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| Thread: Only an idea ... |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 02:14 AM |
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Poll Question:
Only an idea ...
as the title goes it's only an idea, and i wanted to post it and see if i can get any positive (or negative, but i don't want to think of that) feedback on it.
I was thinking that as we have it now, certain players will only play a limited number of players and/or maps, that is mainly because of the maps we have. Some like open, some closed, some rush, some think that's cheesy, others like poor ... you get the point.
I will use 2 fictious players here as an example, though they really exist in our "community" in one or more cases
Player T likes small maps and/or rushable maps, he buffs up a combat hero and kills everything in way to opponent, coming when you don't expect him. On the other hand we have Player J who likes to take his time on maps, clear everything, take every last chest on map and have a "meet in the middle with all troops when i finish my side" fight, eventhough some may finish their sides faster than him. Now, as you can see, very different types of players, they're our extremities, and all of us range between their styles of play.
Now as we all "fictiously" know, player J will never play T because he thinks the other disects the map and considers that a cheesy thing to do, and player T will play rush maps with player J to ensure a sure win. From this statement we can know that J will never play T, or others close to his playstyle, only if forced by tournament/clans.
So right now we have lots of players that play 2,3 maps with 2,3 people and that makes our small community seem much smaller.
I've been playing warcraft3 lately with Arangar on bnet and I think their play system can be sort of implemented in toh, with some changes of course.
So my suggestion or idea was that from 78 maps, 75 are playable. We make 5 sets of 15 maps, we try to mix up the maps in one set, so we'll have both open and closed, rich and poor in one set(so there won't be any set choosing patterns out there, no really strong ones anyway).
Now, say player J and T choose set nr.1, it has 15 maps, both will have a right to vote off 7 maps each (so if they choose all different, there will still be a map left to play), so then each of them will eliminate the maps they hate the most and if more than 1 map remains, it is randomly chosen.
If both agree on map, they shouldn't go through all this, this is only for those who won't agree on map, like T and J.
I really think this will improve player to player relations and we would play more games that way, with more people and in the same time ruling out "our non-fun" maps.
Again, it's just a suggestion, a longshot, but it would bring some randomness back to h4, the strongest it can, map choosing one.
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 03:03 AM |
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interesting that you used the letters T and J and not just A and B 
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted October 17, 2003 07:27 AM |
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Yes Valky just cant resist poking a Jab at me any chance he gets. lol. And yes I am 100% sure you were talking about me Valky so dont even try and deny it lol.
And no I DO not insist on clearing every last spec of dust off of a side and then requesting a meeting point in middle. That was a bit exhagerated. LOL. But I will agree that I prefer to play 90% of the map. After all why put certain aspects of a map there if you have no intent or reason to use it.
No back on topic =)
I think it is great that you are wanting to try and spark some activity, but I just dont see the logic in this. As I mentioned earlier when we talked, if T (tc_fear) and J ( jinxer) cannot agree on a map then J has no interest in playing T.
As I see it there is really only one good solution, RANDOM Blind Maps. Wasnt there a beta version that slava made for random maps etc. Why dont we spend all our time and energy figuring out how it works.
I do have a 2nd idea also. This is much simpler. Lowest ranked player chooses map. Since it would stand to reason the higher ranked is better thus could stand the challenge. And if they are truely good and deserve there higher rank they can defend it on ANY map. Whereas the lower rank player has proven that he needs a small bonus or edge, and would prolly be more apt to accept and make challenges with the higher ranked players.
@ Camel. Yes I agree using the letters A & B woulda been more appropriate
Jinxer
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csarmi
Supreme Hero
gets back
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posted October 17, 2003 07:48 AM |
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Both cool ideas I think.
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Yes, I play the game only on the forums.
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MSG-1-1
Known Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 08:04 AM |
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:P
I liked the sound of random map chooser, i think that would solve atleast some problems. And more interesting to play, because everytime u start a game, u dont know what map comes out. Basically the rules are usualyl the same, no necro, circle has no might, so those could be agreed before the random thing. I hope a random map chooser will come out soon. Maybe when new season starts?
Valkys idea is also nice.
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 08:14 AM |
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Quote:
I do have a 2nd idea also. This is much simpler. Lowest ranked player chooses map. Since it would stand to reason the higher ranked is better thus could stand the challenge. And if they are truely good and deserve there higher rank they can defend it on ANY map. Whereas the lower rank player has proven that he needs a small bonus or edge, and would prolly be more apt to accept and make challenges with the higher ranked players.
well first of all Jinx, you can't make someone play the map you want just because you're a lower ranked player, that would encourage secondary accounts more than call to power did. And secondly don't tell me you'd accept let's say tyler on a map he wants, i know you're not a good example for this, but if you said it, i gotta punish you
Random map can't work for h4 ! Maps have to be thought off weeks or even months (even stinky's maps take months until they reach final version ), can't possibly do that with a random generator, unless templates can be written for it, terrain and its objects generators to ease the mapmakers' work.
