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| Thread: Inferno Tactics |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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andiangelsla...
Disgraceful
Famous Hero
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posted March 22, 2002 01:29 PM |
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Inferno Tactics
need more heroes threads, so i toss 1 
post your likes and dislikes for inferno, your tactics, or just stuff you think is worth being mentioned
i for myself like inferno, for their speed, and the possibility of making demons, its fun
buidling order for rich maps, never changes: mage guild day1, devils and castle than of course, with devils and efreets you kick ass good and fast 
for randoms on higher difficulty or any other poor maps: try getting efreet as fast as possible, also pit lords are a good option, screw the dogs week1 (and often whole game, a shame  coz they cool)
the building order of inferno is 1 of the easiest in general, since you can skip L3, and start with L6 super early, its almost like stronghold with that behemot hehe.
for the heroes, no great specialist here, but playable might heroes like pyre, shes cool, or marius and nymus
since i always play might my thoughts dont count lol, but what do you prefer with inferno if you got the choice, pyre or for example ayden?
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evil_eye
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 22, 2002 01:39 PM |
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Inferno tatctics...
...this castle remember's me about something "heat"..and i never forget .i play with inferno aginst rampart...and i never win ...
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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted March 22, 2002 01:56 PM |
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dogs = demon food
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"Youre zeroes and ones, youre wrong where im right"
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sos
Known Hero
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posted March 22, 2002 07:07 PM |
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Edited By: sos on 22 Mar 2002
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Inferno is my favorite town - perfect on random 160%. Its kinda expensive moneywise, but very cheap resourcewise. Usually I go for gold first - citihall day 5 for sure, then gogs + citadel (if start with no gogs) or castle first week. The armies from the first 3 heroes are usually enough to clear most things week 1 so I dont need more troops anyway. Once you have castle built its very difficult to lose your town week 2 or 3. (I remember a game with Xarfax where he attacked me early week 2 with 3 behemoths, rocks and other troops. I had a choice to buy my troops in town to defend, to build demons, or to build a capitol. I built my cap and defended the town with very few imps and gogs killing almost all his troops ). Depending on the map I will built my capitol early (day 8-10 week 2) and after that start building creatures. Since they require very few resources there is no problem building everything upto efreets. If I build cap day 8 or 9, next thing I will build is resource silo. About half the time I am able to get devils week 2, otherwise week 3, on almost any map even if all I have is a wood and ore mine. My real game starts early week 3 when I buy my devils or sultans and go rocking . Most of the time my main will cary only devils and sultans for max speed. Once I upgrade pit lords I start collecting demons with my main or a second hero. In the third and forth week I try to get my guild at least to level 4 - if I get arma (happens quite often) game is almost won since I can clear most conservatories, hives, etc. with no losses. I need mana and power for this tho, thats why I prefer magic heroes on randoms.
About the heroes:
If I play on impossible and have a choice of hero I get Calid for his sulfur.
Otherwise, Pyre is maybe the best starting hero - with her balista you can win many battles with no losses, because your imps are fast and can run around while her balista (slowly) kills the monsters. She starts with logistics also, and most importantly her artillery is very usefull when early under siege since she can control the towers. I wouldnt make her my main tho, although she is not bad. It will be prolly Aiden from Inferno (who is not that great initially, but starts with view earth, which rocks on random), or a good (magic) hero from other town.
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Madriver
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 22, 2002 07:51 PM |
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demons, demons, demons
I'm waiting for Wiggy_wam to post on this thread
After playing him on one of my first TOH games ever, for the MVM tourny, I learned the all important demon spawning technique. When you can get to your opponent with 200-300 demons by the end of the month (epending on the map) and possibly have mass haste or teleport, you can use this uber stack to mop up the game board. I like playing on hg2 or hg3 and developing a second town just for demon spawning (castle or rampart is great for this, high hitpoint low level creatures).
On random, I develop creatures as fast as possible (if 100% or 130%) or money (if 160% or higher). Getting a hero with diplomacy will get many recruits who are just waiting to be demons. Compared to other towns inferno is pretty weak, but if you add in the demon spawning inferno can hold its own.
Heros....for MvM I'm Ayden, which is great for the early sessions of a map, high spell points, but is not so great later on, especially since it always seems that my opponenets get recanters. I would choose pyrus (ballista and logistics) or Marius (demon specialty), or even better, ryland, adela, or cyra.
The graphics on the devils are one of my favorites.
