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| Thread: 25 Years of Magic: The Gathering |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 03, 2019 06:45 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 18:49, 03 Jun 2019.
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Galatea
Supreme Hero
Well, I'm Ceres!
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posted June 04, 2019 11:26 AM |
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I lost interest in MTG lore after Onslaught Block. I just thought Mirrodin block doesn't fit the MTG world. This was also the time they changed the border of the cards to somewhat modern-looking type.
I am not so excited about this. Maybe it's just because I don't want to get disappointed that it won't meet my expectations. Anyways, I am not interested with the current lore. I never liked the Planeswalker and more of that I don't like Jace being a blue planeswalker it should be a FEMALE instead!
I'll still check it and see if I'd like it.
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And she told you, laughing down to her core, so she would not cry, as she lay on your lap,
"Nobody here can live forever, quiet in the grasp of dusk and summer."
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 04, 2019 12:15 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 12:47, 04 Jun 2019.
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Galatea said:
I lost interest in MTG lore after Onslaught Block. I just thought Mirrodin block doesn't fit the MTG world. This was also the time they changed the border of the cards to somewhat modern-looking type.
Old MtG lore had a charm around it, that much is certain. I still look back on it with nostalgia. But getting out of Dominaria allowed the designers to create some really cool settings. Without this decision there wouldn't be Innistrad, Ixalan nor Tarkir for example. Plus they usually focus on the world itself (which sometimes has some really nice lore), only adding the "binder" in the form of 'Gatewatch'. I'm not a particular fan of 'Gatewatch' story arc but it's conclusion is pretty cool (and Bolas is a nice adversary). You can either love it or hate it, but it has ended so we will see what they have in store for us next.
Oh and Mirrodin is one of my favourite MtG settings. It's really hard to find such an atmospheric and unique setting elsewhere. I prefer traditional fantasy, but imo they really nailed it with this Plane and I would love to see it again, although it's devastated by Phyrexia now. Who knows, there's a high chance Phyrexia will be the next big antagonist (again) after Bolas so we might see it again.
And I mean, you can get darker and cooler then this:
Galatea said:
I am not so excited about this. Maybe it's just because I don't want to get disappointed that it won't meet my expectations. Anyways, I am not interested with the current lore.
Yeah, it's a healthy approach. This things tend to disappoint. But the payroll looks really impressive (and Russo brothers state to be fans of MtG). If they won't try anything over-the-top, and keep to MtG visual standards, then we are in for a treat 
Galatea said:
I never liked the Planeswalker and more of that I don't like Jace being a blue planeswalker it should be a FEMALE instead!
Why?
Besides, there are a few Blue female Planeswalkers already: Kasmina, Mu Yangling or Narset. Kiora and Tamiyo are blue-green (and they were initially blue before WotS).
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Galatea
Supreme Hero
Well, I'm Ceres!
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posted June 04, 2019 02:57 PM |
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Edited by Galatea at 15:00, 04 Jun 2019.
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I like fantasy. I like D&D. I like LOTR. That's why I like MtG. I like that category of fantasy. I don't knownwhat it is called. But robots doesn't exist there. So when Mirrodin came out. I was like - Robots?!?!? Its a different kind of fantasy, I know, but my mind is glued with the D&D setting. I like the humans, elves, dwarves, orcs, angels, dragons. Robots is just out of place in that kind of world.
Jace is the face of MtG. Now. He is the most popular and most powerful planeswalker in terms of card power! Maybe in the story he is the most powerful too aside from the built-up enemies. And he is a guy! And he is a sort of a... magician guy in which is kinda meh to me. I think his role should be a role of a female character. You know, that mind sculpting thing he's doing. I think it is more fitting for a female to weild it. There is a legendary blue creature that I liked. I think her name is Rayne or Raine. I forgot.
But what did they do! They put the female in the image of who?!?! Liliana!!! A beautiful and sexy planeswalker! And om......gggg. I have this feeling that she became the sex image of MtG. Or maybe this isn't a feeling! It's true! On top of that, she is a what? Slave of Bolas! I can't imagine what Bolas could've done to her!
I just think this is all unfair! It gives me the impression that men are intelligent and women are sex objects.
I don't know. That's just how I felt. Maybe I am a feminist? Is that what you call it? All of these are just my opinion. I could be wrong but that's what I feel. I really wisj Jace was a girl. 
