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| Thread: New-gen haters?! |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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phoenixreborn
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posted December 15, 2008 03:58 PM |
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*sidesteps*
*squints*
Just the other day my friend and I played Contra just like when we were children. We were worse than back when but we still beat it and it was ok. I find it easier to play than newer shooters like FEAR and FAR CRY where I'm dead before I see what hit me because I suck.
In any era there are games that are good and games that suck. I think most people that play video games are interested in a few games that come out nowadays. I sure am. That doesn't mean I can't call a new game crap (vanilla oblivion, for me) that compares unfavorably with other games.
I enjoyed Nibiru more than adventure fan favorite Curse of Monkey Island because I had a chance at solving the puzzles. Monkey Island was so illogical I couldn't get far...maybe it works for some people but my brain doesn't work that way. Even if Nibiru had a weak story line it was engaging with lovely graphics and some decent puzzles.
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TheDeath
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posted December 15, 2008 03:59 PM |
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Quote:
But I guess tastes differ, and if you think NWN has the worst gameplay then there's really no point in arguing about this anymore. 
You've said this so many times and still keep arguing. You don't want to accept that?
Who cares that it's been 6 years in development, as long as the style sucks? For me, it doesn't, but it is pretty limited, and it's imbalanced as hell. What more do you want from me to say "sucky game"?
Nwn isn't sucky but there are better games (which also happen to be older), although Nwn is far better than the 'new gen' crap.
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JoonasTo
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posted December 15, 2008 04:06 PM |
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What do campaigns or modules have to do with the gameplay? 
NOTHING!
The turn based real life combat is kinda failure and the game's UI is such torture...
But I want another team based RPG to compare to FF people! You must know some game like that! My mind is on a block right now so I need help.
BTW. Ash? Campaigns and modules are about atmosphere, story and such. NOT gameplay.
PS. Forget Death Ash. He's the opposite of graphic snow it seems.
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TheDeath
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posted December 15, 2008 04:09 PM |
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Quote:
PS. Forget Death Ash. He's the opposite of graphic snow it seems.
Gah. If I were the opposite of it I would say "better graphics ruin gameplay" which I didn't. How would you call that?
I said it's IRRELEVANT. Do you know meaning? It's like looking at the ocean and judging from that how tasty your hamburger is...
do I need it to make more clear?
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JoonasTo
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posted December 15, 2008 04:17 PM |
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Umm...Didn't Ash just ask which game was better? No talk about gameplay at all. So obviously if they are identical otherwise but the other has better graphics it's better.
Oh and it was a jokish kind of thing.
Or insult but whatever. *shrughs
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TheDeath
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posted December 15, 2008 04:26 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 16:29, 15 Dec 2008.
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Quote:
Umm...Didn't Ash just ask which game was better? No talk about gameplay at all. So obviously if they are identical otherwise but the other has better graphics it's better.
"better"? Maybe the first few hours of play when you say "OMG it looks cooler".
After that, only gameplay defines it, DEPENDING on genre of course! Which means that they are almost the same
EDIT: oh and depending what you mean by 'graphics'. I find absolutely nothing "better" per se (it doesn't even catch my attention) with ultra-mega-detailed textures or poly counts these days. Absolutely nothing... I hardly notice the glitches in Gothic
so yeah, it's like having a colored game when I see black & white... certainly not 'better' at all (for me ofc).
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JoonasTo
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posted December 15, 2008 04:30 PM |
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It is better. If you had the chance of buying one of those games you wouldn't buy the one with worse graphics now would you?
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TheDeath
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posted December 15, 2008 04:32 PM |
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That's only expecting it is better.
If I had the chance to buy a color version of a game when I only see black & white, yes I would buy it. Doesn't mean I will notice anything better though.
which is what is the trend these days ("new gen").
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JoonasTo
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posted December 15, 2008 04:33 PM |
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Edited by JoonasTo at 16:35, 15 Dec 2008.
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So you think games are not better in 32 bits than 8 bits? Just look at the comic thread. You can't actually say that 8-bit looks better looking for group, for example, now can you?
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it's like having a colored game when I see black & white
That's completely different, like comparing 2D to 3D.
