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| Thread: Creature genders of HoMM/MM:H, the complete survey |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · «PREV |
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted August 19, 2016 10:03 AM |
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kiryu133 said:
It's a sexist attitude that women should somehow be presented as more special in a battlefield setting and should be cherished/protected while men are expandable.
So, the biggest fault with female representation in H7, however, is what roles and creates get to be female: creatures that are either quick strikers or archers/mages. not a single tank, champ or even above-average creature (there was one create per tear that was kind of halfway towards the next tier like the Rakshasa) is female. Limiting what roles are allowed to be female is much more of a problem than anything else.
There's a reason why in our modern world, women aren't equally present on the battlefield - and in ages of old, it was practically unheard of. In our current day and time, physical strength and condition has become somewhat less important than in ages past, but the requirement is still there.
Fighting battles in medieval times had everything to do with physical prowess. Physical condition and strength are required to fight battle after battle and it's a biological fact that women are overall not physically as strong as men.
It's one of the reasons why sports events for men also usually have longer playtimes (like with hockey) or more sets (with tennis for instance) than for women. For equal sports events, women usually score lower or need more time to perform the same activities and is the prime reason why sports events are usually not mixed but separated between men and women. There's nothing sexist about that, it's all related to physical build and muscle power, as well as energy reserves. The same applies to disasters, where children and women are usually taken care of first, before the men.
To top that off, testosteron is also an aggressive hormone, which makes men more apt to seek confrontation - all due to our ancient past, when men's roles were to hunt for food and protect the tribe against enemy tribes, while women were at the core, taking care of the young, sick and old, forming the social structure of the tribe. In that role distribution, women are traditionally more vulnerable than men and hence, when it comes to a battlefield situation, considered a more valuable asset requiring protection.
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The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 19, 2016 10:21 AM |
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Judging from the graph and its methodology, I can see that Ubisoft streamlined the game to have more generic males and females and less mythological creatures. That's also an issue.
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted August 19, 2016 10:37 AM |
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@maurice: Irrelevant. It's a fantasy game.
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted August 19, 2016 10:55 AM |
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kiryu133 said:
@maurice: Irrelevant. It's a fantasy game.
You do realise that this also automatically invalidates any of your arguments too, right? 
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The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted August 19, 2016 11:06 AM |
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You brought in real life history and values as a justification for elements which doesn't need to be applied in a fantasy game. There is no point for to limit us to real life gender disparity and values which was my point.
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted August 19, 2016 11:08 AM |
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Mod war, mod war, mod war!!!
*Sorry I'll see myself out.
Btw. I think I repeatedly hear the argument that women are not typical in war, and I think that's a luxury only the dominant part can have. Once it's either sending everything you got or lose, everything you got is what is send.
I also think it makes sense that the woman is cherished for the same reason she isn't send to war if it can be avoided, she's the one who carries a baby for nine months, her work part is much larger.. the idea is that 5 guys 20 girls can easier repopulate than 20 guys 5 girls can. Such views does of course ignore that we are speaking about individuals who should not be treated this badly to begin with, I do however think it's deep down the roots of such systems.
Finally that shaman is definitely not a shaman, it's a shalady
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted August 19, 2016 11:58 AM |
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We need JeremiahEmo in this thread 
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"Occam's shuriken: when the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas." -- Dr. Gordon Freeman (Freeman's Mind)
"lol" -- VERRIKER VON ERWINSSEN
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greenlore
Known Hero
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posted August 20, 2016 02:06 PM |
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kiryu133 said:
The Guardian/Justicar is the greatest haven design (and probs my favourite unit ever) of the franchises history.
Her design is that of confidense and power and her animations reinforce that beautifully. The broblem is that remaining haven troops do not follow similar designs, instead opting for faceless and disposable mooks which in comparison makes her special presumably for the one thing that sets her apart: being a woman. That is a weird problem considering her design is better than any of the others, showing enough face to humanize her but still being protected enough to be sensible while having the men being nothing but pawns to be sacrificed at your leisure. It's a sexist attitude that women should somehow be presented as more special in a battlefield setting and should be cherished/protected while men are expandable. which is a shame because on its own, her design is flawless but when put in context it brings some weird baggage that I'm probably overthinking but whatever.
Is there actually anything that suggests that the faceless units are male?I mean we don't see their bodies or faces,so they could be just as good be females wearing lots of armor that isn't designed to make them look female(so no breast plate,etc.)
I mean I haven't played the game,so I could be wrong and their voices are definetly male or something like that.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted August 20, 2016 08:34 PM |
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greenlore said:
Is there actually anything that suggests that the faceless units are male?I mean we don't see their bodies or faces,so they could be just as good be females wearing lots of armor that isn't designed to make them look female(so no breast plate,etc.)
I mean I haven't played the game,so I could be wrong and their voices are definetly male or something like that.
First of all, they all have male grunts so they are all presented as male. This of course doesn't really matter as much since the guardian/Justicar is still singled out due to her gender:
Quote:
Elrathian psalms are very clear about the fact men and women are equal under the Holy Light, but in the old times Guardians of the Faith were mostly men. That is, until Irina of the Wolf started to reform her Duchy’s military…
So them being women is still seemingly worth pointing out. Interestingly, the passage also implies that at least a portion of normal soldiers would also be women which is enforced by everything else in the game such as heroes and other heaven bios only pointing out one creature (chaplain) as male and another (landsknecht) specifically pointed out as potentially being either gender (and a specific swordmaster being male) yet only the Guardian/Justicar actually gets to be represented as a woman. One out of six is not enough for a seemingly equal society, especially if that one unit needs justification for being there in the first place.
Now if one or two of the other units did have feminine grunts, that'd be great. doesn't stop the Justicar from being singled out though.
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted August 20, 2016 09:14 PM |
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Edited by MattII at 21:27, 20 Aug 2016.
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kiryu133 said:
You brought in real life history and values as a justification for elements which doesn't need to be applied in a fantasy game.
He also argued (human) biology, which probably can be expected to apply. However, inasmuch as this is a fantasy game, those arguments can only be applied to humans, not elves, dwarves, etc.
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