be Experts at Destiny, War Cries, Prime and Paragon. Which of these really define the Paladin? Surely not all of them. Prime?!? No. Not necessary. Why couldn't one Paladin be into Water instead and another be into Air? Nor is Destiny. Why not offence? Maybe it is those skills that they can become an expert in that are more flexible.
Randomness or Variety but not this - As is, this rigidity is denying us players a degree of variety unnecessarily which in turn limits the games lifespan in our collective hearts and minds. Many prefer a totally Random skilling system ala H5 (the pinnacle of that type). Others believe that leveling up that way was frustrating because it interfered too much with planning. Both arguments are valid and I know you tried to honor the "Random" people with a limited Random option, but it still keeps the rigidity. If it is your contention to stick with the skill wheel and not do a random system, then at least make each have a different set of 10 (you pick which are locked in and which can be mixed up).
Class Choice: The ability to choose for a hero between the three classes within their preferred area. Might Haven (for example) could choose between Vindicator, Paladin, and Knight. Perhaps it could be pre-chosen (at start up) or within the context of the game (whatever the minimum skills required to determine a class has to be chosen in the first level-ups) not unlike H4 but perhaps a bit less fluid.
Hero Creation. I've seen this one a few times - there are those that want the ability to create their own hero and skill wheel. Perhaps the appropriate place to do such a thing would be inside the editor.
Hero adjustment. New hero, "Ivor?" specializes in ballista but can only reach Expert in Warfare. Lethos does not have Earth Magic but poisons creatures? Another hero is fire magic specialized but can only reach Expert. These are but a few examples of heroes that need a little more thought put into them.
8.) Specializations. I don't think they're bad per se. I just think they could be more. Consider Edric. Dire wolf affinity so +1 per week. Maybe at level 5, the Dire wolves get +1 initiative, and Level 10 they get speed, and level 15, they get an attack bonus and so on. You get the idea. Leveling up is one of those essential experiences with Heroes. So adding to the fun of leveling up is a win for everyone.
9.) Increase the pool of Neutrals to include most (if not all) the Ashan creatures not represented yet. I've put that out there before. For many, you can simply recycle. For the H5 creatures you couldn't but still. More neutrals = more variety. Since september, more neutrals have been added and the game is richer for it. Keep them coming. But keep in mind that even reused units should have some interesting abilities.
12.) Hero Route Adjustments. If I set a runner hero to meet up with another hero to pass creatures, that runner's route ought to adjust as the other hero moves on. I shouldn't have to reset the route each turn.
13.) Health Bars Health bars for creatures on the battle fields and the ability to know how many we've lost.
15.) Battle maps. Obstacles (rocks, walls, etc) should change from battle to battle. (bridge should move, rock should move, etc. Improved but doesn't always work.
16.) Creatures on the Adventure map. Creatures should periodically respawn (week of insert-creature-type-here).
17.) Zoom. Adjust zoom so that we can get closer.
18.) Scale. Town size appears far too small on the adventure map. Trees appear too short.
Creature Scale. If a fan can tweek the scale of the creatures, so can you.
20.) Remove level cap. Totally unnecessary. If a campaign map requires it, put it in. Same with a scenario. Otherwise, there is no real reason to have it. It's limiting for the sake of limiting. 10 skills on the wheel to develop. Allow it. If the map warrants it, if it is achievable, then why artificially stop the leveling?
21) Melee for shooters. Shooters can`t engage in melee if I want them to.
22.) Subtitles for ALL voiced dialogue in the campaigns or otherwise.
23) Water: Engaging water in the Adventure map should be harder.
Boats. Heroes should use up all remaining movement when getting on a boat unless they have Navigation or an artifact that makes it happen. An advantage of the Nagas in H6 was that they didn't have that penalty.
Whirlpools should take some troops each time unless the Hero has Navigation, has a certain artifact or is a Naga.
25. In between turns. Allow us to acquire more info while AI has their turns so we can mentally plan.
26. ) Editor. - Make Editor more user friendly. It has improved some but not enough.
Editor still takes minutes to load.
Editor Events - In some previous Heroes map editors you had the ability to place these "Event Sphere" that when a hero passed over them, it would trigger an event - a message, a battle, new armies, armies abandon, the list goes on. Either provide such a feature OR if something of that is already there, make it easier to find and use.
27.) AI. Continue to improve AI intelligence. Why does the AI hire so many useless heroes? Seems to make short sighted decisions in their long range planning. Picking up resources does two things: 1.) Obviously it help the player build and buy. 2. It makes it harder for the enemy to build and buy. This is perhaps their biggest flaw. The logic seems to be the AI takes only what it thinks it needs and leaves the rest. Well, if it is leaving the rest, it makes it easier for me to grow my town and army.
28.) Kingdom Overview - An old feature that allowed you to call up one page in town that would show creature growth #s and income, etc.
