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| Thread: The real definition of LOVE. there is no hurt. | |
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted December 25, 2003 11:02 AM |
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The real definition of LOVE. there is no hurt.
I think love is majorly misdefined in our society. It is confused with many things that have little to do with love. We are indoctrinated with television and novels, but deep at the heart of the issue we find love hard to define.
Many refer to love as the most desirable thing in the world, some say it's painful, some distinguish love and true love.
Before we define love, two major misconceptions must be dealt with.
1) Mixing up love with attraction.
They can go together, but are in fact separate things.
You can be attracted to someone sexually and not love them, you just want physical proximity and some action 
You can be attracted to someone for their status, position, or their looks. You want to be with them because it enhances your sense of yourself, your ego, or maybe it's pleasurable or simply more convenient. You may be attracted to someone's listening to you, to what they see you as, etc. You are attracted to an aspect or a few aspects of them and want to have that around as much as possible. Being attracted to aspects of a person has nothing to do with love.
The person who is an object of attraction does not usually feel loved for who they are in the long term.
Many relationships fall apart when people are together because of attraction to few aspects of each other. Then that attraction may become lost or outweighted with negative experiences.
2) Mixing up love with creating an ideal.
Very common with parents who have preconcieved ideas about what their child should be, and treat their child in a way as to shape the child to become their preconcieved idea. This is an endless saga - the child feels lack of caring and respect for who they are, while the parent is utterly convinced that this is love and they are doing their best, and often indoctrinate their children as to how ungrateful their reactions are. Same happens in relationships when one partner tries to shape another to be a certain way by using various means. Essentially, this is trying to make another being conduct themselves a certain way, for the purpose of personal satisfaction. That can be moral satisfaction of a parent, or a partner's satisfaction with what a great partner they've got. Ideals are based on preconcieved ideas that often do not apply to the recipient of such love.
Some people manage to manipulate others to behave a certain way by convincing them that this manipulation is actually love and hence should be welcomed.
The object of this kind of "love" often resents the experience in the long term.
Love has nothing to do with attraction or creating an ideal, what is it...?
Love is wanting for another what they want for themselves.
Haven't you felt the most loved
when you want to be known by them and they want to know you,
when you want to be close with someone and they want you to be close with them,
when you want their support and they want to support you,
when you want to be alone for a while and they want you to be alone for a while,
when you want to see them all the time and they want you to see them all the time,
when you want to be someone and they want you to be that someone?
Have you ever felt pain when someone wanted for you what you want for yourself? (Unless you want pain for yourself, of course we can be masochists, but then it's not the kind of pain you wouldn't want )
And can you be hurt when your loved one leaves? No. If you do love them, you want for them what they want for themselves, even when what they want is to be away from you. In love, them having what they want is the ultimate joy.
And IMAGINE when you love someone, and they love you and you both want for the other what the other wants for themselves. If one wants something, the other wants the same for them. Frankly, I can't imagine this, but if there's one thing I'm up for experiencing in this lifetime, this is it. This is love. Distilled from misconceptions.
In this way of looking at love, there is no true love, and there is no unconditional love, as there is either love or conditionality. Either you love someone - want for them what they want for themselves, or you make conditions that you will only love them if .....
Ego prevents love.
Loving yourself is important and I think should be above loving others, as you if you love your offender more than you love yourself, you're supposed to help them do the offence to you 
Now I don't think I love anybody... 
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You can wait for others to do it, but if they don't know how, you'll wait forever.
Be an example of what you want to see on HC and in the world.
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com
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hamsi128
Promising
Supreme Hero
tosser tavern owner
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posted December 25, 2003 12:02 PM |
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted December 26, 2003 01:27 AM |
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Nope, I'm just an aquarius.
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You can wait for others to do it, but if they don't know how, you'll wait forever.
Be an example of what you want to see on HC and in the world.
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com
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laelth
Famous Hero
Laelth rhymes with stealth.
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posted December 26, 2003 05:08 AM |
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The ancient greeks had four separate words to describe the various "kinds" of love. While the English language has more words than any other in the world, it is woefully inadequate in its treatment of "love" in its various forms.