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And she told you, laughing down to her core, so she would not cry, as she lay on your lap,
"Nobody here can live forever, quiet in the grasp of dusk and summer."
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Oddball13579
Supreme Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
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posted June 04, 2019 06:49 PM |
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I thought Liliana was the new fan favorite after she rebelled against Bolas. She was always one of my faves.
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"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 04, 2019 09:02 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 21:31, 04 Jun 2019.
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Galatea said:
I don't know. That's just how I felt. Maybe I am a feminist? Is that what you call it? All of these are just my opinion. I could be wrong but that's what I feel. I really wisj Jace was a girl.
A Feminist? Maybe. But imo that is quite funny because WotS is seriously heavy on SJW aspect (Social Justice Warriors), they are trying really hard to make the game politically correct, as gender and race friendly as possible, even at the cost of their long time fans who feel left out or being pointed at as the "archaic nerds". But that is another story and not important in this context. Examples of changes? They for instance stopped doing too revealing art for female characters (you won't see skimpy outfits or sexy poses anymore), they add various people of color as prominent characters: Teferi, an Afro-American, is one of the strongest mages in MtG, Chandra is the most powerful Pyromancer, Jhoira is the captain of Weatherlight (a cult-classic ship), Kaya (also an Afro-American) is a badass ghost-hunter, Serra created Angels on Dominaria (cult-classic angels) and Freyalise, another powerful Planeswalker, sacrificed herself to save the plane. And the list can go on. So it's funny to me that even though they try so hard to appease all, you are dissatisfied with a character cus you "feel" he should be a girl.
Jace is prominent because they created Gatewatch members as representations of Mana colors, the most important factor in MtG. As a Gatewatch member it is logical he is fleshed out as a character (and uber powerful), they built a multi-year story arc around this group. It just so happened they designed him as a male. Nissa, another Gatewatch member, has literally animated a whole plot of land into a living war machine (Vitu-Ghazi), and her WotS Planeswalker card is very strong. Oh, and during the Eldrazi crisis on Zendikar she literally controlled the whole planet.
Liliana is literally a symbol of a strong and independent woman. She was made slave of Bolas due to his machinations (oh, and not before killing four ultra-powerful Demons mind you), but she ultimately showed her power (not to mention she almost single-handedly saved Innistrad at one point, and that's not all the stuff she's done through the story arcs). Sex symbol of MtG? When did attractivness become a flaw... not to mention I don't find her that attractive to begin with.
I think you should read into the lore a bit more Galatea 
Back to the subject of Mirrodin. Yeah it does not fit into classic fantasy. But it was done so good that I'm ok with it existing in this universe. And they are not "robots" per se, they are more like biomechanical lifeforms. But that is a subject for debate. I can understand why people dislike it, but I like it very much. A matter of taste I guess.
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Oddball13579
Supreme Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
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posted June 05, 2019 12:13 AM |
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Sure no skimpy clothes like what female video game characters wear, or sexy poses are fine. But revealing clothes are fine imo. Like what Liliana wore M14 is fine.
Also how is adding people of colour a SJW agenda?
Jace was also the Living Guildpact for all of Ravnica. So course he is uber powerful. He held the balance of the 12 Guilds of Ravinca for some time, before Azorius was exposed to the public thus breaking the guildpact. Of course there are a lot of other people who are stronger than Jace. And what's wrong with a male character being able to use mind magic?
blob is right though. Liliana killed the four demons that had enslaved her then rebelled against Bolas with the intent to kill herself in one last show of free will. She is equal in strength to Jace and blob also mentioned several other females that just as strong if not stronger.
blob2 said:
When did attractiveness become a flaw
Exactly. A lot of people call women sex symbols of things just because they are beautiful, smart, cunning, basically any positive traits that make them equal to men. Usually this is done in an effort to undermine them or weaken their character, make them hated by reducing them to a sex symbol.
In truth, Liliana is powerful, cunning, witty, charismatic. And beautiful second.
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"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
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Galatea
Supreme Hero
Well, I'm Ceres!
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posted June 05, 2019 09:16 AM |
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Pfftt...
That is just to magnet lil boys to playing MtG. It's all about money. It's all about marketing. I don't know how to insert picture but I want to show Liliana in
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And she told you, laughing down to her core, so she would not cry, as she lay on your lap,
"Nobody here can live forever, quiet in the grasp of dusk and summer."
