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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted November 24, 2014 03:29 PM |
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Avirosb said:
Maurice said:
Do we even know that the creature is really a Basilisk? As it is, it only has 4 legs, while I believe a traditional Basilisk has 6? At least the one in Heroes3 had 6 legs.
Besides, the creature Obi-Wan is riding on is a Varactyl - it's not a Basilisk  .
This is Ashan, Heroes3 need not apply 
No, I believe a traditional Basilisk is more akin to a snake with a crown or something.
Must not under any circumstance be confused with the Cockatrice.
Best place to start such research is good ol' Wikipedia. Basilisks are described to be the King of Lizards/Serpents, is venomous and has a deadly gaze. And from there, things start to vary. Basilisks have been depicted with 0-8 legs, 0-2 wings, similar or not to a Cockatrice and many more things.
So basically, if it is a venomous reptile, one may call it a basilisk.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 24, 2014 03:31 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 15:33, 24 Nov 2014.
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War-overlord said:
Stevie said:
Well, at if we take your word for it, then we'll have an Elite tier Basilisk rode by an Orc in the Sahaar Stronghold line-up. I'm so shocked I don't even know what to think of it. A creature previously shown as wet environment friendly now gets the dry desert.
What ever happened to "This is Ashan, not Erathia. Stop living in the Past." 
Seriously though, Basilisks have very little relevant lore in M&M. So the only thing that ties them to the swamps is that one time in Tatalia.
Well, you got a point I just see them trying to allude at the old universe as much as possible to please the old timers, but their Ashan spins don't exactly strike me as stellar.
War-overlord said:
Stevie said:
And the orc on top, why?! Is it a requirement to ride every beast on the face of Ashan? Bad design. Would've been better if it was something more like a desert Komodo wearing some battle equipment crafted by the orcs.
Are you serious? Ashan is very Cavalry unfriendly, not counting Heroes. I mean Humans ride Horses, Dwarves ride Bears and Some DElves ride Raptors in one of the least cringeworthy attempts to copy Warhammer. And lets face it, horses and bear are more animals rather then creatures. Nearly every other "Creature" isn't ridden.
Well, you excluded a big chunk of the lore with "not counting heroes". I mean, what are heroes if not also creatures? Haven heroes are still humans, Fortress heroes are still dwarves, Sylvan heroes are still elves and Stronghold heroes are still orcs. If you look at the Might and Magic universe as a whole, you'll see that there are a lot of creatures being ridden: Horses, Bears and Raptors which you mentioned, Mamoths, Elephants, Unicorns, Bulls from Heroes V, then Griffins, Wyverns, Panthers, Oliphants, Vultures, Hippogryphs, Kirins and Abyssal Worms from DoC. And ironically, most of them are Stronghold mounts, so yea, please give me another mounted beast, there's never enough of them.
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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted November 24, 2014 03:33 PM |
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Stevie said:
Vultures, Hippogryphs, Kirins
Hippogryphs?
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 24, 2014 03:37 PM |
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted November 24, 2014 03:38 PM |
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Edited by Avonu at 15:45, 24 Nov 2014.
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Avirosb said:
No, I believe a traditional Basilisk is more akin to a snake with a crown or something.
Must not under any circumstance be confused with the Cockatrice.
I just "love" D&D and its influence sometimes. 
Let's me tell local legend about basilisk:
Basilisk is born form rooster's egg, placed on a bunch of... manure and hatched by toad for 9 years.
Basilisk had a body of rooster, snake tail and eyes of frog. It lived in dungeons, basements and other dark places under city streets.
Basilisk was afraid two things: ruta and weasel.
@Stevie
Cassadnra's mount is gryphon.
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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted November 24, 2014 03:38 PM |
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Stevie said:
I think it's a black Griffin. On her alt-art it's certainly a Griffin.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 24, 2014 03:45 PM |
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It looks a lot more like a hippogryph to me. Long beak and non-curved wings and black feathers on the entire body, whereas a griffin has a curved beak, curved wings and partially covered with yellow-white feathers, the rest being feline skin.
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Zeki
Supreme Hero
sup
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posted November 24, 2014 03:46 PM |
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Sandro400 said:
@Dave_Jame
And they can ride giant hyenas and manticores. Oh, I would like to see hyena rider...
A hyena riding Goblin would be awesome, a nice nod to the wolfriders from h3 and as there are Wolves in Haven hyenas would be the perfect replacement. This plus decent behemoths and these basilisk riding orcs and this might become the first Ashan Stronghold lineup that i like. Oh, and please leave out these ugly brown blobs that they call Cyclops i just can't stand them.
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted November 24, 2014 03:47 PM |
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Edited by Avirosb at 15:47, 24 Nov 2014.
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Sandro400 said:
I think it's a black Griffin. On her alt-art it's certainly a Griffin.
Oh it's black, so that's why I thought it was purple.
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted November 24, 2014 03:50 PM |
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Stevie said:
It looks a lot more like a hippogryph to me. Long beak and non-curved wings and black feathers on the entire body, whereas a griffin has a curved beak, curved wings and partially covered with yellow-white feathers, the rest being feline skin.
Here you have a better picture:
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"When someone desires information, they come to me."
"Details are everything."
Pipiru piru piru pipiru pi!