Let me begin by saying that I do not intend to tell people what love "is." Like everything else, love is what we say it is. I love my house, for example. I love my wife. I love my children. I love a good steak. We use the word "love" to describe all these feelings. Thus, I am asking you, the reader, not to have a knee-jerk reaction and think "Oh, no. That's not what love is. I know what love is, Laelth, and you're wrong. You don't really love your house."
If you take that attitude you'll miss the point I'm trying to make. Love "is" what we say it is, and the word "love" is used in all those senses. So, if you want to define the word "love," then your definition has to encompass all those meanings, and not just a romanticized, idealized, "here's what love ought to be" definition. With that in mind, here's the best I can come up with.
Love is a strong, emotional bond created between persons and things or persons and other persons that is, principally, determined by the level of "investment" that exists between the two entities.
Time, of course, is the principal factor that governs our level of investment, but sleeping with someone will certainly bump up the old investment level quickly, just as will seeing your own genetic code made manifest in the flesh of another. Interesting, no?
No drooling, no tears ...  ... just a plain, common-sense definition that encompasses all the ways the word "love" is really used.
-Laelth
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Alan P. Taylor, Attorney at Law, LLC
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consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted December 26, 2003 08:23 AM |
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I disagree with you both
You are both wrong. It's ok that you're wrong because that's part of finding out what love is. Laelth you are closest but still too far to know. To answer your question Valeriy and Laelth here is the answer.
Love is poetry and time.
Poetry is life in no specified description. That is where you both fall short. Don't even attempt to describe love because you can't no one can. Only write your poems and see them play out in the fashion that only you as the author would know. You and I and we all are our own authors. Life is the book. Your poems are the truth that will stand the test of time. I challenge you both to let go of description and courageously write a poem in any way you feel. The key is to let your heart out on to the pages for everyone to see. Only then can you know love after you've looked at your poems as the time went passed and you both realized that was truly how it was for you when you wrote it. Relations with people....places....things....it's all a part of your poem, and the collection of your poems will be your book. How beautiful and unique each of our stories must be if we all decided to be honest and write the truth.
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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hamsi128
Promising
Supreme Hero
tosser tavern owner
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posted December 26, 2003 09:08 AM |
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love bites
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted December 26, 2003 09:50 AM |
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To know anythang about love look up former threads of my replys & you will understand what it is all about.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Romana
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Thx :D
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posted December 26, 2003 01:50 PM |
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To me love is the eye in the storm, the safe haven, the constant in chaos
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted December 27, 2003 03:55 AM |
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A perfect example of one persons definition of love.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted December 28, 2003 08:56 AM |
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Consis,
bah, I understand that you disagree, but to say that both me and Laelth are wrong... I'd rather think everyone is right in their own way, as for example my description does not encompass relationships to physical objects and Laelth's does.
Let me challenge your definition then. So, if you love steak, it is poetry and time? Or what about accountants who love each other and never wrote a poem in their life?
If you mean poetry as the most accurate way of describing being present in the state of love, how do you know you are in fact present in a state of love? And given that words are non-totally encompassing categorical descriptions of commonly percievable phenomena, and that poetry uses words, it may not be very accurate. Isn't then your own feeling the most accurate as it is what is being described? But then describing is out of the question and we have nothing to speculate about! Ouch. Or are you suggesting we best speculate using poetry? How do we know that this paragraph is not poetry?
Having read Consis' and Laelth's posts, I must clarify what I was talking about in my first post. I was talking about the kind of love between human beings that does not cause pain, and looking at practical ways of assisting that experience by moving beyond several confusions. And as Laelth points out, that is what I say love is - wanting for another what they want for themselves. I don't dispute anyone else's definitions by the way, they make perfect sense. I was just getting back at Consis for calling me wrong, eh eh, big ego me
____________
You can wait for others to do it, but if they don't know how, you'll wait forever.
Be an example of what you want to see on HC and in the world.
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted December 29, 2003 12:45 AM |
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Exactly my point Valiery.
No one is wrong because you cant change the way a person really feels about love.
I have my own definition, you have a diferent definition,consis,ROmana & everyone in this world, some may come close to the same but theres always a slight diference.