Graphics are, like sounds and music also, important part of the games atmosphere. Sometimes even the gameplay. Just try out Starfox and after that play Starfox64 and you know what I mean with gameplay.
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TheDeath
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posted December 15, 2008 04:40 PM |
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Quote:
So you think games are not better in 32 bits than 8 bits?
Why do you put words in my mouth?
I said detailed textures (resolution), high poly count, etc...
and yeah nothing is better in 64 bits (if there is) than 32 bits (I mean for colors ofc). Yeah.
still waiting for new gen snows to say how awesome 1024-bits for each RGB component looks
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JoonasTo
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posted December 15, 2008 04:44 PM |
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Edited by JoonasTo at 16:45, 15 Dec 2008.
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Quote:
Quote:
So you think games are not better in 32 bits than 8 bits?
Why do you put words in my mouth?
8 bit textures, 16 bit textures, 24 bit textures, 32 bit textures...Catch my drift?
Quote:
still waiting for new gen snows to say how awesome 1024-bits for each RGB component looks
That moment will be the best laugh of history. 
I'll find you a comparison between RE4 GC and PS2 versionand see if you still think that way...
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Asheera
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posted December 15, 2008 04:57 PM |
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Quote:
What do campaigns or modules have to do with the gameplay?
NOTHING!
Exactly. So there's no excuse saying NWN's original campaign sucks (and its story) and therefore the gameplay is bad. It's not true.Quote:
The turn based real life combat is kinda failure and the game's UI is such torture...
The UI is excellent in my opinion. And the battles are good as well. Probably you don't understand the D&D mechanics very well and that's why you don't like it?
So for me NWN has amazing gameplay, so I guess tastes differ. Of course I agree the original campaigns have a lame story, but that doesn't change the gameplay at all, as you said.
I was commenting on your quote where you said NWN has the worst gameplay of all RPGs, where I think it has the best gameplay value (even though the original game in itself is not really that satisfactory because of the lame campaigns - but hey, you can 'fix' this easily with some quality modules, etc)
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TheDeath
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posted December 15, 2008 05:01 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 17:02, 15 Dec 2008.
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Quote:
8 bit textures, 16 bit textures, 24 bit textures, 32 bit textures...Catch my drift?
32-bit textures are 24-bit with an added byte either completely useless, or for alpha (transparency).
Then I still don't see what has that got to do with detail, aka resolution, aka Width-Height?
and 8-bit uses a palette, it can look cool enough if it is optimized.
not to mention compression schemes.
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I'll find you a comparison between RE4 GC and PS2 versionand see if you still think that way...
I don't think you get the point I used in that long post. There is a thing called "point of diminishing returns" I think. 2D-3D = great transition.
32-bit->64-bit = irrelevant transition.
8-bit-32-bit = good transition.
not sure what's so hard to get. It isn't something linear lol.
Quote:
where I think it has the best gameplay value
especially because it's hugely imbalanced?
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xerox
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posted December 15, 2008 05:06 PM |
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Graphics are always a plus but it really depends on the game and its universe.
For example, I cant see a cartoonish Lord of the Rings game but neither can I see a realistic Warcraft game.
In addition, half-comic graphics are pretty good because they look nice (just look at WoW: WotLK, I think its more beautiful then Oblivion - if you dont trust me then I will take some screenshots from the Grizzly Hills, Crystalsong Forest, Sholazar Basin and/or Howling Fjord zones) and you dont need an über good computer to run them with highest graphics etc.
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JoonasTo
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 15, 2008 05:19 PM |
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Edited by JoonasTo at 17:20, 15 Dec 2008.
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I understnad the mechanics pretty thoroughly. After baldur's gates, icewind dales, kotors and neverwinter nights I should.
I find the game good actually. But I still find it's gameplay lacking greatly(the most enjoyed part is making a character ). and the UI is pure pain. Also so is sleep and regain your spells thingy. Why couldn't characters just pull those threads unlimited times a day?
Imbalance only matters if you play multi Death. 
Too bad I do. *insert facepalm here
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not sure what's so hard to get. It isn't something linear lol.
I know.
