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| Thread: The complete hero list including all 37 advanced classes... |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Oldtimer
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Please leave a message after..
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posted October 22, 2001 08:41 PM |
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You have to upgrade your secondary skills to upgrade your primary, you cannot just zip up to grand master primary, secondary skills must be at a (expert or master?) level to level up.
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<PLEASE DO NOT WAKE THE OLD MAN!>
"Zzzz...Zzzz...Zzzz..."
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted October 22, 2001 09:35 PM |
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Jenova: Look at it this way.
There are nine groups of 4 skills each, for a total of 36 skills.
Each skill has five levels called: Basic, Advanced, Expert, Master and Grand Master
You can be proficient in no more than 5 groups.
Within each of the nine groups the following apply:
* The skill which you must learn first is called the Primary skill, the other three are called Secondary skills.
* You are prohibited from learning the secondary skills until you have at least Basic level in the Primary skill.
* Once you have the Primary skill, to advance it further you need to learn the secondary skill and advance them to certain levels. (We don't know exactly how you will be restricted, but it seems that you'll have requirements for the secondaries to advance the Primary to Expert, Master or Grand Master.)
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At level up you are offered three skills:
1. An increase of the level of a skill (primary or secondary) you already have. ((You can be offered only skills where you have met all the prerequisites for this skill.))
2. A new secondary skill on Basic level. (The Primary skill you have will decide which secondaries you may be offered.)
3. A new Primary skill. (Assuming you don't already have skills in 5 groups.)
Advancing skill strategies
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1. You want to advance the skills in the group you start with.
This is easy. Just avoid picking a new Primary skill and just advance the first skill. Each time you'll be offered two skills within the group, so this will be easy and you can also steer to a certain degree which skills you develope first.
2. You want to advance the skills in a group, but it's not the group your hero starts with.
This is more difficult. The more groups you have open, the more seldom you will be offered a skill in the group you want. Therefore, use the approach "don't select any new primary skills" until you get offered the primary skill of the group you want. After that, avoid picking a third primary skill and hope for the best in the choices you get offered.
Do notice that getting the group you want may be very difficult if you select a class that won't get the Primary skill easily. This is especially so for the magic skills. It's very difficult to get non-allied magic skill groups.
So if you really want to learn Death Magic, make sure you don't start with Life Magic or Nature Magic, and recruit a Hero type from either Academy, Asylum, or the might Hero from Necropolis since they are more likely to be offered Death Magic.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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StormWarning
Promising
Famous Hero
Archmage of Thunder
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posted October 22, 2001 10:32 PM |
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Preserver...
About the Good Witch/Bad Witch thing, maybe "Beastmaster" for Nature/Chaos and "Summoner" for Nature/Death.
And I think it's likely that the primaries are listed in the order that she got them, but you have to have a certain level with it to qualify for the advanced class - probably either master or expert. And Fiona only has Advanced Combat, so that probably wouldn't qualify her for an advanced class dealing with Combat. Perhaps the secondaries for each primary are sorted (maybe there are even blank spaces in the middle of the row for a while - we can't tell because Leadership, the missing Tactics skill, is the third one; the secondaries for Combat and Death seem to be in order too).
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The calm before the storm is about to end.
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Preserver
Promising
Famous Hero
Elemental Druid
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posted October 22, 2001 11:11 PM |
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Thanks for the replies everyone!
And thanks for the infomation and ideas Djive, I'll take a closer look when I get time. StormWarning, I actually sorted those ideas away when looking through your old thread. The beastmaster is for sure not a magic hero, but I'll think about the summoner thing. I didn't like the idea first, but now it makes sence to me... 
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- The only alert the invaders had was the rustling of leaves on a day without wind -
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Jenova
Famous Hero
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posted October 23, 2001 10:11 AM |
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You get 3 choices of skills to advance at level up (one of them being a new primary skill). What happens when you have all 5 primary skills? Will you still have that third option? About advancing primary skills requiring certain levels of secondary skills.. what if you find yourself in the weird situation where you do not qualify to advance your primary (because of your crappy choice of secondaries)? Will you get offered something else instead?
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted October 24, 2001 12:23 AM |
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Jenova,
I believe you will still have a third option, regardless of which of the offers that are not possible. In the strange case that you've developed all 4 skills in your first group to grand master, this would mean that you get offered 3 new primary skills at the next level up.
If one of the choices are not possible I'd be inclined to believe that they try to replace it in priority order:
1. Another level-up offer of a skill you have.
2. Another offer of a secondary skill you don't have.
3. Another offer of a primary skill you don't have.
It will work as the secondaries in Heroes 3. Normally, you are offered one promotion and one new skill. However, in the case of no promotions possible for skills you already have (all are already on expert) you would get two offers for a new basic skill. If you filled all 8 slots, you get two offers on advanced skills (when possible).
