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| Thread: To be ranged or not to be ranged? dungeon dilemma |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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phoenixreborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted August 31, 2008 02:59 PM |
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Dungeon ranged don't hit very hard at all.
It doesn't make much difference either way. I kinda like the assassin poision and it's easier to spread around if you can shoot it.
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted August 31, 2008 07:02 PM |
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Quote:
well maybe the're better, but you CANT have all meele units, what about if you dont have time to make yourself invisible.... i prefer some ranged slaughter than the creepy stalking..
I tend to agree even thought creepy stalking is lots of fun I just don't see it working as well. (esp for stalkers being lvl 1). If you have ranged you can hit the people while they are rushing you and rush them back with furies,raiders etc.
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I use big words to make myself
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted August 31, 2008 07:11 PM |
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I tend to agree even thought creepy stalking is lots of fun I just don't see it working as well. (esp for stalkers being lvl 1).
Then you seriously don't know how to creep with Dungeon well
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted August 31, 2008 07:18 PM |
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well I'm not exactly a vet player. I just see the poison shot ability working better that having them in a close combat fight.
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I use big words to make myself
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted August 31, 2008 07:20 PM |
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well I'm not exactly a vet player. I just see the poison shot ability working better that having them in a close combat fight.
The point is that your hero's Spells actually do most of the job, the Stalkers are used just for a "finishing" blow
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nosfe
Adventuring Hero
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posted August 31, 2008 07:20 PM |
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Edited by nosfe at 19:21, 31 Aug 2008.
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you're overestimating stalkers in 3.1; remember that firewall abusing is out of the picture; the best way to creep large sized stacks is with tons of assassin stacks for cover+poisoning and furies for main damage aided by spells. Going only with stalkers can clear dangerous small sized stacks but there aren't many instances where you would need them,arcane archers and such being an exception, but even then, they can be dealt with by keeping a stack of ~5 stalkers and using only them when encountering such creeps.
imho that's the best way to creep with dungeon right now: furies for damage, assassins for spreading poison and a couple of stalkers for dealing with powerful archer/caster creeps
the main problem with stalkers only is that it eats mana like crazy; now if you're playing on a map full of wells then sure, it can work, but on more normal maps you'd run out of mana after 2 creeps
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted August 31, 2008 07:22 PM |
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OH that makes perfect sence gosh I love all the experienced people in the HC
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I use big words to make myself
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted August 31, 2008 07:23 PM |
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Well I just had a recent game with 3.1 (I never did the Firewall abuse anyway) and managed to creep excellent with Stalkers (and some Dragons from week 3)
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted August 31, 2008 07:28 PM |
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Come on assassins suck. Seriously with their pathetic growth how much damage can they spread? Even with invisibility nerfed stalkers are the way to go. Only case where assassins can do something is vs weak ranged units and there stalkers can do the same job anyway.
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted August 31, 2008 07:31 PM |
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yeah I guess the way you put it the stalkers are better.
what do you think about the shadow witch line?
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I use big words to make myself
smarter
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted August 31, 2008 07:36 PM |
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what do you think about the shadow witch line?
The Shadow Mistress has better stats, invisibility and a useful Whip Strike, so it's a lot better than the Matriarch. Don't overestimate the shooting ability: in fact, it's not even a bonus for me, because it deals 50% damage from far range and there are very rare cases when you can shoot in close range and not being blocked (you deal 50% damage when blocked as well)
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nosfe
Adventuring Hero
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posted August 31, 2008 07:36 PM |
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the reason why i when back to using assassins is twofold: a) stalker creeping is very very boring(for me at least); b) you don't need a lot of stalkers for creeping with invisibility so why not use assassins and furies together? sure, assassins don't do much damage(compared to the furies) but it's still more than with stalkers as after the first attack stalkers start dieing
of course it also depends on what maps you're playing, rich maps make it easy for stalker only creeping but i play only random maps(don't see the point in playing a map that i already know) where wells are few and far between
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VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
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posted August 31, 2008 07:39 PM |
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Edited by VokialBG at 19:40, 31 Aug 2008.
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Nobody needs shooters now  The Stalkers are MUCH better than the Assassins. They are better in all stats (only equal in initiative). They still have the potion effect, and the IMBA Invisibility. Same for the Shadow Mistress, better in all stats, equal spells in equal mastery, but they also have Invisibility. And as Elvin said who cares, since you have the most powerful destructive magic in the game...
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samiekl
Supreme Hero
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posted August 31, 2008 07:47 PM |
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1. if there's a more useless creature in this game than assassin, then it's the minotaur. but on second thought, i can find use for minotaur, but not for assassin.
2. in hof, assassins were used as meat shields, thus you were loosing some in every fight. this leads to few assassins in the end
3. stalkers' poison vs. assassins' poison. it's pretty simple... less assassins in final fight, less attack for assassin (poison is attack-dependent in my experience). stalkers' poison is a 100 times better, plus the stalkers deal more damage.
4. dungeon doesn't need ranged attack. It doesn't have the creatures for it. Although matriarchs are sometimes more useful, but not for their ranged capabilities, i find myself going for mistresses most of the times because they are more tactical and more useful overall.
Hope this settles things.
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tann_141
Known Hero
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posted September 01, 2008 09:39 AM |
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i say we stop talking about the assassin vs stalker because the stalker has MANY MANY MANY more uses than the assassins.. the real question is with the tier 6 unit (mistress or matriarch).
and the question is not only about the final battle... but also about creeping.. and how you use them up until the final battle...
still protecting matriarchs isnt a problem with units like hydras and minotaurs... so a ranged unit is POSSIBLE to have
however the melee unit deals more damage... has invisibility (thus better survivability)
again its a matter of preference but at the same time it can make a difference
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted September 01, 2008 04:06 PM |
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I think that it also depends on what faction you are fighting. But I think that as a general rule most factions are hurt badly by a full melee assult.
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I use big words to make myself
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shadowfury
Hired Hero
Blade of Vengeance
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posted September 01, 2008 08:19 PM |
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well if you looke it this way... academy is powerfull faction having 3 shooters; dungeon no shooters - bad idea, its better to have a shooter than a risk of being revealed too soon...( paladin slaughter)
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted September 01, 2008 08:34 PM |
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why do you think having shooters is even important? With such a small battlefield, it matters not.
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted September 01, 2008 09:26 PM |
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well if you looke it this way... academy is powerfull faction having 3 shooters; dungeon no shooters - bad idea, its better to have a shooter than a risk of being revealed too soon...( paladin slaughter)
three shooters three people with melee penalty engaged in close combat with dark elves HAHAHAAHAh they will all die
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I use big words to make myself
smarter
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tann_141
Known Hero
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posted September 01, 2008 09:37 PM |
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titans have no melee penalty while mages can use spells
still dungeon can afford to go all melee simply because the hero's destructive spells can eliminate the opponents ranged units quite easily
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