|
| Thread: World Peace Possible? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · «PREV |
|
frostwolf
Famous Hero
livin' in a bottle of vodka
|
posted June 16, 2004 11:26 PM |
|
|
First of all, thank you Consis. Your point of view is one which I also agree with.
Now about what Sihastro sayd: it's impossible for acountry to become so powerful to rule all. A few thousand years of history have proved that no empire can last. If they couldn't do it when it was enough to have better armour, weapons and tactics, how could they do it now? Just think about the roman empire compared to the rest of the world then. The romans were the most advaced, most civilised people (the greeks too, but Rome's military had no equal). Now think that although the conquered very much of the world, their downfall came from within the empire. it is impossible for a nation to control other nations directly for a long time.
____________
What can you expect from a world where everybody lives because they're too afraid to commit suicide?
|
|
bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
|
|
posted June 16, 2004 11:29 PM |
|
|
If life is an experiment, then the reason should be to find a way to reach world peace through love. The more people that use human greed as an excuse to not chose love, the further away from peace we get.
And in the end, the choice must be yours; to surrender to evil - and gain worldly wealth, or to burn at a stake built of ideals - and lose worldly wealth.
Until we all chose love together - I will burn
|
|
Shirastro
Famous Hero
Happy happy joy joy
|
|
posted June 17, 2004 01:07 AM |
|
|
Quote:
First of all, thank you Consis. Your point of view is one which I also agree with.
Now about what Sihastro sayd: it's impossible for acountry to become so powerful to rule all. A few thousand years of history have proved that no empire can last. If they couldn't do it when it was enough to have better armour, weapons and tactics, how could they do it now? Just think about the roman empire compared to the rest of the world then. The romans were the most advaced, most civilised people (the greeks too, but Rome's military had no equal). Now think that although the conquered very much of the world, their downfall came from within the empire. it is impossible for a nation to control other nations directly for a long time.
i never said that a contry should achive dominance with military. Such dominace could only be temporary, as in the case you mentioned.
A true dominance is achive trugh cultural conquest. Globalisation to put it simple. Something that is happening for few decades already.
This kind of diminance is much harder to estingush and its still to be proved that its should be estingished aniway.
We could even say that McDonalds are the best thing ever happen couse it will bring the world peace........creepy thought.
____________
And now to the next post.
|
|
Svarog
Honorable
Supreme Hero
statue-loving necrophiliac
|
|
posted June 17, 2004 02:27 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Total controle. Once one country become so powerful, in economical, cultural and miltary sense world peace will happen.
Looks like we've got another Gavin Magnus on the loose. 
Shirastro, although I'd not argue that what you're saying is impossible, I will stronly defend that it's inhumane and brutal. It is in fact what Hitler had in mind, and I would fight against as long as I live, if such situation ever comes.
Quote:
Its in human nature to fight to have more. Its our primitiv/animal aspect of our subconciusnes to make us do thing we say we are againts.
It's in our human nature to have enough, not abundance. The man's lust for more, I believe is artificially created by the society we live in. But one should know that theoretically a state of harmonical balance exists when all people's share of wealth would be fair and equal and every atempt to gain more would be counterproductive. All we need to do is reprogram our minds and spice them up with more empathy and knowledge, in order for that state to come. And that state is called - Communism! 
Quote:
If you ask anibody if he would like that his country go to war with another one, he will say no without thinking. But if you assure him that this war will bring more money to his country giving him and his children better and more secure future, he will think twice before standing behind his pacifistic ideals.
If you are talking to a well-educated individual he would know that mutual gain can be achieved only through cooperation, not war. That's why I say, if the world gets educated enough, just maybe a lasting world peace is possible.
Quote:
Fighting and killing are bad things, but in the same time they are one of our most basilar natural instincts, and will only stop once we have no means to fight with.
Wrong. It's in our human nature to have enough resources, security and freedom. And fighting is not in human nature independantly. Man only resorts to it when he feels his other needs threatened. Again, education is the key, in order to be made aware of other people's needs and how to please them (but not through war).
