|
| Thread: Americans and ignorance... |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · «PREV / NEXT» |
|
Lich_King
Honorable
Supreme Hero
|
posted July 26, 2004 01:23 AM |
|
|
[/Lich_King off]Well, what I've seen at U.S.A. myself, showed me, that U.S.A. people are not stupid, but they know so little about smaller countries, that are not really important, let's say for thier daily activities. I spoke with many more, and some knew, what IS lithuania, some didn't. The only convo, that stuck in my head was with some guy from a gas station, I was speaking with myrelative there and he came closer and asked me, where I am from. I told, that I'm from Lithuania... He replied "OOhh Russia... I see... Hya comrade..." and I started to laugh... Really... I didn't start going crazy because he placed our country on our ex-opressor's territory. Just because they do not really need to know much about it.
Now for real, if any of you (those less big/important country people) knows anything about even smaller countries ? Of course you know, that there are those. (or at least you know them from geography) For example.... S. American ones... or African ones... Nope. It's not the ignorance, it's the size and main events, which are happening there also which countries are dealing with those events. There are wars in Africa, but I think that not so much people from here, will know.. what wars.. or who is fighting. So instead of going mad and calling everyone ignorant, you should try to teach something about your countries and there is apossibility, that the person you tought something might teach other person and etc... (Though, I don't think so...  )[Lich_king on]
Yeah.. those americans are a waste of ignorant people... Let's killem and make a huge undead army...
____________
|
|
privatehudson
Responsible
Legendary Hero
The Ultimate Badass
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 01:36 AM |
|
|
One interesting thing to note is that though his comments are off base, it's important to also note that Hollywood and other forms of entertainment and education are also way off base in regard to his country. Not saying that defends him being wrong, but the degree to which Hollywood (for example) rewrites history and cultures of other countries, and to a similar degree the US' to suit is often quite large.
I must admit it is with a certain cynicism that I watch any film from Hollywood these days that might comment on the past. Usually their version of history is more romantic or politically correct than what the reality was. British films sometimes do this also, Zulu being a prime example of changing events to suit the storyline, for example, making one character a heavy drinker when he was a tee-totaller, and having a dutch person stay for the battle in order to translate the Zulu's singing, in the real battle he ran off!
When that happens to coincide with a national hero (or one of them to be exact) such as Vlad of course there will be some upset. Imagine for a moment a Russian or British film about Washington that blows out of all proportion his attitudes to the native americans and has him akin to Hitler in his treatment of them. Or imagine a film depicting Patton having soldiers shot en masse for reporting in as shell-shocked. Imagine that and you might begin to get some idea of just how irritating it is to Romanians to see Vlad become Dracula, or for the British to be depicted drinking tea instead of fighting WWII. It's irritating, and frankly, because Hollywood dominates much of mainstream movies, the bias is mostly towards america rather than against it, or towards political correctness rather than truth.
However, americans overall and we can do almost nothing about this, we can though do something about our own supposed "ignorance". We probably should listen more to people from other cultures and countries. I once believed Alexander was Greek, now I consider the issue blurred at least, and why? Because I got the Macedonian side of things to balance against the Greek side we hear more of. Here we have a romanian protesting that western bias has made one of their countries heroes into a monster, we should listen to that and appreciate it where possible, we might after all learn something new. That is possibly the single biggest advantage (that I can mention here anyway ) of the internet, the ability to interact with different cultures and people, see their side of a story, understand their opinions, even though we might hate them.
Which neatly returns me to the topic at hand. We're all ignorant in some way, because we each have certain things that are important to us. I know without a shadow of a doubt that there's vast gaps in my historical knowledge that I will never fill because it's not interesting, or I won't have time, or whatever. That's not ignorant to me, not truly anyway, ignorance is the inability to recognise this and believe that we all know best, that somehow "I" must know more than you because I know something you don't. Why is that more important than what the other person knows? Why does knowing the capital of Poland, even if you will never use that information rate more important to an american than knowing the capital of his home state?
Ignorance and arrogance are the twin topics of this thread. Americans are accused of being ignorant because they supposedly don't know certain geographical details. As has been said, that is arrogant to assume they should know them. Should a Irish person know the 5 biggest cities in Texas in size order? Each of us know what we need to know, and should try to find out more as we grow older, bowing to superior knowledge as we see it. Now I think I've waffled on enough, so I'll finish by saying that the ignorant refuse to learn more or admit their failings, the arrogant assume what they know is more important than someone elses.
