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| Thread: What to do with Dark Elves and Faceless |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 · NEXT» |
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Rimgrabber
Promising
Famous Hero
Voice in Gelu's Head
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posted May 12, 2017 04:44 AM |
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Poll Question:
What to do with Dark Elves and Faceless
Hello Heroes Community!
I've been a fan of the HoMM series for quite a long time. I remember watching my parents play HoMM3 and loving to watch the knights and dragons and such move around the board. It was pretty much the beginning of my obsession with all things fantasy. I myself started playing when HoMM5 came out, and as such never really had a problem with the Dark Elves in Dungeon until MMH6 turned them into a weird cult. I consider myself to be a fairly "old school" fan of HoMM, but I thought the Faceless were pretty cool and actually one of the few good things about MMH6. I know Dark Elves and Faceless aren't very well loved within this community, so I wanted to know everyone's thoughts about what should be done with them. Personally, I think it would be cool for them to leave Dungeon and get their own faction, as long as they weren't a cult.
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Baronus
Legendary Hero
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posted May 12, 2017 08:46 AM |
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And wheres option:
Jadame is back? I want Dark Elves from Jadame! Bastian Loundrin!
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Mediczero
Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
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posted May 12, 2017 09:01 AM |
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We should keep the dark elves, they are not a bad idea. But their role in the faction should be changed so the are not the supreme rulers anymore. Probably just 1-2 units, maybe 3 if it fits.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted May 12, 2017 03:01 PM |
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Baronus said:
I want Dark Elves from Jadame!
Well, as you know Ashan is racist. 
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Zum-Graat
Tavern Dweller
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posted May 12, 2017 04:06 PM |
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I see nothing wrong with both Dark Elves and Faceless. If anything, they make faction more interesting and coherent. You just need to find the right balance - i.e. not to make half of units Dark Elves, 2-3 units are enough.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted May 12, 2017 04:26 PM |
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Zum-Graat said:
I see nothing wrong with both Dark Elves and Faceless. If anything, they make faction more interesting and coherent. You just need to find the right balance - i.e. not to make half of units Dark Elves, 2-3 units are enough.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted May 12, 2017 05:06 PM |
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Dark elves? Kill them with fire.
[/not racist]
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Varnoc
Hired Hero
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posted May 12, 2017 05:06 PM |
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Quote:
And wheres option:
Jadame is back? I want Dark Elves from Jadame! Bastian Loundrin!
This may be my bias towards MM8 speaking here, but Jadame's Dark Elves are my favorite imagining of "Dark Elves" in any fantasy.
They're not edgy, nor do they carry the heavy BDSM tones the current abominations do. Most were merchants and traders, but they weren't greedy or inherently evil in any way as a culture. Others were powerful warriors (Caurie Blackthorne comes to mind) set upon protecting their kin.
As for weather they should be kept or not? You'd need to majorly rewrite large portions of the lore for me to be alright with them. Their dominance of the Dungeon faction is my biggest issue, but I dislike the notion that I get that all Dark Elves are evil backstabbers with a severe lack of any recognizable moral code, and the over-abundance of purple in general in the Dungeon is aggravating.
Regarding the Faceless, however, I could not feel more opposite (as you could probably guess from my portrait). Ashan brought many things that I dislike, but the Faceless are not one of them. They're an interesting race, much more interesting than the angels ("Feel muh holy fury rawr" - Every Angel I've ever seen in the series) who seem flat as a race in comparison. They're an interesting, unique creature to me. They may have pulled inspiration from somewhere, but it doesn't feel like anything else I've ever encountered in fantasy, so they're cool.
To be honest, I was disappointed that the Faceless became a siege weapon in HoMM7. They were an awesome unit in HoMM6, easily my favorite creature in Ashan, though that's not saying much 
So, in conclusion: Nuke Dark Elves from orbit. I don't mind Dark Elves being a thing, I think their story is interesting (or at least more interesting than most of the material produced thus far), but the BDSM elements and their unquestioned dominance of the Dungeon is a real turnoff for me. Keep the Faceless. IMO, everything about them is cool.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted May 12, 2017 05:10 PM |
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Varnoc said:
Keep the Faceless. IMO, everything about them is cool.
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Zum-Graat
Tavern Dweller
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posted May 12, 2017 06:07 PM |
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Varnoc said:
So, in conclusion: Nuke Dark Elves from orbit. I don't mind Dark Elves being a thing, I think their story is interesting (or at least more interesting than most of the material produced thus far), but the BDSM elements and their unquestioned dominance of the Dungeon is a real turnoff for me. Keep the Faceless. IMO, everything about them is cool.