____________
The meek shall inherit the earth, but NOT its mineral rights.
|
|
Vadskye91
Promising
Supreme Hero
Back again
|
posted June 17, 2004 06:58 PM |
|
|
If life were an experiment, then it failed.
____________
Knowledge is power...
|
|
Peacemaker
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Peacemaker = double entendre
|
|
posted June 18, 2004 03:14 PM |
|
|
Watching the way my son operates, I tend to believe that it may be possible if we keep building on our future generations to strive for it.
He is a very placid soul; he defends ants and bugs from other little boys who want to play with them by killing them; he entices me to catch spiders in the house and let them go outside rather than killing them. He does not fight with his friends except to argue about which game to play or whose turn it is. When other kids argue and fight he sits quietly aside until they are done, and if he gets involved at all he tends to be a peacemaker rather than a troublemaker.
He is very affectionate and gets very concerned when a living thing faces any kind of peril. He cries every time he sees other people, especially the little children, suffering in Iraq and other places of the world. When a baby bird fell from the nest and got trapped in the bushes a few weeks ago, he kept a careful eye on it for several hours until it was able to regain enough strength to test its wings again and fly away.
If I had not seen him in action myself I would have trouble believing a seven-year-old, testosterone-laden boy would have such a nature. Perhaps the nature of this little boy is just an unusual case and not an indication of things to come, perhaps not.
If more and more children are provided every opportunity to be gentle and kind, to care and be invested in the well-being of all other living things, then maybe, just maybe, in several generations we might have a chance.
But we are very fortunate and do not live in a place where there is a lot of hatred and violence going on around us to make us respond differently than we do. I wonder if there is ever any hope of breaking that cycle in such places.
|
|
Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
|
posted June 18, 2004 03:41 PM |
|
Edited By: Consis on 18 Jun 2004
|
Bursting Your Bubble...
That's a quaint little story about your son Peacemaker. I too keep my children in the protected bounds of my parental responsibilities. We really do wish our children didn't have to see the things we see, don't we? I know I think this at times. It's instinctive; protection of the offspring; ensurance of the continuation of ones own genes.
It is good to know that your son has a heart that is warm to the touch. I can tell that his kindness is a shared experience. But the child will one day be a man. As I am a man I can tell you some things that men know. Men know, remember, and keep it always safe, the time they spend with their mothers. This boy of yours is a fine lad but in time he will come to know that death is as much a part of our existence as life is. We cannot save the world Peacemaker. We can only do our best within the limits of each our own single persons. There is only so much that one man or woman is capable of. I hope you teach him to know his limits. I believe that to know your limits is to be able to exceed them.
For some, death brings cold harsh reality ever so clear to the human perspective. For others, it can inspire, devastate, ignore, and remind us that we are only human. Whatever the case, my friend, both your son and mine will know what it is to be a man in a world filled with people whose decisions may change that world. Sometimes for the better and unfortunately sometimes for the gruesome worse.
~Consis
____________
Roses Are Red And So Am I
|
|
Peacemaker
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Peacemaker = double entendre
|
|
posted June 18, 2004 04:26 PM |
|
|
Hey Consis! Howya been?
Thanks for the response. And yes, I shudder to think what my boy will see and experience. But I haven't sheltered him from much so far, which is the reason he has seen the images of war I referred to. In my experience Indians tend to tell their children about the goodness and badness of the world, to discuss and explain when we can, rather than shelter them from the harsh realities.
As for death, my son and I have talked much about this subject. My boy refers to death as "the next world" because that's what I have told him it is. I have told him many people believe that it is the next step in our being as souls and that the Earth is just the first learning ground, and that I am one of those people who believes this. Perhaps I have indoctrinated my boy on this topic despite my declarations that I refrain from indoctrinating him. However, I have also told him that nobody really knows what comes next because once you go there you can't come back to tell others (except for the controvercial near-death experiences of course).
