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| Thread: Spellcasting heroes question | |
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Jenova
Famous Hero
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posted December 13, 2001 03:02 PM |
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Spellcasting heroes question
Now that spell power is determined by hero level instead of the now removed spell power primary skill (hmm.. how does this work will spellcasting UNITs?), does that mean it's possible to take some might (aka warrior type) heroes and boost them up as your main hero, and not only would they be good fighters but also powerful spellcasters? What separated a Barbarian from a Warlock in the past was their fighting skills and magic skills.. But now since Barbarians can cast spells with the same power as warlocks (assuming they have the spell).. Would that be in the Barbarian's favor?
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Tristan
Promising
Known Hero
illegally insane
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posted December 13, 2001 08:44 PM |
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I am almost certain that spells from creatures will be the same power automatically, and I thought hero spells were determined by magic skill levels not hero levels, could be wrong about that.
It is a matter that needs to be taken care of though.
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If you learn so much by losing, why am I so dumb?
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StormWarning
Promising
Famous Hero
Archmage of Thunder
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posted December 13, 2001 10:01 PM |
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Actually, that gives me an idea:
The effectiveness of each spell should depend on the number of levels you've had the skill to cast it! If you start off knowing Chaos Magic and then later learn Nature, it would make sense that your Chaos spells would be much more powerful than your Nature spells because you're so much more familiar with that school. Also, your Magic Arrow's effectiveness should be boosted much more than, say, your Implosion's effectiveness (not that MA will be more powerful, just a greater boost from the "beginner" casting) because you've known how to cast simple Chaos spells for so long that it's almost second nature, but you've only begun study on the difficult ones.
But they probably won't do that.  I can only hope that might heroes' "casting level" is much lower than magic heroes' effective level, otherwise there's a serious balance problem. (Maybe a might hero's casting level begins at 1 when he gets his first magic skill, or it's just 1/2 his actual level or something?) Or perhaps class only determines what skills you're likely to get and those skills determine your stats (i.e. a might hero who never picks up Toughness is no tougher than a magic hero of the same level w/o Toughness, but he's a lot more likely to get Tough later). That's not likely the case, but this is a place for wishing. 
[edit]For creatures, power is the same no matter how big the stack is. Also, it was said in earlier previews that one of the secondaries determined spell power. Maybe that's what he meant by level, or maybe both come into play.
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The calm before the storm is about to end.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted December 13, 2001 10:26 PM |
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One of the interviews said that when uints casts damage dealing spells, then they do a fixed amount of damage (that is it's not dependent on the stack size).
Heroes work diferently know. They start out as newbies or rockies with very little skill, and then you groom them either into might heroes or magic heroes, and it's also possible to make scouts and nobles (which are neither might nor magic).
Barbarians won't be able to learn magic skills (we're told), so likely they'll need to advanced to an advanced character class before they're offered any of the magic schools. And once they're an advanced class the barbarian is no longer a barbarian but something else.
It seems that now the starting class will mainly affect the skills you're offered at level up, and in particular the magic skills you may be offered. For each class the most likely magic skill to be offered (if you start with none) is the home town's magic school. If you take away this difference there's probably very little difference between the different might heroes when you start with them. They start with almost identical might skills, or will have good chances to develope them very quickly.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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Ichon
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted December 14, 2001 12:02 AM |
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99 levels
I think that the final levels of might heroes will probably be fairly similiar, but with 99 levels now possible, the starting skills and the advanced classes might heroes go into will greatly vary them. For instance a Preserve would be much more likely to get a Ranger(Nobility, Archery, Stealth etc) might hero than would Necropolis, or the Chaos town.
It's an interesting possibilty that Barbarians could learn magic in an advanced class. I hadn't though of it before, it seemed they were to be banned from magic at all levels, which was offset by the Barbarians town being the only town able to hire any hero class.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted December 14, 2001 12:18 AM |
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Quote:
For instance a Preserve would be much more likely to get a Ranger(Nobility, Archery, Stealth etc) might hero than would Necropolis, or the Chaos town.
