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| Thread: Resources |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted October 15, 2008 05:51 PM |
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If we are going implement food into the system, I'm never buying peasants ever again. They would be way too expensive!
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Nebdar
Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
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posted October 15, 2008 06:04 PM |
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Quote:
If we are going implement food into the system, I'm never buying peasants ever again. They would be way too expensive!
Peasants could have ability Farmer the grow 3 food per peasant and eat 1. Now you would buy peasant? So you may feed bigger army
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted October 15, 2008 06:14 PM |
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Quote:
If we are going implement food into the system, I'm never buying peasants ever again. They would be way too expensive!
Why would they be more expensive than now with Gold? I think it's gonna be the complete opposite
I mean, now that everything costs Gold, the Peasants "eat" up your whole resources (for hiring creatures). If you find them completely useless, then I'd suggest you don't buy them because they cost gold (the resource for hiring other creatures)
However, in my system, let's say you lack everything but food - at least this way you'll probably want to buy Peasants, because it won't "cripple" your other units as well. So I think my system would encourage to buy some "useless" creatures at times - depends on which resources they use, of course.
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Snatch
Promising
Known Hero
Proud Kappa
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posted October 15, 2008 06:31 PM |
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@ Lord Godric: Okay, you're certainly right. Forging and barbecue on lava rivers... 
@ Rubycus: I don't know how upkeep is in W3. But generally spoken upkeep is a daily loss of resources depending on the size of your army. In my own concept - creatures recruited from tax paying population - there are no enduring costs but temporal income decreases after recruiting. That was a compromise already because many German fans despised the idea of daily upkeep.
@ Alcibiades: The same since HoMM 1. I would say a peasant and a swordsman or priest should consume the same amount of food. Because then it is necessary to develop high-level troops which have a better cost-benefit ratio. In return it is more expensive to recruit them. However very mighty and big creatures like dragons could cost more food. As Nebdar says and thinking of peasants or the grave robbers in my own concept - who deliver body parts each day which are needed for the creation of undead creatures - maybe every race should have a low level civilian unit which does not cost food but produces food instead (peasants, hunters, trappers, farmers, gatherers,...). Or alternatively it costs food if used in an army but produces food if leaved in farms or similar buildings.
@ Asheera: If you have tons of food but nothing else maybe trading it would be an option.
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted October 15, 2008 06:34 PM |
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Quote:
If you have tons of food but nothing else maybe trading it would be an option.
Yes, but trading doesn't have a very "good" ratio, so I think it's still better to train the Peasants, and then trade what's left.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted October 15, 2008 08:54 PM |
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I think alc + Asheera's ideas are just simply brilliant
It's something I've been looking forward to -- the other being able to "destroy" enemy structures and not being able to use them if they are enemy "faction" (how would demons obey a Knight? ). Of course not destroying the whole town, but all of it's buildings so you'll have to rebuild them, but that is off topic.
PS: some buildings may have metal reinforcement etc
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted October 15, 2008 09:08 PM |
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Quote:
the other being able to "destroy" enemy structures and not being able to use them if they are enemy "faction" (how would demons obey a Knight? ). Of course not destroying the whole town, but all of it's buildings so you'll have to rebuild them, but that is off topic.
Something like I said here, hmm?
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted October 15, 2008 09:08 PM |
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Edited by MattII at 21:17, 15 Oct 2008.
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There is one resource you don't seem to have thought about: Mana
Now I know Mana is currently infinite, but what if it wasn't, what if things like Genies and Wights actually needed it for production/upkeep, and other units (Druids, Succubi, etc.) needed it for their attacks?
Something like I said here, hmm?
It's been around in WoG for years now, so it's not a new idea. In fact the only things wrong with the WoG method at the moment are the awful graphics and the fact that you're locked out for seven days. I feel that if a Knight destroys an Inferno then leaves it, a Demoniac (or whatever Inferno heroes are called) should be able to come along in four days (before it's fully defactioned, if you get what I mean) and reclaim it.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted October 15, 2008 09:17 PM |
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Quote:
Something like I said here, hmm?
Yes excellent, and I agree with alc in that thread, of course there has to be a way to rebuild them, although destroying non-town dwellings should also be possible (but also rebuilding them if necessary)
Quote:
There is one resource you don't seem to have thought about: Mana
Now I know Mana is currently infinite, but what if it wasn't, what if things like Genies and Wights actually needed it for production/upkeep, and other units (Druids, Succubi, etc.) needed it for their attacks?
Excellent thinking
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Darkshadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted October 15, 2008 09:22 PM |
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How about different "energy" types instead of mana?Like Death energy for necropolis creatures, flame energy for inferno, Rage energy for orcs...ect.
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted October 15, 2008 09:25 PM |
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Edited by MattII at 21:29, 15 Oct 2008.
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Although destroying non-town dwellings should also be possible (but also rebuilding them if necessary)
Destroying I don't know about, maybe forcing residents to abandon them (inherent residency is one weeks worth of creatures, with the addition of whatever creatures have yet to be recruited), then implant your own creatures (again, one week's worth) then wait for at least four days or until the next day 1 before you start recruiting.
Quote:
How about different "energy" types instead of mana?Like Death energy for necropolis creatures, flame energy for inferno, Rage energy for orcs...ect.