At any rate, he is aware of an ending on this planet. I have tried to give him the option that it is not necessarily to be feared but is a perfectly natural part of life that happens to every living thing. He seems to be able to distinguish between a natural death, and death that unnecessarily shortens the time on Earth, which should be enjoyed to its fullest as a learning experience to be a loving and helpful part of the process of life on Earth.
|
|
Nidhgrin
Honorable
Famous Hero
baking cookies from stardust
|
|
posted June 19, 2004 04:22 PM |
|
|
...just dropping by, but making time to write a short post...
Good to see you Peacemaker, Consis, Svarog! It's always a pleasure to read your posts 
About raising children and possible 'indoctrination' I think it's good to be self-critical and careful because it is a serious responsability. But about uncertain things like life after death... I believe it's better to give your children something, something you believe in, something that makes you feel safe and confident in and can pass on to them... than nothing at all.
Personally I believe after death it's just worms and flowers for me. Life's cycle completes and I'm litterally reborn in the bodies of hundreds or thousands of plants and organisms. As to the spiritual part I think I will never die. The people I meet, live with and talk to pick up things from me and pass it on. Just as I pick up things from them and pass those on. Over time these thoughts, ideas and memories become part of some sort of great common pool of knowledge and habits, containing both 'good' and 'bad' things. Every human being has an influence on that future pool, no matter how long his or her life is. The choice to contribute to that pool in a good, or in a bad way is personal and I have made my choice. That's my view on life after death. It makes me feel safe, makes me feel immortal. It makes me live my life the way I do.
I don't think it really matters what you believe in though as long as there is something Fear is our worst enemy. Fear is what makes us go to war, is what makes us behave intolerantly against other 'different' human beings. If you can give your boy answers to questions like what happens after life and those answers give him peace and comfort, I don't think you need to worry about indoctrination and you're doing just fine The thruth in answers to questions like that can't be deducted from a flat mathematical formula or something, it's a gem with so many facets I'm sure your view of life after this life is just as right as mine or anyone elses.
World peace possible? Who knows... When today's biggest nations and greatest civilizations remain afraid of each other, when ordinary citizens carry guns when walking on the street because they're in constant fear. When thousands of nuclear warheads are pointing in either direction everywhere on the world to make sure their possible enemies won't attack them, then no. Refreshing to read Shirastro's post aswell, as I think that's about the exact opposite of how I believe world peace could be achieved. When you enforce impossibly strict laws and wield weapons of fear to push the people into a straightjacket of order you would have a form of 'peace' for a while indeed... until enough rebels and freedom fighters would unite and try to overthrow that system. It would never ever work.
There will always be violence I think. Though it disgusts me thoroughly it seems we have a history of violence, possibly it's even one of the reasons our species was so succesful. We simply invented ways to get rid of all threats we ever faced. If there are enough people who form little oasises of peace and understanding though, people who get enough others behind them. If children grow up as thinkers, not just accepting all the things they see in movies and games, with an open mind then who knows perhaps world peace is not such a silly idea. It's a nice thing to dream of anyway.
Really nice to read the story about your son PM Especially the part about putting spiders outside the house, I used to do just the same thing when I was a kid hehe, drove my mom insane who just wanted them squiched so they couldn't ever come back Perhaps a rather pessimistic view, but I don't think a lot of kids are like your son unfortunately. Most kids don't even ask questions at all these days it seems, they just consume and follow as society dictates them to do. On the other hand who knows perhaps he will grow up to be one of those persons with such an aura of peace around them other people just follow and carry out more peace and sensitivity
|
|
Peacemaker
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Peacemaker = double entendre
|
|
posted June 19, 2004 06:46 PM |
|
|
Hello Niddy! So nice to see you passing through!
It warms my heart that you had similarities with my son when you were a boy. Nothing could please me more than to have him grow up to become a person such as yourself.
|
|
Svarog
Honorable
Supreme Hero
statue-loving necrophiliac
|
|
posted June 20, 2004 04:09 AM |
|
|
Seeing the difficult challanges you HC parents meet while raising your kids, I'm really glad that my potential son is still waiting comfortably in my scortum.
____________
The meek shall inherit the earth, but NOT its mineral rights.
|
| |
|
|
