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Haunter7
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 26, 2024 05:24 PM |
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AI heroes that retreat don't come back
Already asked this in the official HotA thread but it's important and urgent so decided to make a separate post.
So I played a long game on a giant map (random templates), the enemy heroes kept getting weaker and weaker - apparently some of the latest updates prevents AI from getting back their heroes that retreated, they're lost forever. This makes solo games completely pointless, especially the large size maps. Any idea if there's a setting to change it back somewhere, or can I roll back the version of the game or something?
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Juas
Hired Hero
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posted March 03, 2024 02:48 AM |
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I think that's sadly a new "rule" of 1.7.0. Strong heroes don't come back to the tavern. :/
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted March 03, 2024 02:15 PM |
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Yeah! And it was a terrible decision. It probably screws dozens of custom maps, where you have quests for or are supposed to hire defeated heroes like for instance Gelu in Paragorn.
Besides that, one of the tricks I've used often to make AI progressively stronger is to limit the number of heroes they can hire, so they get rehired over and over. If this is not optional, they will end up without any heroes instead.
P.S. I'm trying not engage in too much paranoia but it seems it was made on purpose to screw some of my maps where you are supposed to abuse the Invite.Tavern tweak, like "Time of Contempt"
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Phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted March 03, 2024 04:11 PM |
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Are we sure this also affects AI? Or maybe it only affects human players?
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gatecrasher
Famous Hero
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posted March 03, 2024 04:37 PM |
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The change introduced in 1.7 only affects defeated heroes. It shouldn't affect retreated heroes. Otherwise retreating would have been removed from the game effectively.
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted March 03, 2024 05:01 PM |
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Yes, you can retreat. But if you dismiss a level 2 hero, he disappears from the heroes pool forever. Plus, it isn't clear what they mean by "strong hero", I dismissed several level 1 with new SSs and they return, tried with Achilles in "Kill the Gods", level 1, all SSs at Expert, 60/60/20/10. Gone. Gave +2 of Knowledge and Estates to some that returned, thought spells to Adelaide (with Advanced Wisdom) before that, gone.
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted March 03, 2024 05:29 PM |
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An odd idea, right? The Dead Ornament rumour says "Have you heard that Scholar is cruel to buy and abandon heroes again?" Strategy!
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Fight MWMs - stand teach
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Haunter7
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 03, 2024 08:32 PM |
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Edited by Haunter7 at 20:48, 03 Mar 2024.
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I've found the cause myself, and the fix as well.
As I mentioned, the games I played were random ones created on map templates. Originally those templates spawn a TON of Prisons on the map, and my personal tests showed that those objects let AI go over the usual hero limit (21). The AI can NOT hire any new hero when there's 21 or more AI heroes globally on the map (it's commonly believed that the 21 cap includes human heroes as well, I've discovered it's not the case, the number only applies to AI heroes, at least in HotA 1.7). As a result, none of the retreated heroes can be bought back, since with so many Prisons there's always way more than 21 heroes present if u're playing against 3 or more AI players.
What I did was edit the map template to completely disable Prisons, then created a map using that edited template, every single relevant hero was then bought back by the AI after they flee, sometimes even the very same turn if they were the one to initiate an attack. To my surprise and relief, even if the AI wasn't the one to take their turn first, the other AIs still never hired a new hero before them, which would block the one that has their turn after them from rehiring the hero as there would already be 21 heroes on the map. The one that had lost their hero always got a chance to get them back. In my current game some heroes have already been bought back 2-3 times and they continue coming back everytime.
Would still prefer if there was another way to overcome the issue, preferably some patch/mod that lets AI bypass the 21 hero limit, but disabling Prsions works as an effective temporary fix at least 
I'm enjoying the current game much, much more than the ones before. Thank u guys for showing interest!
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Juas
Hired Hero
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posted April 12, 2024 01:51 PM |
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But it would be nice to know the way to undo the "Defeated strong heroes dissapear from the game" thing, I always liked that sometimes you got a nice surprise on the tavern. Also their artifacts dissapear with them.
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted April 12, 2024 02:44 PM |
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Juas said:
But it would be nice to know the way to undo the "Defeated strong heroes dissapear from the game" thing, I always liked that sometimes you got a nice surprise on the tavern. Also their artifacts dissapear with them.
 Even if personally I hate the nice surprises.
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Juas
Hired Hero
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posted April 28, 2024 03:28 PM |
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted April 28, 2024 05:18 PM |
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I prefer not to get the AI evolved heroes.
But I want them to come back, even cause I make my maps using separate pools for player and AI and AI pool is usually very small, so they rehire frequently.
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orrinisthebest
Known Hero
Invest in your future.
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posted July 28, 2024 08:17 PM |
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Recently came back to this amazing game since i'm free nowadays.
Not being able to get the defeated heroes back is a very annoying constraint, especially as someone who doesn't have the luxury to play online games.
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted July 28, 2024 08:34 PM |
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You can always hope AI doesn't have the Shackles...
The other day someone asked about my motivation to work on Era... Well, my motivation is this.
Since I'm unable to circumvent this limitation, there is no New Town, no Campaign Editor or whatever that makes me bet on HotA again.
I have hundreds of hours on a map with more then one hundred prisons, precisely for AI to always have strong heroes. I guess their taverns would be empty month 2...
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted July 28, 2024 08:39 PM |
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But WoG/ERA already has a rule in option i.e. HotA copied an/the idea, and made it an official rule. I've played, but I don't use a option, because I don't like it. So it caused I tuned double AI, you know that events give to AI bonuses, what you can't get it, I created events at the towns, when AI buys a hero from tavern, and hero AI steps/enters the event, and the event gives experience point, PS, etc.. An example of my HotA maps are the Dead Ornament and the Puzzler.. So 8 heroes have over 80 PS.. When dead hero, and then 80 PS again.. I thankee HotA crew, thus my wish, they listened me.. Yes only editormap, but no random map nor scenario.. Can't always be X, I don't have a word..
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Fight MWMs - stand teach
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted July 28, 2024 09:49 PM |
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In HotA I generally don't use the event at the door to give experience and primary skills, cause they would continuously step on it and never leave the area. But I give secondary skills and spells that way.
I was thinking of setting a sphinx bonus of 500.000 a day in those events, in Era. But I still haven't found a simple way to give extra primary skills dynamically.
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