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted November 24, 2014 03:50 PM |
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Stevie said:
Well, you excluded a big chunk of the lore with "not counting heroes". I mean, what are heroes if not also creatures? Haven heroes are still humans, Fortress heroes are still dwarves, Sylvan heroes are still elves and Stronghold heroes are still orcs. If you look at the Might and Magic universe as a whole, you'll see that there are a lot of creatures being ridden: Horses, Bears and Raptors which you mentioned, Mamoths, Elephants, Unicorns, Bulls from Heroes V, then Griffins, Wyverns, Panthers, Oliphants, Vultures, Hippogryphs, Kirins and Abyssal Worms from DoC. And ironically, most of them are Stronghold mounts, so yea, please give me another mounted beast, there's never enough of them.
I don't think I exclude a whole chuck of lore when I say that Heroes, who are certain very special individuals, greatly differ from full fledged forces of Cavalry.
Of all those things named, there are only 3, the ones to which I've pointed, which made it to be producable units in the Heroes Games.
Further more, I think it imperative to distinguish between Animals (Which exist almost entirely unchanged upon our world) and Creature(Mythological species not fully sentient and non-existant on our world)
Further more, I hardly think one should take DoC as a precedent. As it is know to play fast and loose with lore and history, in favor of looking cool.
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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted November 24, 2014 04:02 PM |
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Stevie said:
It looks a lot more like a hippogryph to me. Long beak and non-curved wings and black feathers on the entire body, whereas a griffin has a curved beak, curved wings and partially covered with yellow-white feathers, the rest being feline skin.
It reminds me of Loyal Griffin art - they're almost one and the same, only lacks armor and has different color.
Avirosb said:
Oh it's black, so that's why I thought it was purple.
Well, you got me there, but actually it's bluish-black 
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 24, 2014 04:07 PM |
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Avonu said:
Here you have a better picture:
And you think that's the gryphon you linked in your previous post? Yea right...
@ WO, I don't care if you take it as a precedent or not. Fact is, the game's under the Might and Magic franchise, that's enough for me.
Your distinction between Heroes and armies is unbased at a lore level. A hero delf is not any different from any other delf of his kin. Incidentally they both ride Raptors in Heroes V, like humans ride horses, so that argument falls short in certain cases. You can't extract a rule out of it.
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted November 24, 2014 04:07 PM |
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War-overlord said:
Further more, I hardly think one should take DoC as a precedent. As it is know to play fast and loose with lore and history, in favor of looking cool.
I disagree. DoC managed to do one thing, that any other game set in ashan failed to achieve. Give that world some depth.
Thank to this game, we got a world, that is not only filled with "general armies" but with dozens of cults, local variations, sub factions etc.
You may say that the game is not to be taken as a precedent, but look at H7 haven. The artstyle is taken from DoC. And the Arcane eagle? I would give my money on it, that the reason it is in DoC is it was added to academy in H7. The two games influence each other, and so do all M&M games.
Sure not 100% of the art is to be taken for granted, but neglecting DoC's contribution to the franchise is a bit blind.
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted November 24, 2014 04:18 PM |
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Stevie said:
And you think that's the gryphon you linked in your previous post? Yea right...
No, I just put this image, so you could see it in more details.
Now tell me, which part of this purple-black Cassandra's mount suppose to be a horse part? Griffin is a mix of lion and eagle, while IIRC hippogryph is a mix of a griffin and a horse. I don't see any horse "parts" on this picture, so point them to me, please.
____________
"When someone desires information, they come to me."
"Details are everything."
Pipiru piru piru pipiru pi!
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 24, 2014 04:32 PM |
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I already explained why I believe it's a hippogryph. Color, beak and wings. You cannot see the legs which I assume they are horse like. It might be another creature, but it certainly doesn't look like a griffin.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted November 24, 2014 05:02 PM |
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Dave_Jame said:
The two games influence each other, and so do all M&M games.
Sure not 100% of the art is to be taken for granted, but neglecting DoC's contribution to the franchise is a bit blind.
I'm not saying I'm ignoring it. I'm saying I'm not taking it as precedent. Precedent as in: 1.An act in the past which may be used as an example to help decide the outcome of similar instances in the future.
For instance, DoC has shown that Dragon Golems and Taweret have been associated with Academy. As you say, DoC focussus on niches and subsections of some societies. Therefor I do not take it as a given that the Silver Cities can produce enough Dragon Golem and Taweret to use in the wars on the great scale which Heroes depicts, without sources other than DoC.
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Kenishi
Famous Hero
passed out drunk in Tavern's
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posted November 24, 2014 05:30 PM |
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I would suggest a Cowardly Gnoll ridden (see Duel of Champions card) by a Goblin (like Ferra/Torr from MK X) ... no but in all seriousness I think that most of the ridden units in Heroes 5 and onward were riddled with either poorly presented or accused of being ripped of so I think they should experiment whit some concepts there could be a hidden gem somewhere but having the comparison with the Star Wars creature is not quite a good step. Then again I will refrain from a full judgment until we have a clearer picture of what his rider look like and in which faction it belongs.
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No Gods, no Masters. Knowledge is Power, and Power is Freedom
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 24, 2014 05:31 PM |
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Incoming Wizards' Armies Champions blog post.
Already saw the art. Seems they settled for the Arcane Eagle name.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted November 24, 2014 05:33 PM |
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Kenishi said:
Then again I will refrain from a full judgment until we have a clearer picture of what his rider look like and in which faction it belongs.
I very much believe that the rider is supposed to be an Orc, so that leaves very little question as to what faction it belongs to.
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This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