The great thang about all those definitions is that it's all love.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted December 29, 2003 07:38 AM |
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Hey Valeriy
Hey Valeriy,
I disagree with any description of love. No poetry is not a description and neither is time. Poetry lives and breathes just like we people do. Time moves on and reminds us to hold each our own individual experiences with love dear and close to our hearts. Love cannot be described only lived. Are adjectives used in poetry? Yes, but that doesn't mean a poem is a riddle or a coloring book. As I said a poem is a truth to one's own self. Let time be the judge. I feel like you have a lot of love in your heart Valeriy. You don't have to say that you have love for people to notice that. It's simply how you live. And yes your life is a poem. I tell you I can describe a poem but not love. All I know is that I like love. I like talking to you and Aculias and Laelth. Everyone wants to try and describe love but I say live it. Live it through your own special poems and leave it for time to judge. Don't go back and change something about it. Don't second guess yourselves about its true meaning. Just feel it. Once you've felt it you have lived it. I guess I just think poems are so important. Sometimes when you're confused about something or someone and a poem is written about it then after you've read it and came back to read it again then it suddenly becomes clear whatever it was you may have been confused about.
Yup, I love....love. It's there you just have to live it.
____________
Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted December 29, 2003 11:57 AM |
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Well since you dont like to listen since you are both correct Consis heres an example  .
I love you Consis?
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Dreaming of a Better World
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hamsi128
Promising
Supreme Hero
tosser tavern owner
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posted December 29, 2003 04:12 PM |
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people loves themselves, you love someone because you loves yourself and you think that she(he) is for you, you think you deserve him or her...
love hurts because its unanswered many times , love hurts because you couldnt satisfy the love to yourself...
ego above else you write poems when the loves is unanswered mostly... the target of love poems are you ,not the person you used to satisfy your ego
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jaxxa
Tavern Dweller
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posted December 29, 2003 04:14 PM |
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But what is true love? for me love is unity.
beeing one, yet different alike. my morals of love are trust, loyalty, respect. trusting the beloved, and them trusting you. beeing loyal to them and they to you, respecting them and they you.
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may wisdom guide you on your path!
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consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted December 29, 2003 07:58 PM |
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Aculias
Well I love you too! Hahaha, it's all good right? Yes, indeed perhaps we are Aculias.
Juliet:
'Tis but thy name that is my enemy;-
Thou art thyself though, not a Montague.
What's Montague? it is nor hand, nor foot,
nor arm, nor face, nor any other part
Belonging to a man. O, be some other name!
What's in a name! that which we call a rose
by any other name would smell as sweet;
So Romeo would, were he not Romeo call'd,
Retain that dear perfection which he owes
Without that title:-Romeo, doff thy name;
And for that name, which is no part of thee,
Take all myself.
"Romeo and Juliet"(Act II, scene 1) written by: William Shakespear(1564 A.D. - 1616)
Hey if we're going to talk about love how could I not quote him? I just want to spread the love. I feel he had some great poems!
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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Shadowcaster
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Shaded Scribe
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posted December 29, 2003 08:17 PM |
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My 2 cents
I agree wholeheartedly with the notion that love is different for everyone. Your experiences with love will change your views. Just as no human has unconditional, unalterable love, nobody can have such a view. I'm sure that if we all checked back to this thread in even 5 years, we would all find something that we had believed that we now do not.
In my opinion, love is like the wind. You know it's there, you can feel it, but you cannot hope to contain or control it. All that we can hope to do is harness that wind and hope that it carries us in the right direction.
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>_>
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hamsi128
Promising
Supreme Hero
tosser tavern owner
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posted January 07, 2004 12:18 PM |
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love..... money?
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consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted January 08, 2004 06:48 AM |
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Hug O' War
Hug O' War
I will not play at tug o' war.
I'd rather play at hug o' war,
Where everyone hugs
Instead of tugs,
Where everyone giggles
And rolls on the rug,
Where everyone kisses,
And everyone grins,
And everyone cuddles,
And everyone wins.
"Where The Sidewalk Ends" by Shel Silverstein
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted January 08, 2004 09:53 AM |
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In my experience, there is love after hurt. Take enough blows in life and all that remains is deep unconditional love for all the world.
To be brave is to be afraid - but to still do what is needed.
To be heroic is to give up your own happyness for that of others.
To love.. is to go beyond life.
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