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| Thread: Where should Heroes VIII be set? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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Elsa
Hired Hero
oh my
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posted June 18, 2015 10:39 PM |
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Edited by Elsa at 22:40, 18 Jun 2015.
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Where should Heroes VIII be set?
I was just reading the "Ditch Ashan?" thread and I saw there that a lot of people think the setting for the games should be changed(no one likes Ashan, how sad  ). I'm (personally) neutral about all this- I care little to nothing for the story/world, so long as the gameplay itself is the same- but I wonder, what kind of world do you think would be better for Heroes? Bring back a setting from a previous game, or make another entirely new one? If a new one, what exactly would it be like? What elements from the old games's worlds would be incorporated, and what ones would be discarded?
Please share your opinion, I am interested in hearing. ^^
(I planned on having this be just a post in the "Ditch Ashan?" thread, but then I thought it would be changing the subject too much. Sorry if I was supposed to put it there)
(Also sorry if there's already a thread for this  )
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Do you hear the sound of the forest calling?
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted June 18, 2015 10:57 PM |
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Edited by EnergyZ at 22:58, 18 Jun 2015.
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Well, if you prefer single scenarios over campaigns, than that could be justified.
However, some of us prefer stories. And it is not pleasing enough the story has been dumbed down, does not feel complex enough. Enroth had such a deep lore that it also has plot holes. Of course, nobody wants such plot holes, but I am just saying that they built lore through games, while Ubi builds games through lore they made.
Since I have my doubts about H7 making lore any better, it would be preferred to make a new one. I'd also say to return back to Axeoth or Enroth (or similar planes, like Xeen, VARN or Terra), but I feel they would get their greedy fingers on it and spoil much.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted June 18, 2015 10:57 PM |
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not to self-advertise or anything (that's a lie, i'm totally self-advertising) but i've been working on a potential setting that could work. so far has a Haven and stronghold line-up but am still working on their lore and snow.(Haven)
I'd just want them change setting at least every two or so games. The same world gets really boring really quickly, especially if it's as stale and rigid as Ashan. Don't let the world limit you, just do crazy snow and adapt the world after that. Ashan doesn't do that. Ashan has gameplay adapt to lore when the opposite should ALWAYS be true.
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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AnkVaati
Famous Hero
Nighonese National Front
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posted June 18, 2015 11:14 PM |
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Idealy: in Axeoth. Get in touch with JVC and whoever wrote the amazing script for the HoMM IV campaigns and ask what they had in mind for Tawni, Gauldoth, the Tatalians, this planed warlock-barbarian town and the others. And please keep Erwan and his gang as far away as possible.
Realistically: in a new setting inspired by the original HoMM/MM games. No dragon gods or generic fantasy concepts borrowed from Warhammer or WoW, nations/factions based on themes and not races, inspiration taken from Graeco-Roman mythology and other folklore.
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articun
Supreme Hero
As i dream, so shall it be!
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posted June 18, 2015 11:46 PM |
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I really don't mind Ashan. But in heroes games, we have much untapped potential and worlds previous games were set on.
There are magic portals and teleporters in the game, wouldn't be interesting if we had a game that somehow manages to connect those worlds?
For me that would open up a lot of possibilities.
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted June 18, 2015 11:49 PM |
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I'd prefer to have no real official setting, just a stock fantasy setting similar to Heroes 2 that supports as many independent stories as possible,
stop this Erwin approach of having any one setting's very stylized ideas and arbitrary creation myths be forced on us in gameplay and graphics, and instead incorporate those things only where they count, in actual story text lol
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articun
Supreme Hero
As i dream, so shall it be!
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posted June 19, 2015 12:11 AM |
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Heroes II followed archetype ideas about its factions didn't it? That did make it interesting but it also somehow felt inconsistent.
In such a setting, the greater aspect to keep everything together would be the storytelling. Unfortunately, i don't know if the level of current storytelling is of enough quality to support that idea.