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 05, 2019 09:40 AM |
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Edited by blob2 at 09:42, 05 Jun 2019.
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Galatea said:
That is just to magnet lil boys to playing MtG. It's all about money. It's all about marketing. I don't know how to insert picture but I want to show Liliana in
Ofc it's a magnet 
So why are you playing MtG? I don't think you're a kid Aren't dragons and goblins stuff for little kids?
Speaking of Liliana, yes she was a target of critique about wearing too skimpy outfits and having sexy poses on her depictions. But that was before political correctness took over, and now she's depicted less challengingly...
Liliana of Old (Innistrad, 2011):
VS.
Newer Liliana (Eldritch Moon, 2016)
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Galatea
Supreme Hero
Well, I'm Ceres!
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posted June 05, 2019 11:47 AM |
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Edited by Galatea at 11:58, 05 Jun 2019.
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The History of the Jiggly Pops!
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And she told you, laughing down to her core, so she would not cry, as she lay on your lap,
"Nobody here can live forever, quiet in the grasp of dusk and summer."
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 05, 2019 01:56 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 13:56, 05 Jun 2019.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted June 05, 2019 04:39 PM |
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Edited by Minion at 17:30, 05 Jun 2019.
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I am not gonna comment on the SJW nonsense on this topic more than this, there is real social progression that happens BECAUSE WE EVOLVE as a humans. We do not live in the 50's anymore because no one wants to, except some hillbilly Trumpists. The TINY minority that is the SJW:s are not the reason that big companies want to encompass more diverse people. It is because in the 50's consumer was ONLY the white male. Now women and black people are also considered as consumers, THAT IS WHY BOTH HOLLYWOOD AND OTHER BIG COMPANIES try to include women and minorities in their products. It is business. But if it makes you feel more at ease then by all means think all this is because of SJW:s. Man that little group is powerfull, it has single handedly changed all of humanity :S
However, as to MTG I don't think I can go back to the problem of mana. I played a game just a minute ago and I drew 10 lands and 3 cards (starting hand was 3 cards so all I drew were lands after that). It is just so annoying. And that is the better outcome, even more I hate having answers to their threats but I don't have mana for it. After the superior system of Hearthstone I just don't understand why Wizards of the Coast still keeps this annoying outdated system.
I will play MTG now and then, especially draft. But the truth is I absolutely can't get over the fact that I loose when I don't draw enough lands. It is a desingn flaw imho. No one likes it asfaik.
Edit: Jace is such a wuss and also for a mind mage I can't believe every single person in the storyline has fooled him at some point. If you want him to be a female then be my guest, i guess Also as for powerlevel, there is no comparison. Liliana is by far the strongest of the group. Jace is hardly in the midtier now that he is no longer the living Guildpact. It is speculated that only Sorin and Bolas (duh) are more powerfull than Liliana.
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Oddball13579
Supreme Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
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posted June 05, 2019 06:12 PM |
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blob2 said:
......
I really don't see how the first picture of Liliana could be considered revealing or a overtly sexual pose. If anything it looks like she is walking down a staircase while toying with someone.
____________
"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
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Galatea
Supreme Hero
Well, I'm Ceres!
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posted June 05, 2019 06:35 PM |
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It's hard to type on phone. Now I am on my PC.
Ok, where was I? I think I am lost.
First, I don't do SJW stuff. I am just stating my opinion. I can't do anything to change what is already happening. What I kept stating is that I lost interest in the MtG story, that's all, because I didn't like what they have done - what HASBRO had done to it.
I won't argue that Hasbro saved the game. Well, that's what they said. I was told MtG was dying back then. So WoTC sold it to Hasbro. Still, I didn't like what Hasbro do. They removed the player rewards. I was just beginning to become active at that time when they removed it. So I just received a few rewards. Only think I can remember I got from them was my foil full art Damnation.  But people said it's wise to remove the rewards because its cost effective.
Another thing they did was that. Added the planeswalker and stuff. But anyways, I didn't really mind because I was concentrated with the game already and not the story. However, I can't help myself to root for the planeswalkers too. Jace is one of my favorite, because he is blue and I like blue cards and I am a blue mage. But the only Jace I like is Jace, the Mind Sculptor card and nothing else. I'm just in for the power. He's so powerful in the Legacy decks. I think I had four before but sold them when I stopped playing Legacy. Then, he got reprinted in Modern! I was so happy! I was able to buy three copies of them but that's all. I can't afford to buy another one to make it a playset. Still, I'm happy because I can use him on some of my decks.
