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| Thread: Heroes 5 TotE Strategy: Playing Stronghold Faction |  This thread is pages long: 1 10 ... 11 12 13 14 15 ... 20 28 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 10:56 AM |
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Memory is the most crucial for its earlygame importance and the extra boost along with the other starting rage points that can make you start at lvl 1 at times. Actually the ballista is important but not so sure about academy. At least you can still use fear my roar or horde's anger to reduce their hp and make the ballista immune to sabotage. No memory mentor in battle for honor, it's a HoF map that has not been updated - I just have modified it to have the new spells/artifacts.
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted December 31, 2007 11:17 AM |
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Elvin, you said warmachines is not a waste while playing Kragh...
It is a waste. Waste of his speciality, cuz then, his less effective then with stunning blow and excruciating, don't you think?
IMHO, you should choose hero, whose speciality would be the most flexible, and that heroes are Kragh and Garuna if it comes to use all might skills.
When Haggash and/or Telsek loose their favourite creatures, their specialities become useless unless they get another great stack of Warmongers (using Maulers is not so effective) /Centaurs. And that can be quite troblesome after facing quite strong opponent, who, for sure, will take care of your specials immidiately...
Kragh and Garuna can loose creatures from all stacks and not feel weak, because their specialities are flexible.
Kragh's is focused on him and you never loose hero unless you loose all the creatures. Also, with powerfull blow you get twice to triple as more hits in turn (Warchief's and Shaman's affecting centaurs), so you can eliminate the most powerfull enemies stack from the battle by stunning them and allowing your great warriors to reach them.
Grauna's specilaity is focused on whole the army. Playing her, you should pick the most threatening creature as your main purpose and concentrate on killing it. Then, your all army can get tremendous attack bonus of 25 for exemple...
Moreover- the more stacks you kill the more attack you get and defence of tanks is just a nuance. Even to your goblins...
So leave the tanks for the dessert and kill as fast as you can low defence dudes to get powerfull attack bonus.
If your lvl is eve 15, you get 15X (6+3*) = 135 attack bonus to kill the last stack.
Also, if your opponent uses gating/summoning, for killing each summon, bonus cumulates. Fighting academy or inferno hasn't ever been so funny... 
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*If hostile hero owns all the 3 warmachines
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 31, 2007 11:26 AM |
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While Kraugh may not be able to get flaming arrows (do to getting the strike line) getting war_machines and ballista is never a waste. Balista/Tent/tripple balista is very effective for Stronghold even without flaming arrows. Not to mention every little helps. If nothing else you can target enemies balista with yours, destroying it (eventually).
As for Haggash, it takes a bit, but once you get rolling with her you should not loose (or not many) unless you really mess up. Just keep in mind that Call of Blood, Memory Mentor, and the building that lets you start with rage are extreamly helpful with her. Concentrate on keeping your centaurs rage as high as possible. About 2 weeks in peninsula you stop loosing anything but maybe a goblin or 2 with Haggash.
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted December 31, 2007 11:31 AM |
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If you have more than 3 opponents, then you can loose simply all of your centaurs in one skirmish and then comes another...
There is no time to lick your wounds, but to prepare to fight...
Then creature-concentrated heros just suck...
About Kragh- you have incomprehensed what I have written ofc, flaming ballista isn't a waste. But not getting excu combo with him is.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 11:46 AM |
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You are mistaken here. For one, excruciating strike will not kill 85 master hunters in one attack as a flaming ballista could. About creature specialists they are great to have because they will ensure their units have better survivability and attack to have a bigger impact in the battle and survive whereas 'normal' units would die easier and they have a much easier creeping. Believe me, they pay off by those two alone even if they eventually lose their units(in which case you were not good enough.)
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 31, 2007 11:52 AM |
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Yes, I understand that flaming balista is much stronger then the strike line. Not arguing this. However, with Kraugh I think it is a bit different. Since he gets a free attack at the beginning, he can effectively neutralize a powerstack of an enemy. Stun them, cast Powerful Blow on a creature, and then both of them keep that stack totally out of the picture.
And the balista can be broken while his attacks can not be stopped (though the extra from powerful blow can). Kraugh is the only one I would even consider going the powerful>stunning blow with.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 11:55 AM |
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Pretty much how I feel about it. Yesterday was my luckiest earlygame ever  Got Haggash, found 2 orc heroes(20 extra centaurs) in tavern and first two level ups were archery and warmachines. I could defeat 15 rajas on day 5  Damn they are fast 
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 31, 2007 12:01 PM |
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Hmm ok Elvin, scenario time. Playing vs Academy, would you go the Balista > Flaming Arrows way or Kraughs Powerful Blow > Stunning blow way? Keeping in mind both Sabateurs and Remote control (though the last very unlikely).
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted December 31, 2007 12:08 PM |
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Mytical has written exactly what I have been talkin' about.
I was thinking about stunning the crucial stack not killing it...
Moreover, unit concentrated dudes are good but loosing all te centaurs doesn't mean someone played wrong.
It does mean that he was forced to abbandodn his castle (where centaurs were safe) or his enemy had dark magic... On executioners PM still works and cyclops can be frenzied...
With Warmongers it can be quite the same...
After this kind of epic battle- if you manage to win- your the most powerfull stack is dead. And then if you have any others enemies left- the game becomes really troblesome...
You was talking about impact...
What impact do you have with warmongers? They are more defenders than attackers...