30.) Hot Seat. A Clear sound fx for it being a new turn in Hot Seat.
31.) Map Selection. When choosing a map, we ought to be able to know if there is an underground/see it to the screen next to the surface shot.
32.) Neutral creature dwellings need to be more distinctive. The "tent" or whatever that holds Griffins and Gold Dragons (presumably at least loosely allied) should look considerably different than the Lilams camp or the Shantiri creatures camp.
37.) Efreet - Hate to state the obvious but the efreet aren't there. Please add.
39.) Sim turns - I suspect you developers have heard this a time or six.
40.) In Game Communications - H6 had a pretty good system whereby people could find each other and play and communicate together.
41.) Scoreboard - Most of the Heroes games have had a scoreboard. I'm not completely sure about what scores were based on, but it was fun to try to top myself.
And playing the game without any score indicator, it is like: you have finished, good bye.
**** A scoring system could and likely would lead to some kind of tournament. I has in the past. It's another aspect of the franchises history that has been lost.
42.) More options for over-powered enemies - It can become tedious to fight enemies that are too trivial. Please add more options for those. Base it on a percentage chance and/or attitude of the enemy.
A. Return the option that some will offer to join for free. It need not be the high percentage the Diplomacy skill was at in the Beta, but removing this one completely was too much.
B. A really overpowered neutral stack should offer to flee more often. Not having that option for a really trivial stack can be tedious and time consuming, frustrating the progress.
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natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
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posted December 16, 2015 12:04 PM |
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Hey he included my proposition for battle sites. Why omit it here?
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MagiCollector
Hired Hero
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posted December 16, 2015 01:03 PM |
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Many propositions are what most of us expected and still want.
Others are just your personal wishes. Understandable wishes mind you, but still sounds to me like a wishlist more than suggestions for improvement.
For example, the level cap removal and the custom hero creation are great things to be implemented in the main game without using mods. It'f simply add more variety and more long-term fun (especially for maps at heroic difficulty where you reach the level cap very fast).
But things like point 34 and 38 (but there are more) are just your "it'd be awesome if", and not something that would objectively improve or make the game more balanced.
Either way, i'd love to see this game improve as well, but i hope they actually have plans to do so, and not let us wait for the expansion in a year.
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted December 16, 2015 01:08 PM |
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i will repeat about regeneration!
make it a tier two spell and in its place put poison spray(smth that only the AI uses anyway)!!!
and of course it should NEVER resurrect!
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted December 16, 2015 01:31 PM |
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I will just comment on a few of the items in the list ...
Antalyan said:
3.) "One or more Heroes still has movement. Are you sure you want to end your turn?" Please save us from boneheaded, accidental day ending by adding a popup confirmation regarding the end of the turn.
Add a button to be able to "park" a Hero, so you don't get spammed every turn for all Heroes that you don't want to move.
Quote:
Every Hero Different: Every Hero should have a different set of skills available, none with the exact same 10. Solmyr proves this. Variety my friends. Variety. Even if two heroes share the same 10 skills, change from hero to hero what skills can be expert, master and gm. Carbon copies with a different portrait doesn't make a different hero.
This is a nightmare to balance. Sooner or later, people will figure out a hierarchy on which Heroes are more powerful than others. Furthermore, it requires rather in-depth knowledge of all existing Heroes to be able to pick the one that suits your playstyle.
Random skills is the only way to go, if you want to add variety.
Quote:
14.) Necropolis faction really needs a 2nd shooter.
It doesn't, really. Adding a second shooter makes it fairly identical to the other five factions. Faction diversity is a good thing, not bad.
Quote:
18.) Scale. Town size appears far too small on the adventure map. Trees appear too short.
No, scales are fine as they are. If anything, a number of objects are still too large. The Adventure Map should be a symbolic representation of the world, not a life-like one. Heroes 5 tried the life-like approach and it failed rather bad.
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The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted December 16, 2015 01:41 PM |
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Maurice said:
Quote:
14.) Necropolis faction really needs a 2nd shooter.
It doesn't, really. Adding a second shooter makes it fairly identical to the other five factions. Faction diversity is a good thing, not bad.
This was also my thought, this request seems to go completely against the call for "variety" a bit earlier in the list.
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What will happen now?
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natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
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posted December 16, 2015 02:26 PM |
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necropolis faction needs a serious nerf.
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The_Green_Drag
Supreme Hero
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posted December 16, 2015 03:03 PM |
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I'd also like to see this game succeed, I just believe it will not happen. If your a gamer that likes the little things in a game, or a heroes game, H7 got the little things wrong. If only the big stuff matters to you, well H7 got those wrong too. This game literally only has the visuals going for it, and that is 100% subjective.
But nevertheless, I'm gonna check down this list like santa clause.
1. 