____________
We're on an express elevator to Hell, goin' down!
|
|
Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 01:57 AM |
|
|
Offbase is an understatement.
Most are young teenagers or in thier 20's listening to thier parents a little too much then using thier own judgements.
____________
Dreaming of a Better World
|
|
privatehudson
Responsible
Legendary Hero
The Ultimate Badass
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:00 AM |
|
|
I was being polite for a change
____________
We're on an express elevator to Hell, goin' down!
|
|
binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:12 AM |
|
|
As I've said, us Americans are immigrants. Every single one of us are immigrants, even the native Americans if you believe the archaeologist. But you see, we have a problem here. There's this giant vortex in this country. The vortex sucks all the intelligence from us. As soon as an immigrant steps foot in this country, the vortex sucks every last bit of intelligence from them (where the intelligence goes to I'm too stupid to figure out).
Seriously though. Yes, I know where Romania is. No, I don't think of Dracula when I think of Romania, I think of great Gymnasts. I also know where Bulgaria is, it's in South America. Um, whoops, that's Bolivia.
Hey Lich, I know where Lithuania is too (I think!). It's a Baltic state right? And they were one of the first ones to declare independence from the Soviet Union. I remember it, I was cheering them on....go Lithuanians, tell them Soviets where to go. Good job, congratulations.
As to confusion between Russia and the Soviet Union, the terms were often used interchangeably in this country. Russia was pretty much where it all was centered.
For the record. Where I currently work, there are maybe 75 people on my floor. Of those, there are 3 Russians, 4 Vietnamese, 1 Israeli, 1 Indian, 1 Nepalese, 1 Chinese and 1 Pole. There are several more from various countries, but I don't know where. These are all first generation immigrants, not descendants from immigrants. I do consulting work and travel from company to company and place to place in this country. This mix of nationalities is not at all unusual. As a matter of fact, I've been in a few companies where 30-40% were recent immigrants.
But then, they're all stupid too, it's that darn intelligence sucking vortex.
____________
|
|
Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:32 AM |
|
|
Then tell me where ROme is you foo
____________
Dreaming of a Better World
|
|
TheEverLiving
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:33 AM |
|
|
Intelligence!
Thank you for reading.
Cnt. Dracula
|
|
Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:47 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Then tell me where ROme is you foo
its in the first part of Romania
|
|
binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:49 AM |
|
|
Sorry if some of my sarcasm doesn't come through. I probably use it more than I should.
____________
|
|
Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 02:49 AM |
|
|
COme on Imagine we can all communicate with each other because ALL WE ARE SAYING IS GIVE US ALL A CHANCE 
____________
Dreaming of a Better World
|
|
Lith-Maethor
Honorable
Legendary Hero
paid in Coin and Cleavage
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 05:53 AM |
|
|
Simpsons...
...whether it is true or not, whether you like it or not, for most of us that live outside the US, the typical American is something between Homer and Bart ...that view is encouraged by the image the PotUS is showing to the Rest of the World (tm)
...granted, you are not all like that, there is a significant amount of Lisas among you that usually redeem the rest, these however surface less than the Homers and Barts
...the reason most of the world doesn't like USA/Americans is that we simply can't accept the fact the biggest power in the world at this point is a nation(?) of Homers and Barts
...of course i have a theory that this is just a defense mechanism so that any extra terrestials out there underestimate Earth, but that has not been proven yet and my NASA liason simply refuses to confirm or deny this rumor (i suspect he is still pissed off about some fund cutbacks)
...in any case, here is HC i have seen examples of all three types, some so painfully obvious i want to scream (in the case of Homer and Bart types) but all in all, the Lisa percentage here is way higher than in the sum of Americans i have met, either in RL or online
____________
You are suffering from delusions of adequacy.
|
|
Dingo
Responsible
Legendary Hero
God of Dark SPAM
|
posted July 26, 2004 05:57 AM |
|
|
I'll be flanders.
____________
The Above Post/Thread/Idea Is CopyRighted by, The Dingo Corp.
|
|
Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
|
posted July 26, 2004 07:23 AM |
|
|
Sigh....
Speaking seriously on the subject...
Tis very close to what PrivateHudson says, though I'd wager it can lead to some very serious disasters. To me, arrogance is the play of confidence upon ignorance. It's the beginning of the end for those that try it. It is a concept proven to be true both historically and categorically factual.
