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| Thread: Were you spanked as a child? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV |
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted September 05, 2005 09:48 PM |
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I think it's not the spanking that hurts the child in a lasting way, it's the rage and hate behind it. Spank can be made without hate, or it can be made in full rage, which is often the case.
It is the rage and hate that makes the person feel like they don't count, makes them feel like they are just worthless obstacles to their parents' wishes.
I've had a parent who burst into utter anger when I did not behave how they wanted. First there would be shouting, then hitting. It would all be saturated with complete disregard for me as a person, like my opinion is just an obstacle that will be beaten out of me. Crying and objecting didn't do anything until I've complied with what the parent wanted. It was like facing an armoured tank really.
I've had enormous amounts of grief and anger. When I tried to express that anger, the parent would just hit me again for doing so, so out of fear I had to bottle it all up. I hated that parent more than any other person in the world, and most requests they've made were met with my "no" before they've even finished what they were saying. The only way to protect myself and retaliate was to close off emotionally from that parent.
This treatment left me with many issues, such internal panic fear of people who resemble that parent, low self-esteem, inability to stand up to bullying, tendency to form unhealthy relationships with psychologically abusive people, lack of assertiveness, not knowing what I want, being driven, numb or melancholic. I also had very large amounts of grief and anger bottled up which began to eat myself up once I moved away from that parent.
I was very lucky that I was given guidance in life to move through most of these problems by now. I accepted the past and I see many valuable things that came from it, but it's a very dangerous path that could easily end in alcoholism, depression or simply living as a drone.
I wanted to say this to underline what impacts anger and hate can have. My main point is that it wasn't the spanking, it was the attitude behind it that I believe does the damage.
The attitude that child is a compliant or uncompliant accessory, not a person with valid feelings, preferences and opinion. The approach of bullying a child into compliance, treating the child's opinion, wishes and feelings as obstacles to be eliminated.
I used to disbelieve it before, having good grounds to do that, but I now think that children can behave in ways that sometimes need to be stopped immediately. This can be done without hating the child though, without getting angry. Just understanding that unfortunately this is what needs to be done right now. Children pick up on feelings very well, they will feel that you love them regardless of disobedience, but will "sense" your assertive hand 
Obedience out of fear will always cause challenges to authority. Compliance out of love, trust and respect is different. In many cases where children get out of control in public situations, parents say there is no other way to deal with it than hitting, because the child "won't listen". Saying that just ignores the entire history of how that parent treated their child and possibly contributed to such an attitude in their child. Children do get born like that sometimes, but I tend to think that in most cases parents cause or greatly contribute to that attitude in their child, which they then use as further justification for the nasty treatment.
I haven't been a parent though, and I don't know how I will cope. I won't say "I'll never treat my children like my parents treated me" because that's exactly what tends to cause generational repetition. I'll do my best at staying mindful and use my experience to find the best way I can.
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You can wait for others to do it, but if they don't know how, you'll wait forever.
Be an example of what you want to see on HC and in the world.
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 06, 2005 01:05 AM |
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Quote:
I haven't been a parent though, and I don't know how I will cope. I won't say "I'll never treat my children like my parents treated me" because that's exactly what tends to cause generational repetition. I'll do my best at staying mindful and use my experience to find the best way I can.
That's an important point... we never really know how we'll react until we're in that situation...
... but for those very rare times that my mother did "spank" us, we knew full well we had deserved it and we sure didn't want it repeated... I grew up scared of dissapointing and deffying my mther, but it wasn't for fear of the hand, she had a look that burned through to you soul and a chilling tone of voice that would haunt your dreams..
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Russ
Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
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posted September 08, 2005 11:38 PM |
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Edited By: Russ on 8 Sep 2005
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Quote:
Yes I was spanked and it made me feel uncomfortable.
Quote:
I believe that was the idea.
ROFLMAO!!!