Too complicated for creature generation, that needs to stay simple, and most heroes can generate at least some Mana (even Necropolis heroes should pay Mana for straight off recruitment rather than raising corpses).
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Snatch
Promising
Known Hero
Proud Kappa
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posted October 15, 2008 09:51 PM |
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Quote:
How about different "energy" types instead of mana?Like Death energy for necropolis creatures, flame energy for inferno, Rage energy for orcs...ect.
That reminds me of my concept. Elves can build a portal which collects elemental energy. In battles elven heroes can form this energy into creatures. My vampires need body parts - collected by grave robbers, desecrators and necromancers - to recruit/built/create undead creatures.
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted October 15, 2008 09:52 PM |
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Quote:
It's been around in WoG for years now, so it's not a new idea.
I haven't played WoG nor H3 so that was a pretty original idea from me
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted October 15, 2008 10:23 PM |
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Edited by MattII at 22:24, 15 Oct 2008.
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Quote:
I haven't played WoG nor H3 so that was a pretty original idea from me
Sorry about that, I just automatically assume that everyone who's played H4-5 has also played H3 and maybe even H2 (I have, but not much).
Anyway, I do think that we need more resources (metal especially), but at the same time I'd like to see each player actually needing less (what does Haven do with sulphur, or Inferno with crystal). I also wouldn't mind seeing composite resources like Mythril (Mana and Metal) or Ore (Metal and Stone).
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Andrelvis
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 16, 2008 06:03 AM |
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Adding more resources is quite interesting, but there is also another matter which could provide some more interesting depth for the game, which is adding handcrafted goods. I suggest a mix of the game Imperialism's economic system with HoMM's. Let me explain:
Resources are produced by buildings on the map; (and rarely by special buildings in the town itself) those resources would be possible to be transformed into materials through the use of a building for processing, and then use another building for processing the materials into finished goods. A simple example would be:
Iron Mine: Adventure map building that produces Iron Ore.
Iron Smelter: Transforms 2xIron Ore into 1xCast Iron.
Ironworks: Transforms 2xCast Iron into either 1xWeapons or 1xTools.
Cast Iron would also be used for construction, and Weapons would be used for creating certain troops; Tools would be used in construction as well.
And so on, but keeping a small number of commodities so as to keep the game simple. Micromanagement wouldn't be much of an issue, as the player would simply set the processing building to produce the amount of goods he wishes per turn, and it would keep doing so until orders change.
Not sure it would actually benefit the game, just throwing ideas around.
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Snatch
Promising
Known Hero
Proud Kappa
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posted October 16, 2008 07:39 AM |
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I don't think that this idea would benefit the game much. What is of use for the players? Why not simplify it? Creature needs weapon = 2 cast iron = 4 iron ore -> creature needs 4 iron ore. Town buildings like iron smelter and iron works only slow down town development. I don't see another use at the moment.
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted October 16, 2008 01:15 PM |
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I'm one of those that actually like the resource management and troop training even more than creeping fights (I like it the same as the final epic fight) so I love your ideas Andrelvis
But that's just me, most of you probably only like to fight in a game.
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted October 16, 2008 10:33 PM |
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Have to agree with Snatch on this one, resource 'processing' doesn't fit in HoMM, it belongs more in Settlers and Emperor:RotMK and games like that.
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted October 17, 2008 01:09 AM |
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Anyway, for food, what if it costs a set amount to hire a creature, and then they don't need upkeep for a while. However, if you don't return to an allied building (other than mines or places without much food) then you have to start feeding them upkeep. Also, the building you visit will stave off upkeep to different degrees. Eg, the castle staves it off for 2 to 3 weeks, whereas a windmill only lasts for a few days.
And for necro, perhaps they have to convert the food production centers into necrobuildings, which takes a turn or two or something. this might help slow down the Necro imbaskeleton armies thing.
Farm -> Graveyard (For Skellies and Liches)
Granary -> Flesh Deposits (for Vamps and Zombies)
Tavern -> Astral Effulgance (Ghosts and Wraiths)
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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Daystar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
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posted October 17, 2008 03:51 AM |
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A question: Do we want to use the name Gem or Crystal (if I missed a discussion of this sorry, I skimmed the second page) I myself would prefer crysals, but gems have more elegance to them. Perhaps calling them "Precious Stones" and having the little logo have crystals AND gemstones? And the mine building would be like "Gemstone refinery" or something. Let me google a bit and find out how you differentiate between crystals and gems...
EDIT: Crystal seems to refer primarily to gems that are...mostly uncut, and unrefined, grown from the very earth, whereas gems and gemstones may come from crystals but can also come from other things, like pearl or rocks with striking colors, such as Jade. So my jury is still out on this one.
@Mana: While I don't think it should be a resource (it would either make Mages, Necromancers and Sorcerors imba or weak, depending on implementation) what if having a powerful caster stationed in the castle at the start of the week makes mystical creatures have a slight growth increase. Eg, for every 30 points of Mana available you get +1 Djinn or something.
Another thing I thought of, perhaps a "Channel Mana" spell that uses mana as a direct, powerful healing/resurrecting spell that only works on mystical creatures? Perhaps it can heal creatures with/who do magic (Druids, Preists, Dragons, etc) but it can only resurrect creatures like Djinn and Ghosts and such.
Does building ships require anything other than wood?
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How exactly is luck a skill?
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