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David_Ryan
Adventuring Hero
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posted March 22, 2002 08:18 PM |
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I have posted enough on the topic and some of you summed up the jist. However, you missed the most important thing: Archdevils and CASTLE GATE! AD are quite expensive and they die easily... unless you know how to hit with them. Best strategy: wait them until end of turn, strike, return, be happy. Work perfect behind siege walls.
Now Castle gate. Whatever you tell me, this is the best feature of any town in this game. In a way better than TP for everyone, even the weakest hero with one imp and no wisdom can pass through it. And no movement! 2 Infernos linked... come, come enemies, on day 1 there is no army, you're almost there in front of the town and the population of 2 weeks (or maybe more) is under your nose... what a surprise! I have won quite some battles using this strategy. Ayden is a great hero, I'm such a sucker for magic. You, toh people discrimiate magic way too much. This is not fair. If you ask me CH is just a bug as DD and TP. Anyway, we're not talking about ToH. But Inferno without fire magic and these efreeti is just not Inferno. Also, Inferno is among the few towns that have sacrifise and oh, well, this is just a ridiculously bad spell.  (bad as in bad girl, bad boy )
Ayden is just great as a main hero. He never runs short of spellpoints while being a heretic allows him to advance mostly on spellpower. Try any implosion... oh, boy, it hurts.
Andi, I disagree, Cerberi are just great unit. Maybe the best third unit (though my other thoughts are that R griffins are ). They are quick, hard to kill, can attack several stacks at a time but most important thing is they don't have retaliation. I will get the over gogs, or demons, or even pit fiends almost any time.
Gimme 2 infernos, get CH and 2 stronghols and see who wins. 
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uncle_alan
Tavern Dweller
Red or Dead
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posted March 22, 2002 08:27 PM |
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I'd have to say that I disagree...
Inferno can be tough to play on random maps, as if you wish to build the high level mage guilds quickly, you tend to find yourself low on some of he rarer resources, as on random maps they are generally scarce. And, as you may have guessed, random!
Also, if you are playing 160% upwards, it is best to build the resource silo early on to avoid problems when recruiting level 7 devils.
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One day Alan's rule the world
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ironmlh
Known Hero
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posted March 22, 2002 10:31 PM |
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Inferno tactics
Inferno is one of my favorite towns... i always play at 160% and build town structures depending on the random map template. On most it goes like this.. Mage guild, gogs or demons if gogs are pre-built, efreet, pit lord, citadel and castle.
Even on 160% i can achieve this strucure approximately 60-70% of the time.
If the template is restrictive and short on gold i build like this... Mage Guild, Town Hall, marketplace, blacksmith, city hall, demons (hopefully gogs are pre-built) and then hope to recruit efreets day 7.
I can rarely utilize the Pit Lords/fiends ability to ressurect allies as demons.. Unless i can find another town or external dwelling based on another town. This skill is very very good if you can utilize to its fullest effect, much better than necromancy if applied correctly in the right situation. LIke i said, this rarely happens to me.
Typically week 2 all gold is put forth to build capitol or devils, depends on gold and mercury situation, Devils by week 3 at latest.
I like to use Efreet and a cerebri in my army during week 2 and early week 3, this is a very effective combo. If you can get gunnar or a hero with tactics skill you will have an awesome early combo with the strong efreet and the non-retaliation of the cerbri. I have managed to get this combo a surprising amount of times. One can run around and take out any shooters with relative ease. Dwarven treasuries of any number are very easy with this combo.
However stronger groups of walkers need different tactics.
Week 4 and on i concentrate on getting gold and buying all level 3-7 troops for your full blown army by week 5 or 6. Of course thats a best case scenario, but with even an average map this can be done.
Inferno heroes are notoriously weak, overall. My favs are Pyre and Ayden. I do prefer might over magic.
The rest of the troops. Imps, they suck but at least they are relatively quick. Demons are good solid fighters. Arch devils rule due to there non-retaliation and there quick speed, however they are slightly under powered.
This is not much of a real strategic plan but it is my general tactics i use when playing inferno.
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"Knowledge has discarded all biblical teachings"
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Fantusta
Known Hero
who wishes he was high
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posted March 23, 2002 04:43 AM |
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I usually don't play as Inferno, but with them, I think that Pit Lords are underrated. Eveyont talks of them just as being demon-raisers. They're actually pretty good normal walkers to lay the smack down around the battlefield.
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You're unique, just like everyone else. I'm just better.
I'm challenging preconcieved notions you haven't even thought up yet!