Anyways, when I was a kid my dad spent most of his time looking for an excuse to punish me. That included getting punished for wasting too much water while washing hands, or having a small spot on my pants. Also, he never missed a chance to remind me how stupid and worthless I am. And yes, that DID have a negative effect on me. It took me years to understand that I am not inferior to the others and that not everything that happens around me is my fault.
Although I am not anywhere close to having kids myself, I strongly belive that physical punishment leads to nothing. There are much more efficient ways of parenting. Kids are not as unreasonable as some parents think. And by no chance are they born evil. Simply talking to them and making them understand what they did wrong, WHY it is wrong and how to correct it in the future will work much much better than punishing them. And in a rare case when a punishment is required, I will go with the people who mentioned "psychological" punishment.
American Indians didn't physically punish their kids, yet they had very strict taboos and a complete respect for the elders and the traditions. In fact, they had way way way more discipline than any "white" culture could have possibly hope for. Maybe it was only possible because of the way their society was organized and maybe it is not applicable to the modern world, but I still think that they are a good example of how the physical punishment could be avoided.
Btw, Valeriy, I couldn't agree more with your post!!! You've pretty much summed it all up! Especially this:
Quote:
Compliance out of love, trust and respec
I think that the above can discipline the child much better than any kind of punishment.
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Vegetarian: Old Indian word for Bad Hunter.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted September 10, 2005 08:19 AM |
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Oh yes Val we do feel the pain in the spanking because some parents dont just use hands or belts.
To Tjer when you feel you have to spank a child, you need to let them understand why they are being punished as in any other punishments.
Children may think different if you dont explain.
Hard being a parent & sometimes Conan a firm voice is not enough & sometimes it is, when children get older you have to think of other ways like grounding them or taking away entertainment or not letting them go to certain places etc.
Tough to be fair but when you find the best way then we got to try & stick with it.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Asmodean
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Heroine at the weekend.
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posted September 10, 2005 07:22 PM |
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I think Aculias has hit the nail on the head.
As I've said before, I was a total brat as a kid. My mum and dad were run ragged by my behaviour at school and all the 'talks' and 'agreements' they tried to get me to comply with were only so much hot air as far as I was concerned, as the worst I'd have to endure was another 15 minutes of impatiently waiting till they shut the hell up and I could go back to what I was doing.
So they introduced spanking me as the only way that would make me change my behaviour. It was only with the flat of their hands, never with a spoon or a shoe or anything anyone else has mentioned.
In retrospect I did need that kind of discipline to keep me in line, otherwise I would have gone on to worse and worse behaviour, with eventual consequences that might have involved the police rather than a 'stern talking to'.
But spanking your child in my view has as much to do with the character of your child as the need to discilpine. If a child responds to 'stern talking to's' and grounding then use those methods. If not then sometimes the only alternative is a spanking.
To contrast this. I have a 10 year old sister who is quite well behaved and as far as I know has never been spanked.
And I have personally witnessed her, after being caught out in a silly childish lie - bursting into tears after my dad saying 'I'm really, really disappointed in you'.
See the difference between her and me? To spank her would be abuse, to spank a child like I was is discipline.
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To err is human, to arr is pirate.
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 21, 2005 07:28 PM |
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Quote:
See the difference between her and me? To spank her would be abuse, to spank a child like I was is discipline.
good contrast of character.
I think a major issue is that when someon hears "spank"
they hear "beat" or "abuse".
My mom used physical discipline in rare occasions when we usually did something REALLY bad or it was that we crossed the line and disrespected a figure of authority.
My "discipline" through 3rd party learning. I was soo scared of dissapointing my folks (like I could see my brother was with his lack of discipline) that I didn't want to be like him. I wanted to be the "good" son and do right (be responsible, do well in school, listen to my folks) and it got us stuck in a vicious circle.
My bro resented me for never getting into trouble, or what he considered trouble (for school or misbehaving) that he'd lose his temper, beat on me, then get into more trouble... get upset again, and so on.
