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| Thread: No random map generator! |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted October 31, 2002 01:55 AM |
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dont know why people were surprised
I never expected a random map generator for homm4.
My big fear is that they will go drastic again on changes for homm5, even though homm4 is just being tried out in finished form now, nearly 6 months after release. And these are people who do not really get deep into multiplayer to positives/negatives of the game.
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Laelth
Famous Hero
Laelth rhymes with stealth.
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posted October 31, 2002 02:03 AM |
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Wow, I honestly didn't know H3 had a random map generator. I've played the game _a lot_, since 1994 or so, I guess, and I've made about 15 maps for it, but I had no idea there was a rmg for it. I can't imagine how it would work.
-Laelth
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Alan P. Taylor, Attorney at Law, LLC
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midnight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 31, 2002 04:26 AM |
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Quote:
Wow, I honestly didn't know H3 had a random map generator. I've played the game _a lot_, since 1994 or so, I guess, and I've made about 15 maps for it, but I had no idea there was a rmg for it. I can't imagine how it would work.
-Laelth
u must have the standard heroes then (1.4), try getting heroes 3 complete, or shadow of death or armageddon's blade, then u get the generator. It is based on templates, for which we recently found a file that is editable, thus unlimited random map variations once we figure out how to patch that file effectively.
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splexx
Known Hero
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posted October 31, 2002 05:44 AM |
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Quote:
"Here, I'm confused. H3 doesn't have a rmg, but it's a fun game, no?"
Just a question (seriously) have you played much H3? You sound to be coming from someone who has played very little, if at all. Heroes3 does have a random generator which has spawned a whole new level of fantastic heroes players, players that can devise their strategy in the face of much adversity and not given things handed to them on a plate (ie, heres all your mines, 1 day from town, guarded by 12 familiars  ). The heroes3 generator does have flaws, but randoms are all I play, you play a map once and then it is done. If it wasnt for the Heroes3 rmg, I would have given it away 3 years ago.
EXACTLY!!!
(but queensryche still sux)
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Azif..
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted October 31, 2002 04:40 PM |
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RychenRoller for President!!!!!!
I couldnt have said it better my self. RMG saved H3 for certain death. And without random map generator in H4 the same map overplaying will happen all over again. Which equals Death to H4 much much sooner.
As for H5 removing the heroes. LOL that is one of the best things they changed in H4. They must have NO clue what there fans really want. Someone needs to add a Fan division to there company that goes and reads message boards and finds out what people really want.
If 3DO makes H5 a single player game again, and then trys to add some multiplayer aspects I wont be bying it. Heroes is a Multiplayer game to make it fun. I cannot figure out why they insist on centering it around single player.
I still laugh my @$$ off when I see them boasting of expantion packs have 6 NEW campaigns!! as if that is o great. WHO cares! lol
Jinxer
" Who has never played a campaign in H3 or H4 "
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IRONMLH
Known Hero
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posted October 31, 2002 07:56 PM |
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yea
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Someone needs to add a Fan division to there company that goes and reads message boards and finds out what people really want.
Wow, what a brilliant idea. Such forward thinking! Maybe by H6 expansion pack #2 they will get it right
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If 3DO makes H5 a single player game again, and then trys to add some multiplayer aspects I wont be bying it. Heroes is a Multiplayer game to make it fun. I cannot figure out why they insist on centering it around single player..
Ditto
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I still laugh my @$$ off when I see them boasting of expantion packs have 6 NEW campaigns!! as if that is o great. WHO cares! lol..
It is amazing that these expansion packs bring absolutely nothing to the table, nothing!
I fear the life of H4 will be less than half of H3 the way things are going. Granted that is not what i want or hope for, but all signs are pointed in that direction.
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"Knowledge has discarded all biblical teachings"
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Laelth
Famous Hero
Laelth rhymes with stealth.
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posted October 31, 2002 11:30 PM |
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u must have the standard heroes then (1.4), try getting heroes 3 complete, or shadow of death or armageddon's blade, then u get the generator. It is based on templates, for which we recently found a file that is editable, thus unlimited random map variations once we figure out how to patch that file effectively.
Yup, I've got ROE and never upgraded. When I got bored with the included maps, I just made my own.