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Ichon
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted March 23, 2002 06:29 AM |
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cerbei
I agree with ironml about the cerbei/efreet combo. It's one of the best combos of only 2 units when neither is a 7th level. Only Baslisk/Fly, Roc/Cyclops, or maybe Champion/Griffons are as good, but all those cept Fly/Baslisk are rather rare to get week 1. Inferno naturally lends itself to that build, and if you get at least citadel week 1, you have enough units to pretty much do as much as your hero levels can handle with just those 2 units.
Overall Inferno has fewest HP, but that is negated by fact they almost always strike first with most of their units. I think only weakness other than HP is demons too slow, and PL should do a tiny bit more damage or have higher defence to make up for low HP.
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wiggy_wam
Promising
Famous Hero
local pirate
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posted March 23, 2002 06:46 AM |
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after 3 weeks, I record the # of demons / horned demons I have ...
on any toh map, I can average 80-120 demons. (3 weeks)
3 week records:
- 174 horned demons, random XL (fire shield worked well)
- 196 horned demons, bob2 (gotta go with air magic)
- 218 demons, hg3 (thanks to adela)
- 264 demons, hgXL
- 266 demons, hgXL
havn't done it on giant war yet, I imagine I'd get a ton from that map
about cerebi, they're great vs the cpu, but in battles with other humans, unless you have the RED ORB, they suck because their damage is too low to be of effective use... unless they are blessed.
therefore, dogs = demon food
other things to remember:
- can't raise demons on cursed ground
- can't raise undead, gargoyles, or golems.
- each pit-lords raises up to 1.4 demons, rounded down.
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- wiggy ... who has a crush on Rob's models. Well ... the ones his age (18-26)
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thecastrated
Famous Hero
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posted March 23, 2002 08:23 AM |
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Question
Each pit lord raises 1.4 demons? But what must the health units of creatures' killed be? so 1 pit lord can raise 1 demon if 4 pikemen are killed but not 3 or???I need some formula.
I dun really consider inferno that strong though..when seiging a castle, only 3 units can attack if wall isnt broken
castle, tower, nec, hav 4 while dung has 5(!)
And imps are really imppy
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Mad_Unicorn
Famous Hero
I am a mean person shame on me
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posted March 23, 2002 09:34 AM |
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uhm i never noticed..
1.4 demons raised per imp since it doesn't equate hit point wise ^_^ but what do i know only play inferno for clan games anyway and never was a master at demon creating only could get 255 on hg (125+ from joiner)
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted March 23, 2002 09:34 AM |
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The demon raising technique has been going on since day1 and it really pretty much a closed map technique.
By the way the technique is greatly increased with the use of the HP artifacts such as vial of lifeblood.
Inferno got a bad rap in ToH because map designers feared armageddon and took it out of the maps.
Too bad because Inferno has week hp units and it's main strength is efreet and arma.
Speed 13 is not so fast of a unit and I think they gave arma to Inferno to make up for the low hp units and not as powerful fire spells.
Inferno rules randoms because of the speed, demonmancy and armageddon.
Inferno heroes are great because they always get logistics early but again on cheesey ToH maps they are all but blacklisted due to the altar of sacrifice.
Someone must have really had a vendeta against Inferno when making all these toh maps w/no arma and tons of useless artifacts that Inferno heroes can't cash in at the altar.
But only now in the last 6 months with the huge increase in random play have people seen it's real power.
-Mocara
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Madriver
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 23, 2002 03:12 PM |
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demon raising
There is a formula and it is related to HP. The amount of demons that can be raised is dependant on the HP of the dead troops, 35 HP per demon. So, 4 pikemen have 40 hp which means 1 demon, 3 pikemen have 30 hp which means no demons. And it also is dependant on the 1.4 demons that can be raised per pit lord, so every pit lord can raise 49hp (35hp per demon X 1.4 demons per pit lord) of dead troop stack into demons. This is why pikeman and dwarves are great for spawning, relatively high HP for such low level creatures (10hp and 20hp respectively).
Whenever I use this technique I always keep the calculator application open in the background.
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Blackdeath
Hired Hero
Zealot of The Light
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posted March 25, 2002 09:33 PM |
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My opinion...
The Inferno is the worst city by fare! For one there slow, and they lack any archery units next to the destructive Magogs. When fighting people of the light as I, they are at a disadvantage majorly to. They just plain ol SUCK!!!
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Emperor Blackdeath
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ShadowLord
Promising
Famous Hero
of Dope
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posted March 25, 2002 09:48 PM |
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You can't really say that BlackDeath... I actually find them cost effective too (not for the AD's)! When used properly and played well... This is what you get ---> HAVOC!