Then again, it's virtually impossible to guess how this will work in heroes 4.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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NKW
Hired Hero
Tatalian Guard of Honor
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posted October 25, 2001 01:04 PM |
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Edited By: NKW on 25 Oct 2001
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Off-topic (shame on me)
Preserver, where did you get the info on the unique structures in the preserve shown on CHU?
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Preserver
Promising
Famous Hero
Elemental Druid
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posted October 25, 2001 03:31 PM |
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You can call it info if you want...
I got the most structure information (guesses) from the guessing games ("guessing game" by Kruel and "Guessing Game II" by me). Not many people replied, so I had to think the others myself (talking about the others, not finished towns too). If someone have any ideas/complains about the (new) townpages on CHU, just IM or e-mail me. If anyone have ideas and corrections to the structure descriptions, please post it in the guessing game II, so we maybe could get some discussions rolling. As you can see on the Preserve page, I also used some of the starting classes from this thread, so you can say I got the "info" from HC...
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- The only alert the invaders had was the rustling of leaves on a day without wind -
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poopman
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 25, 2001 11:11 PM |
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one question
where the heck will druids be? an advanced class i hope? certainly not left out of the game, i would think. if the only difference between druid and shaman is in the name, then i wonder why they did it.
yarg
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Zero-Gero
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 26, 2001 07:46 PM |
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Does anybody know what happened with the logistics skill?
I presume the movement mechanism is different now, with caravans handling the routing of armies in your empire.
Maybe it's gone to balance the game..I'm thinking of logisticly beefed up flying armies which can cross rivers and such(ouch!).
Maybe a bit off topic, but let's say you point your caravan loaden with armies to a border castle, and the castle is conquered?? Do you think you might be able to attack caravans? This opens up loads and loads of tactic opportunities..
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted October 26, 2001 08:27 PM |
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There was a discussion of Logistics being included in Pathfinding secondary skills in the "Primary skills analysis: Scouting" Thread. (You can find this through my profile.)
Attack caravans? Probably not. It said in one of the interviews that the creatures disappears from the adventure map and appears in the target town (after a time decided by the time a hero would need to make the trip). They've made caravans to remove the need for escort heroes, and allowing caravans to be attacked would be counter-productive for this intent.
Caravans already have the big disadvantage that while the creature moves you have paid for them but cannot use them.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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Zero-Gero
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 26, 2001 10:33 PM |
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Ah I see, it could be in the pathfinding skill, because logistics should belong in the tactics or nobility skill group.
About the caravans, I wasn't clear on this: I meant that you send them to another castle, they dissapear and before they reach their destination, the destination castle is conquered. How would it be handled? It isn't logical that your army immediately returns at the point of origin...I think it would be very difficult to find an acceptable solution. You state army escorts, but at least they are more flexible. I hope caravans will be really fast.
Hmm, I remember that warlords 2 had something similar, but I forgot how it was done there.
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StormWarning
Promising
Famous Hero
Archmage of Thunder
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posted November 07, 2001 10:06 PM |
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Another idea
For Order/Scouting, maybe it'll be a Seer.
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The calm before the storm is about to end.
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Preserver
Promising
Famous Hero
Elemental Druid
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posted January 20, 2002 09:57 PM |
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Well, we had some of them right. Here's the complete list listed my way:
Example:
Basic classes (Specialized in 1 skill): Barbarian
Advanced classes (Specialized in 2 combined skills): Crusader
The basic classes are 'grown up' versions of the starter classes (if not the same?):
Fighter -> Knight
Priest -> Priest
Lord -> Lord
Enchanter -> Mage
Warrior -> Death Knight
Necromancer -> Necromancer
Rouge -> Thief
Sorcerer -> Sorceror
Archer -> Archer
Shaman -> Druid
Barbarian -> Barbarian
Maybe NWC just made some name changes?
Anyway, here goes:
Might Heroes (6) + (6)
Tactics: Knight or Death Knight
Tactics/Combat: General
Tactics/Nobility: Lord Commander
Tactics/Scouting: Field Marshal
Combat: Barbarian or Archer
Combat/Nobility: Warlord
Combat/Scouting: Ranger
Nobility: Lord
Nobility/Scouting: Guildmaster
Scouting: Thief
Magic Heroes (11) + (5)
Any 3: Archmage
Order: Mage
Order/Life: Monk
Order/Nature: Enchanter
Order/Chaos: Wizard
Order/Death: Shadow Mage
Life: Priest
Life/Nature: Summoner
Life/Chaos: Heretic
Life/Death: Dark Priest
Nature: Druid
Nature/Chaos: Warlock
Nature/Death: Demonologist
Chaos: Sorceror
Chaos/Death: Lich
Death: Necromancer
'Heroes of Might and Magic' (20)
Order/Tactics: Illusionist
Order/Combat: Battle Mage
Order/Nobility: Wizard King
Order/Scouting: Seer
Life/Tactics: Crusader
Life/Combat: Paladin
Life/Nobility: Cardinal
Life/Scouting: Prophet
Nature/Tactics: Warden
Nature/Combat: Green Knight
Nature/Nobility: Beast Lord
Nature/Scouting: Bard
Chaos/Tactics: Pyromancer
Chaos/Combat: Fireguard
Chaos/Nobility: Witch King
Chaos/Scouting: Fire Diviner
Death/Tactics: Reaver
Death/Combat: Assassin
Death/Nobility: Dark Lord
Death/Scouting: Ninja
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- The only alert the invaders had was the rustling of leaves on a day without wind -
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InfernoGuy
Adventuring Hero
Enjoys eating chicken
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posted January 20, 2002 10:14 PM |
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Zero im not sure but in all likelihood the army will return to its point of departure.