OH NO IT'S HERE! RUN! RUN FOR YOUR LIVES!
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executor
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posted December 15, 2008 07:07 PM |
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I just wanted to say a few words here.
Firstly, I do not care whether a game is new or old. I care whether it is good or bad. And I am dismayed by the fact that although more and more games are developed each year, the number of good ones remains the same, if not declines. I do not know reasons for this, I just see a plain fact. Maybe most gamers nowadays want easy games they will finish in two days, or ones they can play for two hours a month.
As for the remakes, I could wish for a few, but I would prefer only graphics and maybe controls to be upgraded, mechanics and storyline staying as they were.
And for the last comment:
Asheera:Quote:
So you like long games or hard games?
If it's the latter, do you really enjoy Save&Load all the time until you manage to get past a difficult fight?
Actually that you asked, I remember reloading the last dark elf mission from WarCraft 3 over 20 times on hard, and I must admit that it would have not make me a tiny bit that satisfied if I have finished it outright.
Another example: KotORs are great RPGs, but what struck me in both was that I had to reload only one-two times in them for the whole game! (of course I did a few more loads, but those weren't necessary) And that was the first time I played them! That is way too easy, at least for me.
And maybe that is part of my problem with most of newest games, they aren't challenging at all.
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Asheera
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posted December 15, 2008 07:14 PM |
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Edited by Asheera at 19:14, 15 Dec 2008.
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Warcraft 3 hard? Did we play the same game?
Warcraft 3 and Starcraft are so easy that I never lost in one single campaign (of course, after I learned how to play in Skirmish). I don't know why but Blizzard just like to make easy games.
Spellforce 1 was WAY harder than those Blizzard games.
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JoonasTo
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posted December 15, 2008 07:38 PM |
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Quote:
Warcraft 3 and Starcraft are so easy that I never lost in one single campaign (of course, after I learned how to play in Skirmish). I don't know why but Blizzard just like to make easy games.
Spellforce 1 was WAY harder than those Blizzard games.
WC 3 was a cake walk. 
How can you say that Spellforce is harder than StarCraft???
It was much easier than StarCraft. Actually StarCraft has the most challenging campaigns of any RTS I've played. Of course after you learn how to beat 3 computers in a skirmish you kinda own them. The skirkmishes in StarCraft are around twice as hard as the campaigns' most challenging maps. And it does that without resource cheating.
Did you play the extra campaigns btw? If you did, did you rescue the protoss? If you did then you know that they can make hard maps too. The second map is pure masochism.
And who plays skirmish before going into the campaigns? The whole idea of getting slowly the full tech is kinda ruined when you know al ready what you are going to have and there are no tactics to discover. Also it kinda ruins the difficulty.
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Geny
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posted December 15, 2008 08:14 PM |
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Side note:
@Joonas
Other team based RPGs: Dungeon Siege? Does Fallout classify?
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Asheera
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posted December 15, 2008 08:34 PM |
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Starcraft... hard? In every single mission, with Protoss I could just attack with 24 Dragoons and win the game instantly.
Even the last Zerg mission from the expansion was very easy, the enemy attacks are just pathetic (in all campaigns) and once you get 12 Guardians + 12 Devourers it's instant win.
And Starcraft doesn't even have a difficulty level, so I couldn't make it harder.  Quote:
The skirkmishes in StarCraft are around twice as hard as the campaigns' most challenging maps. And it does that without resource cheating.
Let me get this straight: you're talking about 1 computer AI in skirmish? If yes, then it's extremely easy.
If I'm playing Protoss (my fav race), when I attack with 12 Zealots and 12 Dragoons the game is over. This works even if there are 2 computers. When there are 3 I need some more defense first.
About Spellforce, did you play it on Hard? The second expansion is pretty hard when played on hard.
And try to beat Coop 30 (in Free Game Mode) in Spellforce (of course, not cheating with a high level hero & runes, use the ones that it suggests in the description), and then you'll see what hard really means. For your information, without any kind of cheating or some other abuses (such as luring the enemy away from the spawn points, etc), this map is kinda impossible. See for yourself
But... I managed to win it! Very hard, but I did.
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