(my mom would use physical discipline for last resort fear, and only once got pushed to use something..
my cousing, after getting spanked turned to her and said:"that didn't hurt!" so she went and grabbed a fly swater... he never looked at her the wrong way again!)
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Conan
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted September 22, 2005 02:52 PM |
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well, I won't budge.
I can understand with most of what's been written and I don't judge anyone for it, yet I do disagree with it.
a "stern talking to" didn't do much in my case either. I wasn't a real bad kid, but I did have my moments. So when my parents saw that I didn't respond to a lecture, they'd find other ways. For example, they'd take away my Nintendo, which, at the time was a big deal.  They'd prevent me from leaving my room. This one time, my dad warned me that if I'd do the behavior in question, I'd regret it dearly. I forgot what the behavior was but I remember the look in his eye. He was dead serious. So, I decided to test him, quite unconsciously at the time. I ended up 3 days in my room, on a long week-end. I'd eat in my room and the only time I could leave was to go to the bathroom. On the second day, my dad came in and sat to talk with me. Told me about his obligation for what he was doing. Told me he felt bad and wished he didn't have to do this.
I understood.
Another point I'd like to bring up is the fact that bad behavior, to an extent, is not only due to the personality of the kid; it's also due to how the child is educated. The values and morals that are easy for a child to understand should be made clear. For example, sometimes peer pressure will make a child do something which he wouldn't normally do - yet if those values are strong enough, he will not, just like if my friends asked me to kill someone I wouldn't. In the end, the child will notice this and will learn to choose his friends. Then he'll avoid the bad behaviors all together. This is just one example, but there are many more. I could go on and on about this, but this is yet another way to prevent physical discipline.
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Your life as it has been is over. From this time forward, you will service.... us. - Star Trek TNG
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 22, 2005 03:10 PM |
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Edited By: Jebus on 22 Sep 2005
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well had my dad told me he'd beat the crap out of me if ever I got into a car after the driver had been drinking (ie Lion's bachelor party) I most likely woulnt' have done it.... 
on top of that the guys I was ridding with convinced me that I didn't need to call for a ride!
(any comments?)
it's easy to say that the way one was educated can influence a decision for peer pressure (but it's not quite the same when you're in the situation), but what can you say about how that education affects the one doing the pressuring??
(Jebus grabs a spoon and stirs the pot)
EDIT:
as per Conan's request...
the incident (and incidents) revolved around a group of us that had a bad habit of "beleiving" we could drive home after an evening of drinking...
after Lion's bachelor party (which was sweet!!) my gf told me to call her for a ride... well Conan (who also had been driving, and my cousin Marcus Flatulous, convinced me that we "weren't going far" and that we'd "be ok"...
Other examples of this are when we use to go drinking to the local pubs and then my 2 Ottawa East buddies would drive home, in a snow storm, at 2am.
I was in no way trying to take a shot at Conan!
I think it's important to see that even with the best social "education" for peer pressure, we, very often make stupid decisions... If 4 adults rationalize that "sure it's not a big deal", i can well imagine how young children can (and are) pressured into all sorts of stuff)
.. I know that I was very well informed on peer pressure growing up, but sometimes, we give in.
(and my gf didn't beat the crap out of me, but she shoulda... i didn't get a stern talking to, but the look of utter disgust and dissapointment was enough for me)
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Conan
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted September 22, 2005 03:19 PM |
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That's a good point, but I didn't say that it works everytime, I said it's another way of dealing with children - another option, if you will. It was a way of saying that many options exist before resorting to violence.
The example you give is a very personnal thing between you, me and Ed, so perhaps you should clarify it so that everyone who's reading understands the situation and what you're refering too.
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Your life as it has been is over. From this time forward, you will service.... us. - Star Trek TNG
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted September 22, 2005 04:35 PM |
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Violence is usually wrong
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