Yeah, BDSM elements are excessive for sure, but Dark Elves are not the only victims of this. Every faction in modern Heroes (parts 6&7) suffer from this "over-excessiveness". Just look at Haven and their ridiculous huge golden armors. Their core troops look like they might as well be high-level paladins, not basic footmen. Then remember Necropolis and their ridiculous spider fetish. Dark Elves as an idea are good, and actually have mythological roots in Scandinavian myths, but their realization in hero games are far from perfect.
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PandaTar
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Celestial Heavens Mascot
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posted May 12, 2017 06:56 PM |
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I voted the option "Melt them with radioactive acid", if they are based on the same ones in the previous games. If you want to make them something new and truly interesting, that's your cue and I would be ok with it.
But the way they were from previous HoMM games, no. #summonsgalaadanimatedgif
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"Okay. Look. We both said a lot of things that you're going to regret. But I think we can put our differences behind us. For science. You monster."
GlaDOS – Portal 2
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Baronus
Legendary Hero
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posted May 12, 2017 07:49 PM |
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Evil perverted dark Elves is Salvatore idea. I read his first book and stop past 20 pages. Ugly and no sense to read. When I saw Jadame Elves created by NWC I knew... THATS IT! Dark Elves as dark skin normal elf race is the best concept in this matter. Very natural. Not political correctnes. So only I can to say. More Jadame!
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted May 12, 2017 08:32 PM |
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E X T E R M I N A T E
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Gryphs
Supreme Hero
The Clever Title
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posted May 12, 2017 08:44 PM |
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^This.
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"Don't resist the force. Redirect it. Water over rock."-blizzardboy
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted May 12, 2017 09:20 PM |
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the dark elves suck mate they are a lazy racist concept, better a dark centaur, dark medusa or dark smurf, so dumb,
for Heroes the Dungeon is a Minotaur town and anything which says otherwise is mere fake news, furthermore the Faceless Ones are merely just a thinly veiled rehash of the Ithilid of Dungeons and Dragons and are not even Faceless because they have Faces,
really Heroes 5 and 6 was very late in the day to start throwing in these jerks to lead the Dungeon when it was perfectly fine to start with with the Minotaurs and Warlocks, thus let us kill Erwin's bad retarded ideas with fire and return to its roots which were better cheers lol
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Zum-Graat
Tavern Dweller
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posted May 12, 2017 10:12 PM |
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verriker said:
the Faceless Ones are merely just a thinly veiled rehash of the Ithilid of Dungeons and Dragons
To be fair, classic Heroes stole some things from D&D without even changing it in any way. I can see similarities between Illithids and Faceless, but even if they are based on them, they are changed enough to feel pretty different.
And you say that Minotaurs are the face of Dungeon, I disagree with this statement. The face of Dungeon is (Black) Dragon, all other creatures you can change freely IMHO.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted May 12, 2017 10:54 PM |
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Zum-Graat said:
I disagree with this statement.
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Baronus
Legendary Hero
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posted May 13, 2017 12:26 AM |
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Yes! Cows in Jadame are good too! Save Mino! This time theyre light path. Another good concept.
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Mediczero
Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
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posted May 13, 2017 12:58 AM |
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Think we all agree minotaurs need a more central role in the dungeon faction.
My personal ideal would be warlock* style darkelves and the minotaurs being the two primary races of the faction, with some other races like troglodytes and humans taking up a few heroes and a unit or two.
A small note on what I mean with "warlock" darkelves. It's a cultural thing, and is my preferred version of the darkelves. Simply put, the darkelves are an aristocratic and proud people specialised in dark magic. They wouldn't be dressed in crazy leather outfits, but rather en elegant dresses and robes befitting of such a noble people, they would take the role of mages on the battlefield rather than anything else. Also, in relation to the minotaurs, they would see them as an sort of equal, or rather their honorable counterpart. While the darkelves are all fancy and stuff, the minortaurs and strong and brutal, yet still not quite savage, and offers the physical capability the pointyeared warlocks lacks, making them the perfect allies to the darkelves... Also because ennslaving them would not end well for the darkelves, but that's a minor saide
An addition to this could be to also add stealth to their resume. While the high class darkelves considering themselves beyond going out and dealing with paticular annoying foes themselves, they are not above sending assassins, often lower class darkelves that choose it as a profession other than magic, to do the dirty work. They could also be added to the armies for a bit of annoying stealthy assassin stuff. Still, the most darkelves would be mages in one way or another.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted May 13, 2017 01:14 AM |
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Mediczero said:
We should keep the dark elves, they are not a bad idea.
Mediczero said:
My personal ideal would be warlock* style darkelves and the minotaurs being the two primary races of the faction
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