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| Thread: Senate repeals Don't Ask, Don't Tell |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · «PREV |
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Mytical
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posted December 20, 2010 10:56 AM |
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DG. Females have separate shower facilities, bathrooms, etc. However, for a long time due to the cost of refitting them..females were not allowed on submarines. Because there were no separate facilities for them.
Personally though, if you are shaking because some guy MIGHT look at you..you probably have some self-esteem issues or repressed bisexuality or homosexuality. 
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Doomforge
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posted December 20, 2010 11:43 AM |
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Yeah, I don't get it, what's the big deal that a man was ogling you? 
He isn't going to rape you or something.
The issue in army imho is about protecting homosexuals from unnecessary abuse that might be unavoidable in sheltered life (i.e. submarine) where you can't really escape from it.
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted December 20, 2010 12:19 PM |
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Edited by Minion at 12:19, 20 Dec 2010.
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USA was the last of "civilized world" to accept this approach. Heck even in Russia, one heck of a homofobic country, allows homosexuals to die for their country ;P
The countries still left with ban are those of Malawi, Ghana, Iran, Egypt etc. Mostly african and muslim countries. Even Italy cannot ban homosexuals from serving, because of Constitution. Pope must be pissed ;P
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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DagothGares
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No gods or kings
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posted December 20, 2010 12:33 PM |
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Quote:
DG. Females have separate shower facilities, bathrooms, etc. However, for a long time due to the cost of refitting them..females were not allowed on submarines. Because there were no separate facilities for them.
Okay, thank you, well, in that case, the suggestion that gay people must be separated from the rest sounds pretty much like how all black should be in separate companies in the army, because you're just segregating minorities for a weird reason.
And, yeah, these gay people have probably had showers with the other kids during gym class and such. Those rarely turn out into orgies, last I heard. Though, I could be wrong.
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DagothGares
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No gods or kings
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posted December 20, 2010 12:37 PM |
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Quote:
USA was the last of "civilized world" to accept this approach. Heck even in Russia, one heck of a homofobic country, allows homosexuals to die for their country ;P
Didn't you hear? Homosexuality didn't exist in Russia until, like, twenty years ago, daddy-o.
And they allowed women in their army and politics since 1920 or something (and the women weren't just medics, oh, no.)
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Mytical
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Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 20, 2010 12:44 PM |
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Mytical - The master of absolutely useless trivia knowledge!!! Woot!!!!
((Useless as in stuff you'd never hear on things like game shows ))
Of course those for that separation will come out screaming "It is TOTALLY different" *rollseyes*.
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JoonasTo
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 20, 2010 01:02 PM |
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Hey, homosexuality was a disease in most of the countries of the world till the nineties.
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Doomforge
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posted December 20, 2010 01:09 PM |
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a 'paraphilia' not a disease
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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xerox
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 20, 2010 02:51 PM |
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Speaking about gender equality.... North Korea seriously owns at that! Have you seen their war ceremony/march videos? There are just as many woman as men marching around and driving tanks and for some reason brainwashed, nearly robotic asian women driving tanks look awesome and terrifying to me.
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Over himself, over his own
body and
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- John Stuart Mill
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Elodin
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posted December 20, 2010 02:56 PM |
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Quote:
Mytical - The master of absolutely useless trivia knowledge!!! Woot!!!!
((Useless as in stuff you'd never hear on things like game shows ))
Of course those for that separation will come out screaming "It is TOTALLY different" *rollseyes*.
*rollseyes*
Of course sexual behavior is different from race.
I guess I can understand why homosexual men would want other men to be forced to get naked in front of them. But I don't think straight men should be forced to get naked in front of gay men. Maybe you disagree that straight people have rights too?
IF there will be no separate facilities and housing for gays there should be separate facilities for men and women.
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JoonasTo
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 20, 2010 02:59 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Mytical - The master of absolutely useless trivia knowledge!!! Woot!!!!
((Useless as in stuff you'd never hear on things like game shows ))
Of course those for that separation will come out screaming "It is TOTALLY different" *rollseyes*.
*rollseyes*
Of course sexual behavior is different from race.
I guess I can understand why homosexual men would want other men to be forced to get naked in front of them. But I don't think straight men should be forced to get naked in front of gay men. Maybe you disagree that straight people have rights too?
IF there will be no separate facilities and housing for gays there should be separate facilities for men and women.
I highly support that to every countriy's military! Think of the possibilities!
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baklava
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Mostly harmless
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posted December 21, 2010 01:42 AM |
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Meanwhile in a boot camp somewhere in the midwest...
"ALRIGHT...