You're forgetting that it's the primary skills that unlocks the secondary skills. Can't get Archery without Combat, can't get Stealth without Scouting. And you can only have 5 of the 9 Primary skills.
What will differ is that the Preseve heroes will get offers to learn Nature Magic, and and more rarely offers on Chaos or Life, but would not get offers for Order or Death magic.
Almost every hero will likely be offered the four mundane skills of Combat, Scouting, Nobility and Tactics.
Because of complex dependencies within each skills, it seems you'll be restricted in how you develope skills within a prmary skill, and these restrictions doesn't depend on your class but appear to be general. Restrictions like must develope this skill to that level before developing another skill to another level. A bit of apity, since it will limit the choices open to the hero at level-up.
Quote:
It's an interesting possibilty that Barbarians could learn magic in an advanced class. I hadn't though of it before, it seemed they were to be banned from magic at all levels, which was offset by the Barbarians town being the only town able to hire any hero class.
If a hero gets a magic skill as their third (or later) primary skill, then we're talking about a very high level hero before the hero is any good in it. I'd guess that heroes will have difficulties getting above level 30-50 most of the time.
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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Ichon
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted December 14, 2001 12:42 AM |
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Right, but...
Within the primary skills common to all might heroes, I doubt the odds will be even to acquire any secondary skill within a primary with each town. At least I hope not after all the talk about more differences.
For instance a Death Knight might have trouble getting some secondary skills in the Nobility primary skill. Or a Chaos Templar(whatever might/chaos might classes are named) might not be able to get all the aspects of Stealth secondary ability etc... with 5 Primary skills each with their own secondary skills available with each secondary skill having 5 levels of expertise...to each hero- counting the number of secondary skills already- there doesn't seem to be enough room to develop every might skill, so there might still be some dfferences. Also- just as in H3, where heroes might be able to reach a certain level, but there are no new skills to learn after that level- it would make sense for might heroes to have the same thing.
Maybe a level 50 Knight would have all the combat skills to Grand Master level, but within that level there is still a range of damage that is dependent on overall total levels. So the damage a Knight does a Grandmaster Offense at level 55 is less than at level 75... and level 95, etc. That makes more sense to me, other wise with 99 levels, but only 25(5 primary skills each with 5 secondary skills with five levels of mastery, that means 125 level increase would be needed to reach max development in every skill mastery. Only 99 levels are possible, so some skill masteries cannot be totally developed, thus giving the advanced classes their distinctions.
I'm not sure if every Primary skill has 5 subskills, but I did read that each skill has 5 level of mastery supposedly.
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Tristan
Promising
Known Hero
illegally insane
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posted December 14, 2001 01:18 AM |
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Every primary skill has 3 secondary skills related to it.
Is there going to be a level limit at 99? I missed this somehow, but I did read that you would have to get close to that to max all your skills, which makes sense if you have 5 primary and 15 secondary skills at 5 levels, also considering the possibility of getting skills w/o leveling and skills you start with.
I am pretty sure you won't need as large of armies before enhancement spells outweigh damage spells.
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If you learn so much by losing, why am I so dumb?
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Jenova
Famous Hero
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posted December 14, 2001 05:09 AM |
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Quote:
Barbarians won't be able to learn magic skills (we're told), so likely they'll need to advanced to an advanced character class before they're offered any of the magic schools. And once they're an advanced class the barbarian is no longer a barbarian but something else.
Hmm.. Does that mean they can only learn 4 primary skills out of a possible 5? Since only 5 of the 9 p.skills are magical, he will be short one slot..
Moderator's note:This topic has been closed, as it refers to an older version of the game. To discuss Heroes 3, please go to Library Of Enlightenment, to discuss Heroes 4, please go to War Room Of Axeoth.
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