P.S. : Jinx how can you possibly hope that random will be any good for you when you find only 3 maps out of 78!!! playable (2 of them being yours, and another you like so-so ... castle imbalances you say), as i told you before, take the time to try some of the maps out there, don't put them out as crap and not even look at them.
P.P.S. : about the J, T part i wanted it to make it fun so people would read it through the end, but you all get the point to what i wanted to say.
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I'm Guybrush Threepwood, mighty pirate
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted October 17, 2003 10:52 AM |
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hm.. what happends when Player V comes into the equation?
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the_teacher
Supreme Hero
Talk to the hand!
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posted October 17, 2003 12:01 PM |
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Quote:
hm.. what happends when Player V comes into the equation?
there is no V player anymore, he's ...busy
so if you intend to suggest there is a V contained in your handle, use the above sentence again, but this time remove "he's ....busy" part in order to come closer to a truth, or, and only cause i'm very generous, you can use the definition of a pseudo-player V .
have a nice day
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Arangar
Famous Hero
Weak ranger - lost viking
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posted October 17, 2003 01:21 PM |
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I voted the last option, obviously
Arangar
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Arangar
Norwegian viking
ranger of the north
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tyler
Known Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 03:20 PM |
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i want u to hit me as hard as u can
Well allow me to say that a random factor would be welcome in the choosing of maps but of some degree such as valky is sayng ... So whoever wants mapgenerator better go back to h3... That's just not for h4
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted October 17, 2003 05:39 PM |
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Valky you missed my point. Sure I play only a handful of the 75 maps. The main reason is at this point in tourny, there is a strong chance that my opponent has already played a map like seems mineral multiple times, and has mastered it or memorized it. And no you cant just look at there record and see how many times they played it, cause as TC proved you can sit up 4 nights straight with a pot of coffee and play a map in Hotseat disecting it until you squeeze every ounce of fun and mystery outta a map.
If I was 100% sure that my opponent had never played a certain map I would play ANY map with them. Even circle.
Jinxer
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 07:43 PM |
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actually what jinxer just said made some sense.
but I and other mapmakers can make maps that never need patches, but those maps will generally need to have little or no scripting in them, or will hafto go through several month testing phase, so who knows.
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 08:32 PM |
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Jinx, there are only a few players that really disect the map, and yes they are high ranked but that leaves another 40, 50 players to play with, not only 1 ! (or maybe 2, i was amazed seeing you play with targan ) so your handful includes maps + players
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I'm Guybrush Threepwood, mighty pirate
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csarmi
Supreme Hero
gets back
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posted October 17, 2003 08:49 PM |
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Blind tourney
Someone makes maps. He does not publish them. Let we have 3 maps, for example.
8 players participate, for example.
They are paired up.
One match between A and B consist of playing 3 games, one on each map. The one who wins most gets to the next round.
There is always a 3rd guy (preferably one of the directors of the tourney), who hosts.
Password protected saves.
Only 3rd guy has the map. The one he hosts. He can partcipate in the tourney too, but then he should be someone who is trusted by everybody (he shan't look in the map).
This way no training possible.
In the second round, everyone is a bit more experienced on the map, but that is still quasi-blind.
3rd round the finalists are experts of the map...
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 09:23 PM |
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how do we know the maps the mapmaker makes are not b u l l s h i t ?
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insatiable
Supreme Hero
Ultimate N00bidity
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posted October 17, 2003 10:00 PM |
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yes csarmi says it beautifuly there with only exception:
who pathetic enough to train on h4 toh? specially now that activity is half what it used to be..
however, i like idea of blindourn. but make a map only for that.. i wouldnt say.
maybe if same template be used.. like one camel makes a drawing, and others make 3 maps out of it.. (i cant offer im on the made for next 2 month)
as for being suck or not..hey what if MapCouncil check em first? you know what map council is eh camhl?
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tyler
Known Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 10:39 PM |
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Dont u guys get it? Valky is right .....BECOSE he's romanian 
Damn i'm drunk 
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Sir, we are surrounded! Excellent, now we can attack in any direction!
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted October 17, 2003 11:37 PM |
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well ves, are you willing to support somethin like this?
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted October 18, 2003 04:51 AM |
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look how my idea goes down the drain ... damn
i should stick to tossing
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I'm Guybrush Threepwood, mighty pirate
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted October 18, 2003 05:57 AM |
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wait-- that wasnt tossing?
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