I WAS GOING TO START OFF WITH "ALRIGHT LADIES" LIKE ALL MY COLLEAGUES DID BEFORE ME BUT SINCE THAT'S ACTUALLY NOT AN INSULT ANYMORE I'LL JUST START OFF WITH "ALRIGHT" INSTEAD!
I'M SERGEANT JOHN "THE FAIRY" MCSTEELE AND I WILL BE MAKING YOUR PATHETIC LITTLE LIVES A LIVING HELL FOR THE NEXT SEVERAL MONTHS! THE OLD DAYS OF SOFT BEDS AND GRANNIE'S PIES ARE OVER, YOU'RE HERE TO BE FORGED INTO REAL MEN AND/OR WOMEN OF THE ARMY! WHEN YOU GET OUT OF HERE, YOU WILL BE COLD, YOU WILL BE RUTHLESS, YOU WILL BE ABLE TO SURVIVE IN THE HARSHEST ENVIRONMENTS, OFTEN WITHOUT ANY HAIRCARE FOR HOURS, YOU WILL, IN SHORT, BE PERFECT KILLING MACHINES!
NOW LET ME TELL YOU SOMETHING. I DIDN'T EARN MY NICKNAME FOR BEING NICE OR GRANTING WISHES, SO DON'T EXPECT ANY COURTESY IN THIS CAMP! I EARNED IT BECAUSE I WAS THE GAYEST SOLDIER IN MY SQUAD! THAT'S RIGHT! I WAS NEVER ASHAMED OF IT, AND I FACED ALL THE HARDSHIPS THAT WENT WITH IT! WHEN MY SUPERIOR OFFICER SAID, "DAMNIT MCSTEELE, WILL YOU STOP WITH YOUR GODDAMN snowRY," I SAID, "SIR, YOU MAY REGARD ME WITH SCORN TODAY, BUT I AM WILLING TO GO WHERE FEW SOLDIERS WOULD GO! I STAND FOR ALL THE FREEDOMS OF THIS GREAT COUNTRY I'M FIGHTING FOR, AND I HAVE THE RIGHT TO STAND OUT IN THE OPEN, AND TELL IT TO WHOEVER IS OUT THERE, TO WHOEVER THINKS WE'RE IN ANY WAY INFERIOR - US HOMOSEXUALS CAN SHOOT MUSLIMS FROM A SAFE DISTANCE JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE, WE CAN PRESS THE SAME BUTTONS, DO THE SAME COLLATERAL DAMAGE AND FEEL EQUALLY ALRIGHT ABOUT IT AS ALL THE OTHER YOUNG MEN WE'RE RECRUITING! I'M NOT GOING AROUND DECLARING I'M TAKING IT UP THE ASS JUST BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE IT, I'M DOING IT BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT DEMOCRACY IS! I'M DOING IT FOR ALL THE PEOPLE WHO FOUGHT AND DIED SO WE CAN DANCE FREELY THROUGH THE STREETS IN THONGS TODAY! DAMNIT I'M TAKING IT UP THE ASS FOR AMERICA!"
*a private breaks the silence and chuckles for a second*
"WHAT WAS THAT? WHAT'S YOUR NAME PRIVATE?"
"J...Johnson, sir!"
"I DON'T THINK THAT'S YOUR NAME, PRIVATE, YOU'RE TOO WHITE FOR SUCH A NAME, I THINK YOUR REAL NAME IS PRIVATE PUSSY! NOW DROP AND GIVE ME 60!"
"Sir was that some kind of a... sexual allusion sir?"
*several brief chuckles*
"GODDAMNIT PRIVATE DO YOU THINK THIS IS FUNNY? THIS IS THE UNITED STATES MILITARY! NOW IT'S 100 PUSH UPS AND CLEANING THE TOILET FOR YOU! DON'T FORGET THAT WHILE YOU'RE IN THIS CAMP YOUR ASS BELONGS TO ME!"
*chuckles all across the room*
"Uhm, sir, I'd rather not..."
*Private Chris Crocker intervenes in tears*
"LEAVE THE SERGEANT ALONE!"
Sergeant McSteele watches the scene in silence for a few moments, then takes out his walkie talkie.
"Sir, it didn't work here either."
The minister of security, on the other side of the line, looks at the president and shakes his head.
Obama sighs. "Well I had to fulfill some promise."
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted December 21, 2010 02:09 PM |
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Edited by Minion at 14:09, 21 Dec 2010.
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Did you know bak that this very same year of 2010 the Serbian Army declared that openly gays can join the professional army. That news was not published in large number of media.