-Laelth
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Alan P. Taylor, Attorney at Law, LLC
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StormKnight
Tavern Dweller
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posted December 31, 2002 08:05 PM |
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What truly baffles me with the random map generator is that Heroes IV, on the overall strategy map level, really isn't much different from Heroes III. It seems like the same algoriths and processes should work pretty well. I wouldn't think they would have had to go through much effort to convert it for H4!
I agree with others; I loved the addition of heroes that actually take part in battles. It would be a shame to lose it!
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jtl
Hired Hero
King of Tossers
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posted January 08, 2003 08:49 AM |
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Psha.....
Randoms are over-rated. Everyone knows that desert war is ipso facto the one, the only and the best map that ever has been or ever will be played.
Or then again....
Perhaps 3DO and Co. just doesn't want to make a truck load more money by producing a game of unlimited replayability (well...nearly unlimited). I mean, after all they are such a sucessfull computer gaming company.... anyone checked their stock lately?
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Wow...it says I could use BB code here..but not HTML... I got no clue what that means
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AzureDragonTM
Known Hero
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posted January 08, 2003 10:13 AM |
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No random generator for Homm4 ?
Now this is very bad news. All our games will become nothing more then simply walkthroughs of the maps. In fact right now there r players specialized in maps like dogdays (Flipmo, Tc_fear) Heart of the winter (Sacred_warriors,Prince Legolas,me) Plains of Despair (The Teacher). And without a random generator we will be divided in 2 parts : open maps players and closed maps players. We r specialising people...no fun anymore.
I'm atrracted more to closed maps (seems more like heroes 3 when level 7 monsters blocked the way in random generated maps) reason 1 and reason 2 : the luck isn't so important like in open maps (i mean if u find sack of gold on dogdays in week 1 - minor artefact) u r 80 % winner. On an open map a lucky player is almost winner. That's how my clanmate The Teacher lost on dog days to Hagbard when it's obvious that the teacher is by far a better player than Hagbard (no offence my friend).And that's a reason why i prefer Heart vs Plains. Lots of major (u just can't be lucky with all of them) and u can compensate them by good playing anyway. So my message to u all players : don't even think i will play u on a map where a lucky artefact could compensate your lack of knowlegde 
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Evil Ghost Pirate LeChuck
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insatiable
Supreme Hero
Ultimate N00bidity
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posted January 08, 2003 05:38 PM |
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All our games will become nothing more then simply walkthroughs of the maps
Azure,why you accuse walkthrough pattern while you follow it yourself?..just try playing all maps..
WE are the players,if each one backups variety,one-map-stand will ware off.
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dEth8
Promising
Known Hero
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posted January 08, 2003 09:58 PM |
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Quote:
Psha.....
Randoms are over-rated. Everyone knows that desert war is ipso facto the one, the only and the best map that ever has been or ever will be played.
Or then again....
Perhaps 3DO and Co. just doesn't want to make a truck load more money by producing a game of unlimited replayability (well...nearly unlimited). I mean, after all they are such a sucessfull computer gaming company.... anyone checked their stock lately?
ORRRR... make more money, the greedy grubbers(not that I am against them make money and LOTS of it), by willfully holding the random generator for an expansion!
If this is the case it does piss me off quite a bit, but who gives a rip as long as I continue to lay my money down
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Tc_Fear
Famous Hero
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posted January 11, 2003 12:40 PM |
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I'm atrracted more to closed maps (seems more like heroes 3 when level 7 monsters blocked the way in random generated maps) reason 1 and reason 2 : the luck isn't so important like in open maps (i mean if u find sack of gold on dogdays in week 1 - minor artefact) u r 80 % winner.
whats the diference luck in opne or in closed
I disagree about sack of gold.there are lots of beter ones
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Azure,why you accuse walkthrough pattern while you follow it yourself?..just try playing all maps..
WE are the players,if each one backups variety,one-map-stand will ware off.
corect
almost everyone (azure too) play maps they prefer good,and knows them
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted January 11, 2003 04:26 PM |
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Memorization and better map making.
haha but I agree with azure it will become same problem as in H3. People willl only memorize maps. Need bigger maps with multiple strategies. CLosed maps are so simple in there design and thought. Both clear your side fast and break thru a choke point. How much strategy is that. It comes down to who knows the map better and can run it fastest.
Heroes 3 rankings didnt reflect the SKILL a player had in the over all game, it only showed who was a master at Desert War for example. Anytime a player is ranked on playing 1 certain map for example 100+ times it cannot give a true reflection of there talent for the game. IT only proves they are good at that map.