Centaurs are great offensive unit, but even with Haggash speciality they can die unless you surround them with all you creatures
Now, imagine the situation, when Garuna is on 15 lvl and epic battle begins... At first your army is quite pathetic, but if only one enemies' stack dies- you gain stunning +15 attack bonus, whereas, if you play other hero you get 7 attack bonus from beginig and 7 defence bonus from begining but only for one creature...
Now let's count a bit...
7+7= 14
15X7= 105
I think the numbers told you the truth
Moreover, defence isn't so handy with baba creatures which are concentrated on attacking... Aren't they?
I think rage points should work as a shield. Not deffence...
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 12:11 PM |
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For a longer game I might use Kragh, otherwise in games that can be rushed it can work either way. Heh if Grok could kill 2-3 devils per hit(with excruciating strike) what would Kragh do?
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted December 31, 2007 12:14 PM |
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Pound himself ofc 
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 31, 2007 12:17 PM |
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Edited by Mytical at 12:20, 31 Dec 2007.
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Kraugh Can get insane quick. Especially with powerful blow (for him this is a MUST get skill). Throw it on a your fastest unit, haste them (with shammies) and watch the fun fly. If it is a melee attack not only does he get 3 levels but an extra 15% damage on top of that (5% per level). Then even if he takes a break to do a shout, it still is scary. Sometimes I enjoy putting it on a cyclops, using word of the cheif from the one units (and haste from shammies), then just wording of chief them when Kraugh's turn comes around (note : Tent skill is a must for this tactic). Creatures fall like flies.
Edit: this also usually makes the enemy focus on them first. And if they are focusing on the Cyclops, that means they are not killing my Centaurs.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 12:20 PM |
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I still say that if you lose them it's your fault. If you sense you will be attacked you chain or should not have been that far in the first place. If you are afraid a unit will block you on round 1 you use tactics or chieftains and order the centaurs to play first etc. Warmongers are nuts, I have seen several shadow dragons hit them with luck and only 7 of them die but that's not the point. The point is that they will be alive and effective in the final battle, if they don't survive there who cares. You want impact? Build them up with rage and you will have it.
Defense in not my optimal skill but would easily take it vs fast factions that can wear out your rage fast. As sylvan with mass haste.
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 31, 2007 12:31 PM |
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Here I thought I was the sole person who loves defense. Defense + Rage = almost no damage. Add Evasion and Vitality and you got one heck of a setup.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 12:33 PM |
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It think it's mostly a matter of preference. I do not doubt its effectiveness.
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 31, 2007 12:42 PM |
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Yeah there are a lot of skills I would pick before it. Attack, Leadership, Luck...when I get stuck with it (ie when it is a choice between it and say Shatter Summoning) I don't worry about it.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 31, 2007 01:03 PM |
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Speaking of which it would probably be simpler to have a universal shatter magic, maybe a little nerfed as compensation. Maybe that's designed as an early game measure to protect magic factions but it still seems an unnecessary complication to me.
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Jukeboxhero
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 31, 2007 11:15 PM |
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Quote:
The transition is not so easy, even if the gameplay is similar you have to get used to how units act and how some things do not work anymore. The choice is excruciating strike or flaming arrows but you can get triple ballista regardless.
Wow, I just read through these last dozen posts and I must say that was an awesome wave of discussion and debate. Many thanks to Lesij, Mytical and Elvin!
I just now realized how you can only get certain perks for each secondary skill, and once you choose them, certain others are completed eliminated!! Especially the tier 3 ones.
That being said, I'm almost 100% certain that I already have Archery for Kragh, so I guess I can't get exc. strike, as fun as it sounds with Kragh. I could still opt for Stunning blow, and it seems Powerful blow will be available too...but I think choose flaming arrows for improved creeping for the time being.
The map again is "The Art of Strategy", which is a TOTE map...so odds are there could be a memory mentor somewhere.
Btw, another quick question. I basically have a choice of 3 routes I could take.
1. Go into the sub-t area, which I have no idea what lies there.
2. Grab some chests guarded by cerebrus and a sulfure mine (which is still fairly close the sub-t entrances...so I can double back)
3. Grab a witch's hut(which I would probably check with a secodary first), gem and crystal mines as well as fight a few more creeps and proceed in unexplored regions on the surface.
I'm also beggining to realize the importance of planning a creeping route carefully..so you're almost always fighting head towards a certain goal (although it's not always possible because sometimes you will have to skip powerful creeps)
If faced with these choices as stronghold...what path would you choose??
p.s. I did make one mistake in this game.... I accidently mis-clicked on a windmill that I didn't realize was guarded..as soon as I saw the redsword, it was too late. The good news is, there is a decent orc hero that has 1 Slayer in his army as well as centaurs and goblins...so he's probably worth his weight in troops...I just hope spending gold to hire him won't screw me over when it comes to buildign stuff in my town (but I could have him explore places like the sub-T area)
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Zenithale
Promising
Famous Hero
Zen Mind
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posted December 31, 2007 11:51 PM |
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Quote:
Now, imagine the situation, when Garuna is on 15 lvl and epic battle begins... At first your army is quite pathetic, but if only one enemies' stack dies- you gain stunning +15 attack bonus
It's only hero level/6, so here +3 Attack.
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Jukeboxhero
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 01, 2008 01:34 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Now, imagine the situation, when Garuna is on 15 lvl and epic battle begins... At first your army is quite pathetic, but if only one enemies' stack dies- you gain stunning +15 attack bonus
It's only hero level/6, so here +3 Attack.
That's what I was thinking too....I know it's good, but it doesnt' seem quite as uber as Lesij had described early..at least not until you've killed a few stacks.
On a related topic, how does attack effect dmg dealt?
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