I want to learn more therefore I am not ignorant. I really feel I don't have to prove myself to the first person that points their finger at me declaring me to be such. I've written to many other members enthusiastically begging for information that is privy to their region of the world. I shall continue and remain ever vigilant in my reminder of the consequences ignorance and arrogance can have on a person. Should I wish to continue to exist, then I must be open to the possibilites. I don't need to be a scientist, as it were, but I should at the very least be open to the possibilities.
I want to live a long and happy life.
____________
Roses Are Red And So Am I
|
|
Svarog
Honorable
Supreme Hero
statue-loving necrophiliac
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 07:46 AM |
|
Edited By: Svarog on 26 Jul 2004
|
Look, nobody is saying all Americans are ignorant. But yes, we have to generalize in order to have a conversation. Americans are more ignorant than other people, according to the statistics I provided. In general, I think thats the case. Reason would be the educational system (plus the media). It's the concept of it. It's adapted to the capitalist system and a lot can be said about that, but maybe in another thread. Surely it's not that Americans are stupid by default. So, I didnt like the pathetic QP post about "we are you" and "you are us" (you wish, baby!  ). Now can we claim that we are all one, since our great...great grandfather at some point was one single amoeba?
We have a lots of idiots in our country. But I assure you that kids that go to school and are successful are smarter than the same age, successful students in USA.
Anyway, I'm not b!tching about the ignorance. I wouldnt have problems with it, if it wasnt for the arrogance.
When you think you are the greatest country in the world, the best of the best, everybody's dream destination, then that's what pisses me off. Also I wouldnt be b!tching about the arrogance, if it wasnt the ignorance. Their simoultanious existance is the "winning" combo. And maybe you can add the obedience (to the system). They dont suspect it, the government (i know lot of people hate Bush, but its a broader theory; some other time guys)
Is general knowledge that important? I think it is. In order to be a complete person, the search for knowledge is crucial to it. If you are a mechanic, I dont think you should only know about cars. BUt thats the difference in educational concept. Americans dont learn the rest, because that wouldn't be suitable for the cruel competition that waits them on the labour market.
The second factor, the medias, imho is also connected to capitalism. Private companies have interests and everything is subjected to those interests, particularly medias.
We, Europeans, dont really expect Americans to know about us. Well, maybe some do. But its not the point.
I am in America and I've seen all. Most of the contacts I had were with college proffesors, and they were all pretty much critical about the rest of their countrymen. These people were the good side of America, but unfortunately the majority arent that smart.
Just in the end:
Quote:
i was born (15 years , 6 months and 2 week ago) , i've seen about 2/3 of my country and i saw no dragon ...
Ha, maybe you should check the other third, and then bring such a brave conclusion.
Quote:
and at least Europe admits that romanians are smart
LOL, talking about arrogance... and naive conviction
____________
The meek shall inherit the earth, but NOT its mineral rights.
|
|
Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 08:15 AM |
|
|
Were all diferent.
You think we all have the exact same humour or Compatability.
Not as much I would think.
Not with the hate.
____________
Dreaming of a Better World
|
|
Wiseman
Known Hero
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 09:09 AM |
|
|
I haven`t visited HC for a week or so and here`s a brand new
interesting thread.The problem is while I was reading it
I forgot what I was going to say.So for now I will say only
that PH post up the page deserves the QP, and not the load of cobblers binabik posted.
EDIT: Ì misspelled cobblers.How utterly ignorant of me.
____________
Truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head.
|
|
Shai-Hulud
Known Hero
Sicomor
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 11:13 AM |
|
|
Since PH's( he durely deserved a QP; and I believe much more then the other guy) post and Svarog's(good and to the topic), I must clarufy what gave me the sadness to start the post:
The first reason an the most important of all:
I. I'm not as mad beaucuse people know of Dracula, but I'm MAD when people don't know at least one other thing about Romania or other countries. Nobody says you have to know all states( but it would be very could), but when you hear about one and you are prepared to say in public, when somebody, asks you, Have you ever heard of Romania? and you simply say absolutely sure of your self: "Yeah, of course... Dracula, right? Country of vampires..." and you start smiling in front of the camera. That definetely makes me angry. Maybe, before saying things like that on TV, you should read something about, or less just say I've heard of Romania, but not too much.