I hope that Heroes 4 rankings dont fall to that standard.
I disagree about closed being more fair. You made comment that in open map 1 artifact decides game. If you are playing an open map that an artifact decides game then the map you are playing SUCKS!
Take for example the new map Genesis. It is a large map with an infinite number of strategies and possibilities. The game could never be decided but 1 artifact. You need the openess to have the ability to affect the fate and outcome of the game. If the game is closed map, then you are restricted to only the elements in your area and cannot affect opponent or game until you break the choke point and by then its time to fight it out.
Bottom line is maps need to be made better. Way to many of the maps on TOH page are based off of Heroes 3 styles and designs.
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insatiable
Supreme Hero
Ultimate N00bidity
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posted January 11, 2003 09:59 PM |
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The game could never be decided
..yes,cause it could never be finished
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Way to many of the maps on TOH page are based off of Heroes 3 styles and designs.
..i just WISH this was true..just wish homm4 maps would look like homm3 in playstyle:Creatures actually fight in homm3!..in most homm4 maps heroes grow sooo powerful that poor critters usually sit and watch the fight..at some point they die,wasting a heroes strike.
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Tc_Fear
Famous Hero
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posted January 17, 2003 01:16 PM |
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thats why my favorite is dogdays
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted January 17, 2003 03:58 PM |
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that's why, in my belief, experienced and dedicated mapmakers should focus on more open or semi-closed maps, rather than closed, cause on closed some races are better than other ones and only barbarians do matter.
And for God's sake make maps W/O taverns, it destroys the whole fun in the game with hypnotise/barbarian combos ..., u can disable heroes in main town tavern as well, so u just can take heroes of your own kind and that only, just some suggestions to mapmakers ... to not make h4 redundant by barbarian to barbarian battles!
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I'm Guybrush Threepwood, mighty pirate
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted January 17, 2003 09:48 PM |
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Val -- you should try the new map Genesis. It is an open and closed map or as you called it semiclosed. But it plays more open than closed, its just you cannot walk straight to there castle etc.
And there are NO taverns.
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AzureDragonTM
Known Hero
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posted January 18, 2003 02:08 AM |
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I've just started your map Genesis with Zud.
But what thing is curious : no magic ressistance available unless u got barbarian ... well this is not good cause now order just rocks ... u stay there and u wait to be hypnotized,or teleported,or bersek .. i propose a little modification for your map Jinxer... no hero can get melle except barbarian...but all can make ressistance
I mean, let them have all ressistance as long as they don't have melle . It is more interesting like that. Or just disable hypnotize spell on that map. Or anyone will play order on that map... come on... u have 3 castles...it's hard not to get hypnotize...and mind shield is harder to get than hypnotize (yes, i do hate that spell)
All was born from chaos (not from order)
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Evil Ghost Pirate LeChuck
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted January 18, 2003 03:50 AM |
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SOunds like you need a bit more experience with heroes 4 Azure. There are plenty of counters for Hypnotise. Unless you are one of them people who only runs the map with 1 SUler Hero level 25+ If you make an actual army and have a couple heroes in your army, then Hypno is very defendable. In a recent game I had order and cast Hypno on opponants 16 Angels and he was smart enough that game to creat 2 Magic heroes so he had 2 heroes that could cast dispel at differnt times in battle. SO right after I cast hypno on Angels he simply dispeled it before angels turn. Not to mention all magic resistacne artifacts are still available, and order ward spells and artifacts etc.
I purposely removed magic resistance, so that every game would not come down to Archer/Barb showdowns. There is really no difference between an Archer and a Barb. I think it is very limiting of the game when map makers put taverns so every game can produce a Archer/Barb with magic resistance. I think with no Magic resistnce it opens up the use of more and different hero comboes.
I made this map so it would offer a differnet playing experience. Most of the other maps on TOH are all the same. I appricate any and all comments and suggestions for my map, but it sounds like people just want to convert my map into a map that plays the same as all others.
All I gotta say is open your mind to other strategies. Also I always recommend playing Genesis on Advanced mode and ALL random!! That way someone dont choose order every time. If they get it then do your best to defend it. Order is very beatable. Unless you do something silly like I did and try building Nagas one game lol =)
Jinxer
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