2.  No More H6 Ideas What we need that was actually 'In Heroes Past' are maps that have buildings already made in their starting castles. Every freakin map you start on town level 0 with no units. I mean ffs limbic, Open up just one Nwc Heroes game.
3. Like I said, they got even the little things wrong.
4. Sure some creatures are boring and similar. The ones you named are not, and the ideas on the list are just from h5 and h6.
5-8. Mostly agree with the essence. Skill wheel sucks but im not getting into detail here. Its been discussed plently. Same with hero specials.
9. If by increase the creature pool you mean more imports from H6, i Say Noooooooooooooo thanks. Getting an 'update' to have a 'new' creature literally taken from the old game and put in here is so stupid.
10. Yea on the list of 30+ things to change, number ten is an expansion pack. 
Seems the list gets even more random and strange from here so no more looking at them one at a time..
'Health Bars"- No. Part of why this game is in flames is Erwins constant attempts to mixing RTS stuff that doesnt belong. Color coding, similar units, little diversity...Health bars would go on that list. Tell your wife she is wrong.  
"Necro needs a 2nd shooter" ..................................... absolutley ******* not. Instead, a faction needs less shooters, some said shooters needs to take on the 'Toughest elite spot', and Ubi still needs to learn how to make factions. Necro is the one faction that stands out and its only because it has but one shooter. Just reading your above suggestion tells me I've wasted my time (yet again) here and Heroes is doomed
'Scale'
The scale is great. Part of the nice atmosphere they created. The scale is never suppose to be realistic Whoever made this list, have they played ANY non Ubi heroes, like at all?
'Team color options' I was asking for this too. Some neutral colors to be more specific. They pick 8 bright easter egg colors for us to pick from... Also making it so you dont have to restart the game to turn the option on/off would be great.
Some things that really need change
Town levels Either make a point to them that doesnt make me hate them, or take them out. Every creature goes in the same spot lol. Cant have easrly access to any kind of creature lol. Ubi still has Heroes rights lol.
Unit diversity The production of every champion creature shouldnt be 1. They should not all cost the same. Their building should not all cost the same. Same with the strong elites, and most of the normal elites.
A question for H7 players: What is a unique unit in the game to you? try and think only faction units. One that has unique stats, plays a special role. A past game example would be like the mighty gorgon, special ability, great stats for a tier5. Or maybe paladins of H1&2 being much weaker, but plentiful and strikes twice. Or Black dragons in h4, super powerful, easily the strongest, but really expensive and only 1 growth per week.
The reason i ask is because honestly, nothing comes to mind for me. Sure some have a nice ability, but nothing special, nothing that another creature of the same tier either literally has the same thing or something else just as useful. All the unit stats are so similar compared to creatures of the same tier. With nothing to separate them other than the worst idea in Homm History: Faction skills.
That's all from me.
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TD
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted December 16, 2015 03:20 PM |
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I dunno if necro was changed after 1.5, but at least then necro was totally OP. They will struggle only for the first week(not even that if you get troops with diplomacy). After that they completely snowballed the game with necromancy on heroic and bigger maps at least. I can't see even in general why they would need 2nd shooter?? The game needs diversity and each faction having at least 2 shooters is the very opposite of that. If anything this game needs less focus on the shooters IMO(which was supposed to be something h7 focused on!).
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natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
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posted December 16, 2015 04:44 PM |
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Necro needs dark energy points else it is too OP
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Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
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posted December 16, 2015 08:03 PM |
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Edited by Antalyan at 20:10, 16 Dec 2015.
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Something has just been edited.
Fortunately gomaki will return soon. He was the only who seemed to listen.
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LukaOo
Hired Hero
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posted December 16, 2015 11:17 PM |
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Edited by LukaOo at 11:05, 17 Dec 2015.
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Before all cosmetic improvements the devs must concentrate on
* Fixing bugs
* Fixing visual annoying glitches, such as creatures movement, hero movements, hero's sticking.
* AI was already mentioned above
* Improve performance of the game, reduce system requirements.
* Improve these childish campaigns scenarios, now they are very poor, both implementation and scripts. It is important part of game too. Now campaigns are boring
* Add animations for campaigns, otherwise why do they use UE3.
* Redesign all copy-pasted interface elements and creatures.
* Rewrite all copy-pasted musical composition.
Two last induce strong H6 dejavu sindrom.
I see there is the post with same topic here [url=http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=41945]http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=41945[/url]
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DIEGIS
Supreme Hero
power of Zamolxis
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posted December 19, 2015 05:49 AM |
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Edited by DIEGIS at 05:52, 19 Dec 2015.
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39.)?!?!?! Sim turns - I suspect you developers have heard this a time or six. ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Should be first thing, NUMBER ONE, NUMERO UNU, 1.) otherwise game's dead...as if's not yet 
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dacian falx behind you
-knowledge itself is power-
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