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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Vlaad
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ghost of the past
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posted December 21, 2010 05:17 PM |
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Edited by Vlaad at 23:44, 23 Dec 2010.
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Quote:
Did you know bak that this very same year of 2010 the Serbian Army declared that openly gays can join the professional army. That news was not published in large number of media.
The entry on Wikipedia that you're referring to is misleading. First, I'm not sure what "a large number of media" means; the news was published in all the major media. In addition, Wikipedia links to the actual news, not to an article that would prove the entry. Second, Serbia didn't have a professional army until now. For the last one hundred years all men ages 18-27 were liable for compulsory military service for the duration of one year or less. Hence "the news". When I served in the army, nobody asked you whether you were gay. Privacy? No such thing in the army. Just don't drop your soap in the showers and you'll be fine. Nobody hit on me, but maybe I wasn't as handsome as some. 
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baklava
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posted December 22, 2010 02:32 AM |
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Besides, our army hasn't been supposed to rule the planet for over a decade now.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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The_Gootch
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Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
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posted December 22, 2010 07:40 AM |
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The late Charles Moskos (aka the father of DADT) predicted the policy would end by 2010. Incredible. I want his powers of prescience.
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Shyranis
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted December 23, 2010 06:28 PM |
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Quote:
I guess I can understand why homosexual men would want other men to be forced to get naked in front of them. But I don't think straight men should be forced to get naked in front of gay men. Maybe you disagree that straight people have rights too?
IF there will be no separate facilities and housing for gays there should be separate facilities for men and women.
I always said there should be 3 bathrooms everywhere, Male, Female and Middle/Undecided =p
Anyway, doesn't the current DADT law just force those men and women in front of gay people anyway? Only instead of just admitting it so people who are not comfortable can be more on guard, they just hide it and everybody uhh... hangs out? So the gays have to look on like closet perverts, forced to by the policy. At least if they're open about it people can mind their personal space.
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The_Gootch
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Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
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posted December 23, 2010 11:13 PM |
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Current DADT policy isn't just for recruits and recruiters. If at any point you say that you're gay the military, and I mean this, reserves the right to discharge you. Enforcement of the policy was inconsistent at best and cruel at worst. And yes, the current policy did in fact hurt our combat readiness. Case in point, a few years ago some five army arabic translators were discharged for homosexuality while we were at war in Iraq. The military also seemed content to let known homosexuals continue in their career and then discharge them a few years before their 20 years of service in order to avoid paying full pensions and benefits.
From a moral standpoint the policy was indefensible. But considering attitudes towards gays and lesbians back in the early '90s it served as an effective bridge between the policy of the past where you could be actively investigated and discharged for homosexuality to where we are at now.
From a practical standpoint, it gets a little hairier. It is going to be difficult to reconcile the military's official policy of discouraging sexual contact between its members with letting gays and lesbians serve openly. How do you house them? If you house two same sex gay members in the same barracks room, that is a potential violation of sexual policy. Note that it is not against military law for service members to have sex with each other as long as they're close to each other in rank. Rules of fraternization still apply. Do you let straight/gay members berth together with the option of allowing the straight member to opt for another roommate if they're uncomfortable? Does allowing such a choice perpetuate prejudicial and discriminatory views? Do you house gay men with straight women and vice versa? These are among the tough questions for which there are no easy answers.
For those of you who have a flippant attitude that men should just get over it and if they feel uncomfortable around gay men, they must have a latent homosexuality they're trying to hide, go snow yourself. Noone deserves unwanted sexual attention. And if I said this before, I've said it a thousand times. Men don't want done to them what we do to women on a daily basis.
Now the benefits of letting gays serve openly are going to be immeasureable. First we're crossing off the list one of the last minority groups we're allowed to openly hate. This will have a civilizing effect on the boys from small town USA with their irrational small town USA beliefs. Second, given the effeminate attention to detail that gay men have, a gay uniform inspection is going to be brutal. The smallest IPs will be noticed. Scratches on our rigger's belts won't be tolerated. And third, we will need to rely on them to improve our hair standards. High and tights will give way to 'fierce' haircuts.
Btw, fierce is now a completely gay word and should no longer be used to describe a hardened warrior. Oh geez, I can't even say hardened anymore without...nevermind.
In conclusion, I respectfully disagree with Corribus. As our societal norms evolve so needs the military. Our combat readiness was in fact hurt under the policy of DADT and this policy fixes that injustice. The argument laid out that we should not do this during wartime is a false one because given the double-edged sword of a vague and ambiguous war on terror and a military that eschews the draft means we're going to be at war for a VERY long time. The military has always answered to its civilian bosses and may that be the case for generations to come. If congress approves it, they will do it.
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