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Its better to keep your mouth shut and be assumed stupid then open it and remove all doubt.
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Svetac
Promising
Known Hero
Saintified Paladin
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posted January 21, 2002 12:55 AM |
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Hmmm, many of those new advanced classes names seem sucky to me. Here are some proposals in what they can be changed:
Life + Tactics – Crusader / Templar
Life + Nature – Summoner / Druid (and Shaman back as starting class)
Life + Chaos – Heretic / Zealot
Life + Death – Dark Priest / Heretic
Life + Order – Monk / Apostole
Nature + Combat – Green Knight / Samurai
Nature + Chaos – Warlock / Conjurer
Chaos + Combat – Fireguard / Inquisitor
Chaos + Scouting – Fire Diviner / Auguror
Chaos + Death – Lich / Warlock
Death + Order – Shadow Mage / Lich
Tactics + Combat – General / Warlord
Scouting + Nobility – Guildmaster / Stalker
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--- Paladin of the Macedon ---
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InfernoGuy
Adventuring Hero
Enjoys eating chicken
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posted January 21, 2002 01:29 AM |
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I know its hard to follow but:
Tactics
Combat
Scouting
Nobility
Life
Order
Death
Chaos
Nature
Tactics
Death Knight or Knight
General
Field Marshal
Lord Commander
Crusader
Illusionist
Reaver
Pyromancer
Warden
Combat
General
Barbarian or Archer
Ranger
Warlord
Paladin
Battle Mage
Assassin
Fireguard
Green Knight
Scouting
Field Marshal
Ranger
Thief
Guildmaster
Prophet
Seer
Ninja
Fire Diviner
Bard
Nobility
Lord Commander
Warlord
Guildmaster
Lord
Cardinal
Wizard King
Dark Lord
Witch King
Beast Lord
Life
Crusader
Paladin
Prophet
Cardinal
Priest
Monk
Dark Priest
Heretic
Summoner
Order
Illusionist
Battle Mage
Seer
Wizard King
Monk
Mage
Shadow Mage
Wizard
Enchanter
Death
Reaver
Assassin
Ninja
Dark Lord
Dark Priest
Shadow Mage
Necromancer
Lich
Demonologist
Chaos
Pyromancer
Fireguard
Fire Diviner
Witch King
Heretic
Wizard
Lich
Sorceror
Warlock
Nature
Warden
Green Knight
Bard
Beast Lord
Summoner
Enchanter
Demonologist
Warlock
Druid
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Its better to keep your mouth shut and be assumed stupid then open it and remove all doubt.
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Preserver
Promising
Famous Hero
Elemental Druid
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posted January 22, 2002 12:10 PM |
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I agree with Svetac that some of the names are not as good as the ones we could come up with, or just bad. But I'll wait untill I've played every single caracter to see if the skills they learn and the way they develop fits their name. About the starter classes, This screenshot has made me think that some earlier stated names has changed. The Asylum might hero is now called thief instead of rogue.
So here's the new starter class list
Town
Might Hero (primary skill guess, secondary skill guess)
Magic Hero (primary skill guess, secondary skill guess)
Haven
Knight (tactics, leadership)
Priest (life, healing)
Academy
Lord (nobility, estates)
Mage (order, enchantment)
Necropolis
Death Knight (tactics, offense)
Necromancer (death, occultism)
Asylum
Thief (scouting, stealth)
Sorcerer (chaos, conjuration)
Preserve
Archer (combat, archery)
Druid (nature, herbalism)
Stronghold
Barbarian (combat, resistance, toughness)
Any other non-magic starter class
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- The only alert the invaders had was the rustling of leaves on a day without wind -
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Svetac
Promising
Known Hero
Saintified Paladin
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posted January 22, 2002 04:32 PM |
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You're right Preserver. As soon as we start playing the game, and see the Hero classes in action, we'll grow to love every single hero class.
About the hero starters, I completely agree with you. And I want to ask you something that can be a little bit off topic here. Have you noticed that Combat has been renamed to Melee on one of the latest HoMM4 screens on Celestial Heavens?
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--- Paladin of the Macedon ---
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TitanMaster
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 22, 2002 06:45 PM |
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Nice list, good to see all the heroes/units
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