Another planeswalker that I liked was Elspeth! But they killed her!
Then, I liked this girl, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben. I read a bit of story about her and I like what she's done. Guess what! Liliana  her
@Blob
I got inclined in MtG when I was like 15 years old. My cousin showed me some cards but we didn't know what to do about it. All I can remember was there was power and toughness thingy he was saying about. I moved the card to and fro to check if the P/T will change, having in mind that it is a 'Magic' card. You know, like those hologram stuff back then. Apparently, nothing changed and we have no idea how to play it so we abandoned it.
Years later, I think I was going to graduate college at that time, MtG came to my life again. Luckily, my cousin found a group of friends that knows how to play and most importantly an LGS which really sells cards and hold tournaments. My cousin taught me how to play. It was during the Onslaught block. He was having this powerful Mono-Black Zombie deck while I have a Precon Mono-White Soldier deck. I lost a ton to him. But! I love the soldiers! Back then, soldiers and knights were my favorite MtG creature type! I stick with the deck for quite sometime, until I found the power of blue cards. Damn Force of Will!
Since my addiction grew, I was able to find my own group and another LGS near my school. There I played a few times with the guys and I became acquainted to them until we became MtG friends. But because my parents are strict, I wasn't able to play most of the time. They were also against MtG, so I hid my cards from them making it hard to access for me.
Still, my fascination with the game continued. What I really like with the game is the story, followed by art (John Avon fan here), then the mechanics came third and lastly was MtG finance.
I really love the story! I think at that time, I wanted to own the books and read them. But I have hard access since MtG wasn't really popular at my place and I need to go to the city to avail one. When I have time to visit the store in the city, things weren't available anymore. MtG back then was so scarce in my country.
Meanwhile, while waiting for a chance to own the books, I collected the cards that I wanted. Mostly, John Avon illustrated cards and foils too! I still play from time to time, but it was very rare.
When Mirrodin came, I got really disappointed. They changed the border and I felt, the fantasy aura of MtG has disappeared. After that change, I was never fascinated by the story anymore and I lost that 'feels' to collect the cards in which I liked the art.
I began concentrating with the game itself. I began building tier 1 decks. At that time, what I thirst for was the challenge. Winning the game. Apparently, after winning only several matches and losing a ton. I got bored. So I delved more in the game. I tried out rogue decks and used them, hoping to win with it. I thought, it will be more challenging to use non-tier decks and win with them. Additionally, I became fascinated with decks that abuse the advanced mechanics of the game. I liked decks that reacts during for example 'The beginning of end of turn' and the likes. Now, most of my decks are built around that.
Then the Eldrazi came!!! After acquainting with them for a bit, I began to like them! It's because - I like ALIENS! Now all my decks are Eldrazi.
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And she told you, laughing down to her core, so she would not cry, as she lay on your lap,
"Nobody here can live forever, quiet in the grasp of dusk and summer."
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 05, 2019 06:40 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 18:59, 05 Jun 2019.
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Minion said:
But if it makes you feel more at ease then by all means think all this is because of SJW:s. Man that little group is powerfull, it has single handedly changed all of humanity :S
Lol, where did I ever mention SJW as a group? I meant their mentality, but figures some people on HC are triggered by mentioning this acronym (although SJW are the most noisy lot and do influence some WotC decisions, like the infamous "A Store of Fire and Dice" controversy).
Btw in 2017 Rosewater stated himself MtG has 12 milion active players, which was an 8 milion drop since 2015. I wonder how the business is doing...
But I say: let's call it quits. I know I'm the one who started this discussion, but I'm certain we won't change our views. That much is certain.
@Galatea
The SJW thing is my bad, what I meant was that some design decision are being made to be in line with the current trends (like Minion mentions, because we're "evolving"), and some people like it, some do not (me included). It wasn't directed at you Galatea, I metioned how I find funny that with recent changes in how they depict characters people can still be dissatisfied and find flawed propotions in character designs. I'm begining to wonder if that is indeed the case or are people simply being selfish.
Imo some changes are indeed good, but some seem to be imposed.
