|
|
Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
|
posted June 25, 2017 06:15 PM |
|
|
Poll Question:
Sorcery skill
I love Sorcery skill, but not to the castle, etc when the spirit of the game! Ok now we read about one source
"The highest possible damage for Implosion casted by a player is 22711 points of damage. This requires Expert Earth Magic (or Rockland, or Magic plains), Expert Sorcery, Sorcery as hero specialty (gives 5% bonus to Sorcery per level), maximum Power (99), maximum hero level (108) and Orb of Silt. 14986 (c. 66%) points are the bonus from Sorcery skill. Therefore this is the highest possible damage to deal to one unit by one spell by a player."
School: School of Earth Magic
Level: 5th
Basic cost: 30
Duration: instant
Basic effect
Target, enemy troop receives (100 + (power × 75)) damage.
Advanced effect
Target, enemy troop receives (200 + (power × 75)) damage.
Expert effect
Target, enemy troop receives (300 + (power × 75)) damage.
Probability of occurrence (%):
Castle 0
Rampart 16
Tower 28 (14*)
Inferno 16
Necropolis 20
Dungeon 12
Stronghold 0
Fortress 0
Conflux 13
* Without Library
"Armageddon can cause even more damage to creatures than the Implosion if collateral damage is taken into account. Because Armageddon damages all creatures, it has become part of one of the most renowned tactics, often called Dragogeddon. The tactic requires fast creatures immune to Armageddon. In the original Restoration of Erathia, Gold Dragons and Black Dragons where the fastest creatures with immunity to Armageddon, and that is where the name of the tactic was probably derived. Later in Armageddon's Blade and Shadow of Death, the Phoenix became the fastest creature with immmunity to Armageddon. When the hero's army only consists of immune creatures, the hero may cast Armageddon without damaging his own creatures, in the process causing severe damage to the enemy."
School: School of Fire Magic
Level: 4
Basic cost: 24
Duration: instant
Basic effect
All troops take (30 + (power × 50)) points of damage.
Advanced effect
All troops take (60 + (power × 50)) points of damage.
Expert effect
All troops take (120 + (power × 50)) points of damage.
Probability of occurrence (%):
Castle 0
Rampart 0
Tower 0 (0*)
Inferno 10
Necropolis 10
Dungeon 20
Stronghold 0
Fortress 0
Conflux 0
* Without Library
Do you use a Sorcery? Why? And game intelligences can give the answer. Try debating also.
____________
Fight MWMs - stand teach
|
|
AlHazin
Promising
Supreme Hero
النور
|
posted June 25, 2017 07:39 PM |
|
|
Didn't use it very much. Most of the time it was an obliged choice or if it was a hero special, most of the time from a witch class.
Why, well, in Heroes 3, to put it simply: Might > Magic, even in creature quest there's a quest titled Might over Magic, I took that as a hint from Van Caneghem of his knowledge of that detail which somehow unbalanced the game.
Then the skill in itself, at expert level you have 15% more damage, let's say you play Warlock and happen to have much Power early on, you can do some things, but most of the time you'll have to wait to reach higher levels and better stats to make the skill effective. Plus it depends on the spells you will find, as for witches for example a maximum Fortress Mage Guild level 3 won't give you Armageddon nor Implosion, while witches tend to love this skill. I would have preferred more odds for them to get Air Magic instead. Now in some specific cases like let's say Dragogeddon stategy the skill might play a role, especially if it's a hero specialty.
In the end, a might hero with Offense will hit harder than a magic one with Sorcery, I don't know if the skill changed with the fans' extensions to reach a better percentage like 50% which would be more interesting.
____________
Nothing of value disappears from this world, it will reappear in some shape or form ^^ - Elvin
|
|
RoseKavalier
Admirable
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted June 25, 2017 08:32 PM |
|
|
For regular play and pvp, it has a very small impact because you can never level very high. So people tend to skip it.
For custom single player, SoD allows you (without cheating) to go up to level 6424 where it becomes very powerful! Also, Armageddon can deal a bit more damage if target is Water/Ice Elementals.
 
The problem of course, is experience overflow. I've previously shown a way to have a safe" level cap of 868. It's possible to make the other levels safe as well, just needs a few hooks.
For fun, here is level 32767 comparison - maximum possible through cheating. Overflows afterwards 
 
So, in specific situations: yes.
____________
My Let's Plays: Metataxer's Revenge - The Empire of The World 2
|
|
bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
|
|
posted June 26, 2017 08:20 PM |
|
|
|
I feel the pool misses the point, it can be extremely good on occasion and it's pretty worthless most of the times (a bit like Eagle Eye).
|
|
phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
|
|
posted September 26, 2018 02:12 PM |
|
|
Sorcery is a pretty weak skill at only +15%, considering Offense gives +30% to all melee units and Archery +50% to all ranged units and Intelligence gives +100% mana!
So what would be a good % for Expert Sorcery?, 20?, 25?, 30?, 40? or maybe even 50? (Of course the damage of the 4 elemental orbs would have to be lowered, in accordance to an improved Sorcery buff.)
|
|
NimoStar
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
|
|
posted September 26, 2018 02:19 PM |
|
|
I feel to the contrary the damage of elemental orbs should be buffed since they are max level artifacts, aren't they?
And most time they are useless because you dont have the skill of that particular magic, or it only has weak damage spells (Water...)
But about sorcery:
11%-22%-33% should be OK, close to offense and still actually weaker (since not all spells are damage spells, but most attacks are melee attacks and you can have up to seven per turn)
But it will still be useless in the grand scheme. What is really necessary is an overall magic buff, that makes magic a viable strategy to high level (recalculate the equations and variables in other ways). I think HotA was working on one. But it would be nice to have a more specific one that does not require altering the whole game in a closed way as hota does.
|
|
phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
|
|
posted September 26, 2018 06:09 PM |
|
|
|
No the orbs are only major artifacts and if you get the fire or earth orb, Armageddon or Meteor Shower/Implosion will hurt a lot.
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted September 26, 2018 08:07 PM |
|
|
Nah, never felt good enough to regularly occupy a skill slot.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
|
|
posted September 26, 2018 08:09 PM |
|
|
|
So what percent should it have for you to want to pick it?
|
|
Otuken
Famous Hero
|
|
posted September 26, 2018 08:42 PM |
|
|
|
Useless skill. It was supposed to be around %40-%50.
|
|
phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
|
|
posted July 13, 2019 06:24 PM |
|
|
I always wondered why Expert Sorcery is only +15%, while Expert Intelligence is +100%! That is basically do +15% more damage with spells VS having access to twice as many spells, a no-brainer really.
Anyone have any idea why Sorcery is not stronger and Intelligence not weaker? And what percentages do you think Expert Sorcery and Expert Intelligence should add?
|
|
AlfWithCake
Known Hero
|
|
posted July 14, 2019 01:01 AM |
|
|
I'm undecided between "natural" and "the most worst". It certainly occurs naturally by leveling, but also just "worst" is not enough to describe how bad it is.
Why stop at comparing sorcery with intelligence, look at pathfinding, it decreases penalty by 75%! 5 times more than sorcery, certainly latter requires buffing.
|
| |
|
|