My tactics for the first 2-3 weeks is to split my efreets (sultans after the first week) into two stacks until I get devils, then they can take down both melee and range opponent creatures. They are good for flagging/taking guarded mines/or resources for the first few weeks. Gogs as a backup! Then use imps for decoys! I use Rashka for it's Efreet specialty... Xeron if available for it's Devils specialty! However magogs are really self destructive when not used properly.
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Do I need DRUGS when I have HEROES?
Heroes == Good
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Ichon
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted March 26, 2002 05:33 AM |
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cerbei getting bad rap?
I don't know about anyone else, but for me the Inferno battles always revolve around 3 units, demons(raised stack needs worry opponent to eliminate first just as skellies do for necro)Efreets- keeping them alive or out of reach of opponent so they get nervous about armegeddon and make bad moves trying to kill of the efreets, and cerbei. AD only important in first couple of rounds for spell casting, and eliminating select opposing units, after the battle closes to melee their low HP always causes them to die too quick to really protect.
Also- if you get the kennels week 2 at least and don't lose many dogs, you'll have a decent # by week 3-4, and it's often worth it to bless them, 9 damage x # of dogs usually adds up to alot, plus 8 speed is very useful for a level 3 unit.
Mocara- 13 speed isn't that fast? Compared to what? Only a few 7th have much faster and that leaves out, Titan, CH, and AB. It's the fastest unit with any strength lower than 7th, and the fire shield + immunity to fire are nice specials. Often means you can have a very nice first attack unit to absorb retaliation and get the extra fire shield damage which is proportional to damage done, so the larger the stack attacked the more damage done when it retaliates. Since Inferno usually loses imps and gogs thru demon raising- that leaves 2 slots for efreets to solo in and hit absorbing retaliation plus extra fire shield damage which is often the difference of the few HP between 1 more 7th level unit alive to dish out damage or dead and large % decrease in damage done next round.
I agree that ToH map designs sucked alot of the potency out of Inferno, along with some of the other towns.
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wiggy_wam
Promising
Famous Hero
local pirate
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posted March 26, 2002 08:37 PM |
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who needs the dogs when u got expert air magic?
after 3 weeks, 31-41 dogs = 22-29 demons added to a stack that's about ... 75 demons, making it about 100 demons.
so those dogs make up for 25% of your demons (when u don't have deplomacy). An extra 7-9 demons per week.
casting bless on cerebi is a wasted spell in multiplayer. The 41 cerebi will do about 180 damage, 280 if blessed. An extra 100 damage for a unit your opponent will avoid is NOTHING compared to a 200 damage meteor shower.
in multiplayer, the only units that make the difference are the high damage ones (if you're not a spell-caster), or the high HP ones (if you are a spell-caster). The cerebi DO have high HP, but low damage just like most other lvl3 units. A demon averages twice the damage of a cerebi, a pit-fiend twice that of a demon. Therefore pit-fiends are a MUCH bigger threat than cerebi. Implode them.
cerebi have much in common with the harpy-hag. They are great against cpu, but not in multiplay. They seem to stay alive the longest in a multiplay battle, because they are NOT the primary targets of the opponent, nor should they be. Why kill 4 hags when u can kill a minotaur? Why kill 2 cerebi when u can kill 1 pit-fiend? because hags and cerebi suck in combat unless they're used in recon. Can you successfully use them in recon? If you can use them in recon, then your opponent is either dumb or has crappy spells.
Mass hasted Marius' horned demons have a speed of 13. That's when I want my extra 25% demons
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- wiggy ... who has a crush on Rob's models. Well ... the ones his age (18-26)
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Ichon
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted March 26, 2002 11:53 PM |
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exactly
Yep wiggy; that is why I said it revolves around 3 units for Inferno, demons being the first one I named. Also you are totally correct, almost every battle my cerbei are one of the only surviving untouched or mostly whole stacks, but that is why they so useful- It's not so much they are an awsome unit individually(though I think 2nd or 3rd best level 3) but because they tend to stick around so long and all the other Inferno units are so low HP, they make a large difference for Inferno, what other level 3 unit could you replace them with? The other thing is that if they only get to attack 1 unit then they don't do huge amounts of damage, but it's a rare game when I don't get to use them vs at least 2 units. For 2 reasons- opponent disregards them because damage is so low and sets his two units together because he considers it more important to get gang attack on demons for instance, or with the mass haste you mentioned- horned demon speed of 13 equals cerbei speed of 15 given same parameters(though horned demons speed 13 is based on native terrain and demon specialty hero?) Cerbei is the 2nd archer- or 3rd if you consider AD to be sort of an archer type unit, but it's the toughest in proportion to damage done...(aside from ES) that is in multi, leaving aside their use in battles against comp.
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