Minion said:
I will play MTG now and then, especially draft. But the truth is I absolutely can't get over the fact that I loose when I don't draw enough lands. It is a desingn flaw imho. No one likes it asfaik.
Yeah, the system is flawed, and I concede many matches just because I can't draw mana while my opponent gains the upper hand. They tried to mitigate this by making dual mana lands which work quite well. Heartshtones mana system is superior, but does not give so much variety and strategy imo (you need to manage your resources carefully in order to play multiple spells that need specific colors of mana)
But I think they cannot drop this system, it is what defines the game.
And I simply love how in Magic you can trick your opponents with Instant spells. I win some matches because I "wait out my opponents" just to bait them for that perfect moment, an attack which I can counter with a sudden spell that will raise my minions stats (that's one example). That is the "chess" aspect of the game Galatea mentions.
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Galatea
Supreme Hero
Well, I'm Ceres!
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posted June 05, 2019 06:42 PM |
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Oddball13579 said:
blob2 said:
......
I really don't see how the first picture of Liliana could be considered revealing or a overtly sexual pose. If anything it looks like she is walking down a staircase while toying with someone.
Just cut one of the ropes and it will be revealed to you.
____________
And she told you, laughing down to her core, so she would not cry, as she lay on your lap,
"Nobody here can live forever, quiet in the grasp of dusk and summer."
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Oddball13579
Supreme Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
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posted June 06, 2019 04:32 AM |
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Galatea said:
Oddball13579 said:
blob2 said:
......
I really don't see how the first picture of Liliana could be considered revealing or a overtly sexual pose. If anything it looks like she is walking down a staircase while toying with someone.
Just cut one of the ropes and it will be revealed to you.
Eh. People are too sensitive nowadays. But whatever.
blob2 said:
But I think they cannot drop this system, it is what defines the game.
And I simply love how in Magic you can trick your opponents with Instant spells. I win some matches because I "wait out my opponents" just to bait them for that perfect moment, an attack which I can counter with a sudden spell that will raise my minions stats (that's one example). That is the "chess" aspect of the game Galatea mentions.
You're right. To drop the mana system would change the game at its very core and probably kill the game outright.
Nothing is better than having only one card in your hand, a few mana left untapped and your opponent thinking they have you. They attack and bam! You play the card that has been in your hand for several turns. Boom. You win! Such a satisfying feeling.
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"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 06, 2019 09:57 AM |
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Edited by blob2 at 10:07, 06 Jun 2019.
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Oddball13579 said:
Nothing is better than having only one card in your hand, a few mana left untapped and your opponent thinking they have you. They attack and bam! You play the card that has been in your hand for several turns. Boom. You win! Such a satisfying feeling.
Exactly that! And it's part of the strategy to make him think that you don't have such a card cus you didn't use it for a couple of turns. Whereas you were simply waiting for the right moment when his guard is down.
It's also something different then Hearthstone. Sure, there are popular meta decks out there, bet there is such a variety in decks, that you cannot always predict what your opponent will do (sometimes you can tell by how many minions he taps). At times it can be frustrating (when you loose because of it), but at the same MtG is less boring then Hearthstone in which there are times when there are 3-4 dominating decks which everyone plays and you know each and every card he can potentially play. Ofc there is also a strategic aspect to it, but I prefer more variety...
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Oddball13579
Supreme Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
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posted June 06, 2019 07:56 PM |
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I've had games where me and my opponent have lots of creatures on the field, decent mana, and one card in our hands and neither of us make a move for like 10 turns because we are waiting for the opportune moment to attack, meanwhile we keep summoning more and more creatures.
Of course MtG also allows major deck customization and design. I have seen some pretty creative decks. You can combine the raw power of green and the destructive spells of red to steamroll opponents, or the life steal of black with the healing of white to be a literal untouchable healer, or the control of blue with the defense of green and whittle your opponent down to zero cards.
Each colour has their own playstyle and the game truly gets interesting when you combine them into dual colour decks or tri colour decks. Red, Green, and White, is absolutely insane if you build it right.
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"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted June 06, 2019 08:18 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 22:04, 06 Jun 2019.
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I liked colourless Artifact heavy decks (Affinity and Sunburst mechanics) of Mirrodin. Thought they lacked a bit in power, it was fun knowing that whatever land you play, you could still play any creature
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