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| Thread: Amy Winehouse found dead! |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Lexxan
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
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posted July 24, 2011 01:38 AM |
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I actually intended to respond to your posts, Azagal, but for some reason I ended up writing something completely different?
Funny how that sometimes goes.
And now On-Topic: Amy, I didn't care for you or your music, but if I can feel terrible for 91 mercilessly slaughtered Norwegian, I guess I can add a 92nd casualty in my h.eart... albeit a much less tragic one, but that-
Drat, I'm doing it again.
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted July 24, 2011 01:48 AM |
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Not really, they are arguing over the internet. I'm laughing at them arguing over the internet and at Az' total lack of learning ability from the earlier conversations here that went EXACTLY like this. 
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted July 24, 2011 01:52 AM |
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Heehe good to know that I can atleast keep you entertained, not too easy these days I remember correctly.
And of course you're right it's waste of my time to argue my point but simply because I won't be able to convince Lexx or Mvass doesn't mean I'll let them so blatantly spit on any form of decency or respect. Some things are worth defending and if all I have to do is write a post or two to stand up for what I believe in I won't simply let that slip by because it is a hopeless enterprise. Why would that stop me? If I somehow manage to reach them good for me if I don't I'll atleast have made my point.
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"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted July 24, 2011 01:58 AM |
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It's sad that someone so young ended up dying because of self-destructive behavior, but I detest the inevitable rewriting of history that is sure to come in the next couple of days. Fact is she drank, smoked and cracked herself to death, just like thousands of other people do every day in this world.
Is this any great, tragic loss to the world? No. Is it sad that we seem to value people so much who value themselves so little? Yes.
On another note, we're veering into the realm of the uncivil, so let's not go there, ok?
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 02:36 AM |
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I didn't know she was that young
that kinda reminds me of ohforf rant in the ben laden death thread.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted July 24, 2011 04:30 AM |
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Quote:
In the grand scheme of things you are of course right but it doesn't give us the right to call her worthless does it?
Its the internetz lad, and yes she was worthless.
Easy come,easy go.
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 04:37 AM |
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Quote:
What you said now while still terribly conceited is your own oppinion, earlier you were stating it as a fact.
Value is subjective, so saying "and nothing of value was lost" is clearly an opinion.
Who was Amy Winehouse, to me? A stranger who produced bad music. I'm not going to mourn.
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Eccentric Opinion
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william
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
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posted July 24, 2011 04:49 AM |
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Edited by william at 04:51, 24 Jul 2011.
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This will be quick but Mvass, you're a tosser. Let me explain something to you:
Musicians make music that reaches out to people. People listen to the music, feel a connection and as such they feel connected to the artist. When the artist dies, they feel sad because they feel connected to their music.
What you need to learn, Mvass, is respect. You have none. What you did when MJ died was disgusting. What you're doing now is disgusting. If you don't care, piss off. Nobody could care less about your opinion and the only one who looks like a fool is you and boy you've really made yourself look like a ****head in this thread.
Somebody has died. You don't have to like their music. You don't have to like the things they did. But they are/were a human being. They were somebodies child. How would you like it if somebody you were close to died and I said they were worthless? Same thing. Many people, who have never met her, had a lot of respect for her and her music, they felt connected to her, they were touched by her and the messages in her music. That is what happens with people when they listen to artists. A lot of people were effected by MJ's music because of the messages in it. It meant something to them and that is what people and MJ had in common. That is why they mourned his loss at the time and that is why people mourn for Amy Winehouse.
Have some respect for once. You don't have to like her music. I think her music is **** but I would never be disrespectful if they died. If Lady Gaga died I'd be having the same reaction and would be sad that she went even though I think she is a talentless attention w**** but that's really beside the point.
Now do us all a favour and just leave this thread. You'll only make yourself look like a bigger fool than you already have made yourself out to be.
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~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted July 24, 2011 05:12 AM |
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She was not the nicest person by far & had many problems.
I do not wish death to anyone.
The 27 club cont!
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Dreaming of a Better World
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 06:19 AM |
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William is already back! That was fast.Quote:
How would you like it if somebody you were close to died and I said they were worthless?
I wouldn't care much. I'd care even less if someone I don't know said something like that. If you care about the opinions of total strangers (and aren't trying to earn their support or sell them anything), it's you who has the problem. I know for a fact there is are a few people in the world who despise me. What of it? I never have to see them, so I don't care.
Other people like Amy Winehouse. Other people like MJ. That's fine. I don't share their music taste, but I understand they like what they like. As long as I'm not subjected to it, I don't care either way. I do, however, express my opinion that I find nothing of value in either of their music and that their death doesn't affect me.
I don't like this smothering disguised as "respect". Not everyone matters to everyone. Opinions don't deserve protection from criticism. Judge and prepare to be judged.
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Eccentric Opinion
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 07:36 AM |
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Mvass, I see you are not posting in the Oslo thread.
Don't you want to post there, that you don't care about some 90 people who you don't know either?
The "all men are created equal" stuff is an acknowledgement, that humans aber able to put themselves in each other's shoes. This ability is called compassion empathy. In this case it means, that we can imagine the grief and the suffering and the pain and the agony of the dead as well as the living.
In Oslo it's the pain and the fear of the dead and the grief of the prants and friends and kin of the dead, with Amy Whinehouse it's the pain of a talented, could-be-great artist that somehow was unable to cope with life and had the means to slowly kill herself.
Which is, what Will is trying to tell you. You know Mvass, mass murderers don't have compassion empathy. They are unable to feel compassion empathy, and they are unable to put themselves in someone else's shoes, an ability our whole idea of a modern society of equals is built upon.