Heroes II is like the Mythic age of the game, setting the faction archetypes, Heroes III is the legendary golden age shaping them with lore behind them and then... as the great cycles dictate, comes degeneration... and then we end up in the current era, when we are struggling after a short silver age (Heroes V) to attain a new Renaissance
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted June 19, 2015 12:22 AM |
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well bear in mind there isn't any storytelling in Heroes 1 or 2 to explain why the factions are composed the way they are, and most people fell in love with those games all the same lol
I love the mix and match, but a really ideal game would have enough flexibility built in to allow the mapmaker to dictate which creatures go into which faction as they wish, even create whole new factions or total convert the game, like in the Civilization or Warcraft series lol
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Elsa
Hired Hero
oh my
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posted June 19, 2015 03:49 AM |
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EnergyZ said:
Well, if you prefer single scenarios over campaigns, than that could be justified.
I do. It's just a personal thing- I understand that the story is important to some(maybe most) people, I just have little patience for such things.
kiryu133 said:
not to self-advertise or anything (that's a lie, i'm totally self-advertising) but i've been working on a potential setting that could work. so far has a Haven and stronghold line-up but am still working on their lore and snow.(Haven)
I read your thread, I think it is very interesting. I like your ideas ^^
AnkVaati said:
Idealy: in Axeoth. Get in touch with JVC and whoever wrote the amazing script for the HoMM IV campaigns and ask what they had in mind for Tawni, Gauldoth, the Tatalians, this planed warlock-barbarian town and the others. And please keep Erwan and his gang as far away as possible.
Realistically: in a new setting inspired by the original HoMM/MM games. No dragon gods or generic fantasy concepts borrowed from Warhammer or WoW, nations/factions based on themes and not races, inspiration taken from Graeco-Roman mythology and other folklore.
I've never played HoMM4 much, I had it but then I lost it. I don't remember much about it tbh, so I can't say anything about "Ideally", but the second one seems pretty interesting. I would love to see some inspiration from greek or roman mythology :3
Verriker said:
I'd prefer to have no real official setting, just a stock fantasy setting similar to Heroes 2 that supports as many independent stories as possible,
stop this Erwin approach of having any one setting's very stylized ideas and arbitrary creation myths be forced on us in gameplay and graphics, and instead incorporate those things only where they count, in actual story text lol
I think they could have a (likable) real official setting if they did it correctly. However, that seems unlikely, sadly.
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Do you hear the sound of the forest calling?
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Steyn
Supreme Hero
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posted June 19, 2015 07:54 AM |
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I prefer a post Dark Messiah setting, where demons can be a regular faction on the surface of Ashan without the need of stupid blood moons and the other factions can be justified to undergo some drastic changes.
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Can you make a faction including these units?
Join the Finding Harmony competition 2.0!
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Mediczero
Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
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posted June 19, 2015 09:33 AM |
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I wouldn't mind if Ashan stayed, I'm quiet fond of it, but a new setting could be cool too...
I'm currently working on a potential new setting for the games, though it is likely that I'm just going to use it for my own stuff (why waste a perfectly good setting?  ) as it probably wont be used for anything otherwise. The whole thing is still under development, but if you want to know more, send me a message on HC Messenger, be happy to talk about it and get feedback.
So far I got four factions: Rampart, which is this cross between Haven, Sylvan and the Sorceress town, A warlock faction not set undergrond, a mermaid faction called Reef and a stronghold with lots of greek/roman influence.
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Kimarous
Supreme Hero
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posted June 19, 2015 09:50 AM |
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Edited by Kimarous at 09:54, 19 Jun 2015.
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Ashan isn't so much in need of a reboot so much as it needs to move forward. The timeframe of the games has outright demanded continuity. H6 was before H5, so it had to set the stage. H7 takes place between H6 and H5, so it has to account both for what came before and for what came afterwards. H8? Set it past Dark Messiah - into the unknown, where the new can be explored, unrestrained by the need to maintain chronology with "future" events.
Mediczero said:
and a stronghold with lots of greek/roman influence.
