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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 08, 2001 05:26 PM |
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Events, victories and losses.
As a mapmaker I am encountered some problems with events and victory and loss conditions.
First of all I want that in event there would be story and resource gaining before and after the combat. And some alternatives how to act like yes or no. Example:
You have found old boots on the ground and you see large pile of gold far behind it. But you see some monstrosities guarding between boots and gold. Do you want to pick boots? Yes. You pick the old boots (You got them on to your inventory). Monsters don`t seem to notice or care. Do you want to gather the gold? Yes. (Now monsters attacks seeing that you are trying to take their gold). After the glorious battle you have gathered 10 000 gp.
And another thing I want too is dialogues in events like:
Old hairy Gremlin asks you: "Where`s my gruudroerx -machine is?". And you could answer: 1. "My pet dragon ate it." 2. I don`t know. 3. "Warriors. Execute this gremlin and burn his home."
One last major thing to the events would be that you can choose that they are available only to computer players.
I want that player would wint the game by destroying one certain player like Blue for instance. Same is true for losing (you lose the game if your ally, green, has lost all his heroes and towns.)
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ArchAngel_86
Tavern Dweller
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posted August 08, 2001 06:51 PM |
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Good Idea.....
It seems like a reasonable idea, although, I think it would be complicated for 3DO to do. I mean, making the gremlin's home burn down, they'd have to add a picture of the house burning to make it look good. But your first idea with the yes and no, that was pretty good. I think it would be easy for 3DO to do.
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 08, 2001 07:00 PM |
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Another idea.....
Town Events
I would want an event that enables some monsters to attack your town. Before that attack happens, player should automatically have a change to buy some units to defend that town. Of course map maker should have an option to deny the player to buy those units. Same is applied for heroes (looking forward to hero events  ). Like your hero is camped for night and some creatures attacks your camp.
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 09, 2001 06:54 PM |
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Again an idea.....
I want that there could be multiple events on the same hex.
It could include two battles (of course this could be added to normal events. You could modify how many battles there will be in event). And in event should be possibility that Hero joins you (or fights against you).
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Sauron
Tavern Dweller
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posted August 09, 2001 07:24 PM |
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I like the idea
I think that making decision situations like the first post would be a great idea. That's one of the things that made Baulder's Gate such a great game. It definatly should be included in Heroes 4 if 3D0 can find the time!
For those of you who don't know what I'm talking about, whenever you encounter a monster, artifact or another hero etc, a message would appear and you would get to pick from one of many replies. For example:
(this would happen while walking down a trail on the world map)
As you walk down the path an Ogre Prince appears with many guards and says "Where is my amulet"
(You pick one of the following responses)
1. I know not of what you speak, I am simply a weary traveler
2. Come and get it
3. I'll give it to you for a small price
4. Fool, you know not to whom you speak. Men, kill them all!
(Then, depending on what you pick to say, the ogres will act on it. Say for Instance you picked "Come and get it" the Ogres would probably attack you. Whereas if you picked "I know not of what you speak, I am simply a weary traveler" they wouldn't.)
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Oldtimer
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Please leave a message after..
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posted August 09, 2001 07:29 PM |
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This stuff seems more inline with baldurs gate or other role playing games. It would change the nature of the game.
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<PLEASE DO NOT WAKE THE OLD MAN!>
"Zzzz...Zzzz...Zzzz..."
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 09, 2001 10:06 PM |
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Here`s still one: I would like that monsters and places such like learning stone or windmill could include events on them. Like you enter to the garden of knowledge and found in there 5 crystals and 5 gems or you enter into Cyclop`s Stockpile and cyclops have made a trap to you and you lose some troops and morale because of that.
This ideas will add more flexibility to the map editor and now story oriented maps can be more like roleplay. This is some minor changes in events that I would love to see in HoMM4
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 11, 2001 01:24 AM |
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Is all people skipping this topic? Because Thunder has writed it? Like: "Events, victories and losses." "Yes. Sounds interesting. Oh hell, it`s made by Thunder. Better not to waste time reading it."
And to the new ideas:
I would want that guests could be also been given in towns (or in any other adventure map object). Also I want that you could have more than one guest in one place. For example:
Lynxia gives you a mission in his hut to collect some money for him. So you return to the hut giving her the money. Lynxia gives you some spell points and asks if you could search for her ring. After you have found her ring and returned it to her she gives you some more points and kindly asks if you could get rid of the nearby gnolls which are harrassin Lynxia. (and here is another idea: Those gnolls whould have emerged to the map (as somekind of event) next to Lynxia`s hut.) You complete the missions until Lynxia have run out of the guests. And here`s another idea: Same Lynxia could have new guests after a month or so.
Another thing is that there could be multiple quest complete requirements and rewards: Xar gives you a mission to bring him 40 peasants so he could train his necromancy skill and sametime asks that you could bring him Boots of Dead and 1000 gold. And as a reward Xar gives you a Everglowing Ring Of Sulfur and 2 Bone Dragons.
All ideas, we (I?) have discussed in this topic could greatly increase the depth of Heroes 4. I`ll keep this topic alive as long as I have good ideas to say. I just hope that there would be more replies....
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UnkaHaakon
Responsible
Famous Hero
happily tilting at windmills
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posted August 11, 2001 11:41 AM |
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Some of your ideas sound very much like they can be implemented using the new script system (creatures attacking as a result of choosing one thing or another to pick up, for example)
Frankly, it's late, and I'm too tired to give this all the attention it deserves at this time. But, I'll think about it and get back to you.