II.The second reason:
The educational system in U.S. promotes the following thing:
As long as everybody had it's moral personality, not all have to learn to much, cause street cleaners are also needed. This way except the other who go to great universities and have to do some extra reaserch, many simply ignore everything else then the knowledge they have to have for making their job. This way thousands of kids get to know only half or quarter then kids their same age in Greece, Romania and many other countries, but they are specialized in their domain. This way U.S. grows it's power by producing specialists, but can't create geniuses, so they buy intelligence from other countries. That's the way U.S. is a multinational country. It also closed the gates to U.S. long ago, so only the people they call in can go. So this way a great difference is made between really smart people who know lots of things, and people who don't know anything else then their work domain. But in Romania there is a great difference: Even if i'm at high school( and have only 2 years before giving my final exam and going to university) and I'm sure my domian of activity will be computers, I'll have to know very good: literature(absolutely no connection with computers), geography(same thing), english, mathematics and I have to choose also between: Physics, Biology, Chemistry and Programming(computers). I've just listed what my final exam will include.
____________
~~~Azzy~~~
|
|
Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 11:46 AM |
|
|
Quote:
It started a few days ago... I was doing my cybergeek stuff.. And on a chat thing I started talking with a guy from U.S. We chated about life, philosphy etc. Interesting stuff.. After 20 minutes of talking he asked me about my country.. So I said.. Romania... Then he asks me very simple.. WHERE IS THAT?! NEVER HEARD OF THIS ONE!!! I was becoming a bit mad... But I've explained him.. Then we continued our chat, ending up talking about religion. Soo, he asked what my religion is: Orthodoxism, I said. And very simple he asks me... What kinda of religion is that? It's only in your country or what?! I was like astonished. I've ended my chat, shutdown my computer and went straight into town to talk to my friends about it. They've agreed on this one.
You'll say now, that is a one-case only. IT ISN'T!!! I was looking 2 years ago at a show... DIvertis in U.S. Divertis is an entertainment group, which made a fun show... So they were in U.S. and they started asking people on the street if they've ever heard about Romania. I was disgusted. One lady said something: "Ohhh! Romania.. Of course.. Ceausescu, no?" GOD. Ceausescu died 14 years ago. Also somepeople only heard of Romania in te same phrase with Dracula or Vlad Tepes. Well.. That is sooooooo stupid. First of all... The relation between Dracula and Vlad Tepes was made by an author, that hadn't even visited Romania , but his book had so much succes. Now let me explain something.. I believe Vlad Tepes was one of the heroes of Romania, after Stefan the Great and Mihai the Mighty and a few others. Now almost all of HC will starting cursing me. Ha ha ha.. First of all, if it wasn't for Vlad Tepes, a third part of Romania would have been conquered by the otomans, leaving a gate for Europe to be conquered, but nobody saw that. Also beacuse of Vlad Tepes, theives in that part of the country drastically got low, beacuse all cheaters, theives and smugs were beeing killed in a way that put fear in all the rest. Now.. What was the link beetween Vlad Tepes and Dracula?! None. But almost all americans only heard of Romania in this phrase and they don't even know where is it.
As a final question... What do americans learn at those hours of studying called GEOGRAPHY and HISTORY?!?
Ignorant huh? Kid said he didnt know a particular thing so you claim it is ignorant americanism... How about I Put the BIG BIAST lable on your forhead. Dont worry, your not the only one. There's biast people from -probably- every region. I didn't bother to read any of the people who agree or disagree with you, cuz I know that is one of the most offensive thread titles I ever read here.
You may not understand me right now, but your being biast is a very large form of the worst ignorance known to man. Anyone who thinks differently about someone because of regional location is biased, but not everyone of them point offensive fingers at a person cuz of race or origion.
Corrections:
"One of the largest forms of ignorance known to man"
Actualy, I wouldn't be surprised if men are so deeply into this type of ignorance, that not many men know this form of ignorance
"I havn't bothered to read who disagrees or agrees.. "
I did but am not gonna get into this thread so whatever.
If men are so smart why not make a quote rule that lets people /half/ quote? Meaning its not word for word but it's generaly the spirit of the context.
|
|
Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 11:54 AM |
|
|
I love you, you love me were a freaking family.
____________
Dreaming of a Better World
|
|
Shai-Hulud
Known Hero
Sicomor
|
|
posted July 26, 2004 12:00 PM |
|
|
Celfious... You should surely read the others post to.. Maybe at least the last 5 to have an ideea of what we're talking about.. many things have changed in the meanwhile... Till then... Be more conservative...
____________
~~~Azzy~~~
|
| |
|
|