In the end it could happen to everyone, given the wrong circumstances.
We know, you couldn't care less about Amy and her music, and that's probably true for quite a lot of people. The same is true for the Norwegians; the victims of 9/11; the dead of WW II or any other war in history; as long as we or people we know are not affected, well, we can't suffer for everyone who dies, can we?
Nope, we can't. But we can expect a little bit respect for the tragedies that life sometimes means, and since we inevitably will live through those or similar tragedies as well, we can imagine the amount of grief and loss for the living and the amount of tragedy for the dead, and that's why we tend to show at least a little bit respect in the face of it.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted July 24, 2011 07:42 AM |
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I think the word JJ is looking for is 'empathy'.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 07:51 AM |
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 08:04 AM |
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JJ:
There's a difference between the people in Oslo and Amy Winehouse - the people in Oslo were murdered. Thus, I care about how that turns out. I want the murderer brought to justice. If nothing else, I care about the violation of these people's right to not be killed. (Edit: Also I didn't post in the Oslo topic because it degenerated into a "Those teenagers should've attacked him!" discussion.)
However, consider this. If you can wake up tomorrow and go about your normal life as usual without any noticeable difference aside from the occasional news report, whatever happened probably didn't affect you. In that case, "caring about strangers in distant lands" is a hobby, much like stamp collecting, and practically speaking not very different morally, either.
Quote:
The "all men are created equal" stuff is an acknowledgement, that humans aber able to put themselves in each other's shoes.
No, it means that by default the law should treat all people equally. No one innocent person should have more legal rights than another. It also means that by default people have certain rights, such as the right to not be killed, that should not be violated regardless of who that person is. Empathy doesn't come into it anywhere.
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Eccentric Opinion
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 24, 2011 09:11 AM |
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If that is so, Mvass, I absolutely do not see any reason why you should have the same rights than me. I have more money than you, I'm stronger and older than you - why would I accept that people are equal, when they in fact are not?
I see "shoulds" in your post, but no reasoning whatsoever.
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Darkshadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted July 24, 2011 09:16 AM |
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Quote:
I don't care if this person lives or not and I'll make sure as hell that the ones in mourning knows it too
She didn't even care about that herself so why should anyone else?
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted July 24, 2011 09:24 AM |
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Quote:
Sad not but not surprising. She was self-destructive.
This. I think she was quite talented, I didn't like all her songs, but she had a good voice (when she was not drunk) and a distinctive style of singing. She had a couple of very good songs, I'll still enjoy 'Rehab' and 'Back To Black', even if they have an even darker edge to them now.
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What will happen now?
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted July 24, 2011 11:10 AM |
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Guys...there is no reason to compare the death of Amy Whinehouse with the horrible thing happened in Norway. There is an own thread for that.
If I am concerned about a tragic thing, it is still allowed to be concerned about a different thing too, even though this may not be as tragically as the first one.
And one more note to mvass:
As you may remember, you have been silenced in the mentioned thread about Michael Jackson'S death, because of your behaviour there. You start to act similar here. I repeat it for you, if you may have forgotten:
If you do not have anything to contribute to the thread, STAY OUT!
Everything else is just provocation. And I will judge it exactly as this!
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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TheBaron
Promising
Known Hero
dreamer of dreams
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posted July 24, 2011 11:12 AM |
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Edited by TheBaron at 11:26, 24 Jul 2011.
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I appreciate what some of us are saying about respecting the dead, while I also appreciate what Mvass is saying about comparable tragedies.
I think you'll all agree that we tend to have a more emotional response to those events that are closer to us personally. Some people feel that Amy Winehouse had a significant effect on them through her singing and feel far more disconnected from the Norwegian massacre because... well maybe they don't know any Norwegians? Perhaps draw an analogy in family: Would you be more upset if your mother died or your cousin died? Both are tragic and involve the loss of a life, but generally our mother's are closest to us, and we therefore feel that loss more keenly.
I think what Mvass is trying to say is that, if you have no connection to Amy Winehouse, then the loss of 90 deaths vs the loss of 1 is significant. I agree, especially when I think that our mourning is prioritised and influenced by third-parties, which are namely mainstream media sources. I think it is strange that a known drug abuser who (most likely) died of a drug overdose receives more attention, coverage and promoted sympathy than the brutal killings of 90 odd young people (mostly under 24). What kind of message are we sending to people about who we should care about in the world when we behave like this? Between a blatantly smacked out celebrity vs our wider global community it seems that celebrity trumps the general population. I spoke to plenty of people who didn't even know what happened in Norway! I just think it's a sad indictment of our media and we, as consumers, who support this kind of behaviour. You think that News Ltd, Fairfax, Reuters and whoever aren't watching social media sites and noting what people are talking about? It probably means there's going to be plenty more of AW on the front page for days to come.
Even if her music has affected you on some deep level, doesn't mourning the loss of one public death to the exclusion of others show a certain considered ignorance to the other tragedies going on in the world? I'm not saying we should start a thread called "I feel bad for all the sad things that are happening now and in the recent past" but heck, if you're going to acknowledge a tragedy, why not take the time to INCLUDE or ACKNOWLEDGE the other ones that are happening at the same time!
EDIT: Here is a youtube link to a friend doing an Amy Winehouse tribute song/cover. If you're into it, he's very good!
http://youtu.be/m9CMRU2p8Ug
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Adrius
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
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posted July 24, 2011 11:42 AM |
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Weird, somehow I feel capable of mourning two things at once...! I must have special powers.
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