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Some people say the glass is half full..Some people say it's half empty... I say "What're you asking me to drink?"
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 11, 2001 04:24 PM |
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Again one:
Although this seems pretty much same like that creature appearing, there could be timelines in events. For instance here is a timeline of 100 days, so you must step on the event before hundred days is passed or it`s wasted. Another time thing is that event could become functional when 100 days have passed. Or you have to be on certain date on stepping on that event, like: Month 2, Week 4, Day 7.
That creature thing could be applied for heroes too.......
And if this things are too late to be in Heroes4, why there is topics which discuss of the spells, which could be in Heroes 4? I think that these ideas could be easy to muster into Heroes 4
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Draco
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted August 11, 2001 07:30 PM |
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another idea would be to allow a cancel attack option when you are atacking someone
ie. you approch "Solmyr" would you still like to attack
(showing all his men and stats)
yes/no
maybe the closer to a hero you get the more detailed his army is to you
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted August 11, 2001 10:47 PM |
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Thunder...
I agree with Unkahaakon about that new script system will possible make almost all these true.
It seems that you can do many kinds of things with that new script system I'm not sure about that those choices when asking question. There is possibly only yes or no prompt. But I like your ideas.
Why people don't answers to this thread? There are too many threads I think. As Valeriy said newcomers shouldn't post about something that is talked already to end. People are distracted and will post to different threads. This is just one thread among others and there aren't really so many active posters here that are interested about these things. I'm kind of sad about this fact because I came to this forum talk about ideas for HoMM. Same goes in 3do community. Same subjects are discussed in many threads almost with same people. There are people who don't ever even really make effort to post something important just try to make chat line. I respect you Thunder as you made effort to post your ideas. I'm sorry to say am I the right person to comment these right now because I'm kinda want to wait for HoMM4 and see how things are there. We have heard some facts about it but not all and of course it's really fun to talk about these all things but it seems most of the discussions aren't really important to other people and it puts me really down. Why to discuss if there are only same few people saying the same things hundred times? We need some new active members here into the forum and I very much would like to see this community to "born again" after HoMM IV comes out. I want to see people talk about game, telling how they like it, how they see it in the future, how they see upcoming possible expansions and stuff like that. Right now people are maybe waiting for HoMM IV and think everything we talk here is unnecessary and it's too late suggestions. I really hate to see that some great discussions that I thought would go forever and would be great to discuss are gone "down" to other pages than this first one. And from there they aren't noticed and even those few active posters leave them there.
I just wan to say that I came from trip and maybe I'm kinda hooked to this forum as I came right here as quickly as I was home. But I see that this community hasn't really increased it's depth of discussion and that's why this subject and some others too are left unnoticed and are only favored by few posters.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted August 13, 2001 03:27 PM |
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I haven`t heard much of that new script system but if it makes all this things possible it cannot be bad. Where I can get information of it?
Also, even if this could be possible by that script, I would want that guests could come to you like in town event shape.
Also it could be nice to include journal like in Baldur`s Gate to Heroes. There wouldn`t come only guests but some major events too and storyline. Of course mapeditor could decide what to put on journal and when.
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted August 13, 2001 05:00 PM |
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It is in Gamespot or Astral Wizard site that interview in which Gus talks about scrip system. You should also find through Celestial Heavens site...
That journal is good idea. Also I would like to see "history" where there could be listed place where each hero has visited and when you have bought creatures and upgraded towns. This would especially help everyone understand tactics as you could go through your earlier things like what mistakes you have done and such.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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UnkaHaakon
Responsible
Famous Hero
happily tilting at windmills
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posted August 14, 2001 08:37 AM |
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Since we're discussing scripts, here's what Gus said
Quote:
Scripts can be used anywhere where you would have used placed events or timed events in Heroes III. You can also attach scripts to individual heroes which are triggered when the hero enters combat or is killed or captured. Seer's huts, of course, can be scripted, as can victory conditions.
To create a script, you'll use a series of dialogs. A script is a series of actions, drawn from a list of about 30 choices. For example, you can give or remove creatures, artifacts, skills, spells, experience, and materials. When you add an action to a script, you get a dialog showing the various properties of the action, such as the target, and how much or what to change.
The most important new actions are the conditional and question actions. If the condition is true, or the player answers "yes", the game executes one set of actions. If not, it executes a different set. This means that the storyline can follow the player's actions much more closely than was possible before.
There are roughly 20-30 things you can test in a conditional, such as whether a specific hero, skill, creature, or artifact is present. You can also test variables that you set in actions, so you can record whether the player has accomplished a task, or visited a location.
In general, anything you could do in a Pandora's Box, placed event, town event, or timed event can be done with a script.
Some of the things this means might include:
A warning of an ambush if Scouting is present, possibly not having the ambush happen in that case.
Truly interesting victory conditions, like having a character become an Archmage.
Having one victory condition for an early win, and later in the game a different victory condition.
Having a special effect when a hero enters a certain combat. For instance, a Paladin who gains extra experience from killing ghost dragons?
Lots of interesting possibilities here. And this powerful new tool for map makers means the truly great maps will be even more special than before.
Moderator's note:This topic has been closed, as it refers to an older version of the game. To discuss Heroes 3, please go to Library Of Enlightenment, to discuss Heroes 4, please go to War Room Of Axeoth.
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Some people say the glass is half full..Some people say it's half empty... I say "What're you asking me to drink?"
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