IMO, if a faction is to have a major Greco-Roman theme, make a "new" town entirely and call it "Acropolis." Also, Greco-Roman imagery isn't what comes to mind when I think of the word "stronghold."
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articun
Supreme Hero
As i dream, so shall it be!
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posted June 19, 2015 09:57 AM |
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I think that most people would be happy with the spin off factions of the Ashan universe. And after the events of Dark Messiah this could take form.
Since the events of Heroes V Necropolis is not so Spider cult oriented, although i think a Void Necropolis Faction that wishes to return everything to the void is what most players want to see just to satisfy their "Necropolis is evil" ideal. Also, demons would be free and numerous and many changes will come to how they work, operate and function (can they still be reborn as imps? Are they still fiery or attuned with fire?)
Also, almost every faction can have a lineup of pure evil or pure good. This is the one good thing of Ashan. Giving shades of grey to all factions, means they can go either way.
So far, the developers weren't all that creative to how they set their Factions not wanting to really stray too far to previous installments.
As we've seen in another threat, even Academy can be seen as a truly evil faction (the creation of slaves without regarding human life or its rights)
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Mediczero
Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
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posted June 19, 2015 10:01 AM |
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Kimarous said:
Mediczero said:
and a stronghold with lots of greek/roman influence.
IMO, if a faction is to have a major Greco-Roman theme, make a "new" town entirely and call it "Acropolis." Also, Greco-Roman imagery isn't what comes to mind when I think of the word "stronghold."
That is the point! It is new and different! But I should probably mention that it isn't a flowering civilization, but a people who choose to settle down in the ruins of a long dead greek/roman civilization. I would probably need to make a few sketches so you can get an idea of what I have in mind.
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articun
Supreme Hero
As i dream, so shall it be!
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posted June 19, 2015 10:21 AM |
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You have: Kobolds (or Dogmen or Kabeiri-the true ones, not the lizard), you have a Harpy (also of greek origin), you have a Cyclops (also greek), Now it got a basilisk (that can also be found in greek culture), you have centaurs (greek as well), and then you dress all those units with orcs.
So mainly, Stronghold is greek inspired (at least by mythology). The culture the units are dressed in is another matter. And i think this is what Mediczero means.
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LightAvatarX
Known Hero
Water,Earth,Fire,Air
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posted June 19, 2015 10:58 AM |
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted June 19, 2015 11:11 AM |
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted June 19, 2015 11:21 AM |
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted June 19, 2015 11:34 AM |
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magnomagus said:
Vehicular Astropod Research Nacelle
That is also great 
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted June 19, 2015 11:50 AM |
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Quote:
I love the mix and match, but a really ideal game would have enough flexibility built in to allow the mapmaker to dictate which creatures go into which faction as they wish, even create whole new factions or total convert the game, like in the Civilization or Warcraft series lol
Agreed. Will never happen though, because HoMM is a game that relies not so little on having those given factions and that is not so bad as well.
As at least kiryu already did, the should change it every few games, 2-3 I'd say. Because this way, the changing mentioned in the quote can be done and STILL strong background and stories can exist.
If I could choose a next setting, for H8 maybe, I think I would say make it on one continent (because that leaves open the option of having a new one later on).
The factions within this setting should get slight to big alterations. There have been some attempts, and some recent, to change the idea of the holy-human-faction and I think it is a good idea because this faction can not really be improved that much any more. I think all relevant ideas in it, both storywise and creaturewise, have been done in HoMM. So it being changed would be a certain step in the setting changing for me. Options could go to very different kinds of huamn faction, or to a holy faction without humans nad/or in a less churchy way. Similar thoughts could be done on other factions, though these have gone through greater changes than knight7castle/haven, imo.
Next question would be placing of factions and there COULD be changes as well. I think the desert academy is something that deserves a change again. And where to? We had mountain, snow and desert for the wizards, maybe some water-based wiz town would be nice, or simply placing them in meadowy grassland once?
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