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| Thread: Heroes 5 TotE Strategy: Playing Stronghold Faction |  This thread is pages long: 1 10 ... 12 13 14 15 16 ... 20 28 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 01, 2008 04:54 AM |
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That would be attack minus defense x 5%. A +5 attack bonus against zero defense would translate into 25% extra damage.
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Cleave
Promising
Famous Hero
Raging Blood
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posted January 01, 2008 11:33 AM |
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Edited by Cleave at 11:39, 01 Jan 2008.
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Quote:
at least not until you've killed a few stacks.
If it helps when you've already won the fight then it's no good in my books.
That's why I'd rather pick Kragh with stunning blow but no archery and no flaming arrows. The most difficult choice is whether or not to take retribution instead of excruciating strike. Double damage with Kragh is really something to be afraid of (30% of the time isn't that bad) but +5% to damage per moral point for all units is quite good especially with arties, expert leadership and battle elation.
Another difficult choice with other heroes is whether to go for archery/flaming ballista or stunning blow/divine guidance. Uber ballista is awesome but divine guidance on cyclops (with expert shatter dark) can be a very effective tack.
Haggash is very popular for her initiative bonus for centaurs and Kragh for his direct damage but I've been thinking about other heroes that would be considered to be unlikely choices. I'm thinking of heroes like Shak'Karukat, increasing the wyverns's HP could work nicely with their regeneration (+20 HP at level 10!) or Kilghan with his free goblins every week (it may not look like much but getting as many gob witch doctors as possible can change the outcome of the final fight against a magic faction and Kilghan starts with recruitment which is nice for a defence hero) still another good option is to aim for defend us all and take a one time bonus (with Shak'Karukat it's quite easy especially since it won't cripple your main hero if you only recruit Shak'Karukat for the extra gobs).
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 04, 2008 03:17 AM |
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Edited by Elvin at 08:36, 04 Jan 2008.
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Had some time today so I thought I'd test Kragh's strength against the devils in battle for honor  Not surprisingly he could handle himself pretty well without the use of flaming arrows though I did take warmachines(tent, ballista and plague tent for the fun of it  ).
His only weakness was lots of archmages that I would not attack without warmachines so I'd say casters in general. Shooters he can still fight with the use of his special and a simple ballista/tent though that up to luck because warmachines may not appear fast, mine came at lvl 7.
In the battle I simply protected my centaurs with goblins, slowed once with shamans, then hasted centaurs to make better use of my powerful blow. There is an element of luck involved as your blow can kill from 1 to 3 archdevils(even 4 in rare cases  ) but my plague tent helped by killing the single devils that remained. Nothing I'd take again, very situational for a ballista to kill one devil stack and the tent to weaken another for the centaurs to take it down. Naturally you also have to check the atb bar so you can stun the ones just before centaurs for them to shoot and stun again
Here is the link.
Screenies:
My skills.
My artifacts.
Edit: Link fixed.
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Jukeboxhero
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 05, 2008 12:40 AM |
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Nice build idea, Elvin.
I have some more questions now as well.
1. When should one attempt to return to the Main Town to learn Warcries? I know they aren't nessecary for most lower level creeps, but I think it would be wise to get them before heading near enemy territory and I know "Word of the Chief" can help key creatures move before the enemy..which is key against ranged and casters.
2. How do you prepare for when you think your opponent may come to pay you a visit? You probably won't be able to fight him off with your creeping army, so would carry your main army around on a secondary who can shadow the hero?
3. What upgrades do you reccomend against Academy? Right now I have Nomads, Witch-doc's, Chieftans, Earth Daughters and Warmongers and vanilla Cyclops. I think I'll get the Red-eyes.
4. Does it seem that you get the same Warcries in each town if you have 2? I've upgraded my Warcry place to level 2 in two towns on a few occasions and I usually get the same level 2 warcry in each. In my current game it's Fear my Roar vs Academy. I also have Horde's Anger for my level 3 in my primary town..should I try to upgrade again for BattleCry..or is that not as good vs Academy?
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pinkspear
Known Hero
Crazy like a fool
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posted January 05, 2008 12:50 AM |
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I think unless the map has some creeps that are hard to take down (arcane archers, druids, mages,etc.) you can leave the warcries for the time you want to break & go for the opponent. However if you face tough creeps, it may be a good idea to build lvl2 warcry building, since you'll get call of blood to boost centaurs, and if you're lucky you get fear my roar as lvl 2 warcry, which definitely helps creeping. And it also depends on hero, I think kragh doesn't need warcrys to be powerful (maybe call of blood only).
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 05, 2008 01:07 AM |
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Edited by Elvin at 01:10, 05 Jan 2008.
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Yes today I learnt that wors is especially useful against dark casters, if you can have a unit act before it is frenzied/puppeted you can gain an edge. I will learn lvl 1 warcries week 2 if I'm back from creeping, otherwise week 3 where it's possible that I'll learn of 2nd lvl too. I build the second after cyclopses before I leave to the enemy.
Actually I think I could give him many losses and retreat exactly because of the ballista. Though if I see the enemy coming I may chain with a secondary and retreat a bit.
I think I'd get the same. Except maybe executioners for the first blow.
What you get in each town is unrelated with others. I think I'd prefer battlecry to horde's anger unless you have too many units.
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Jukeboxhero
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 05, 2008 01:53 AM |
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Quote:
Yes today I learnt that wors is especially useful against dark casters, if you can have a unit act before it is frenzied/puppeted you can gain an edge. I will learn lvl 1 warcries week 2 if I'm back from creeping, otherwise week 3 where it's possible that I'll learn of 2nd lvl too. I build the second after cyclopses before I leave to the enemy.
Actually I think I could give him many losses and retreat exactly because of the ballista. Though if I see the enemy coming I may chain with a secondary and retreat a bit.
I think I'd get the same. Except maybe executioners for the first blow.
What you get in each town is unrelated with others. I think I'd prefer battlecry to horde's anger unless you have too many units.
1st, I'll assume wors = "Word" as in Word of the Chief...which I unfortunately couldn't get..but oh well, you can't get perfect skills every time.
I would also like to note that I was debating on splitting my stack of Cheiftans and switchin one stack to Executioners. But I wasn't sure if I should do that or split the Daughters.
Btw, I would also like to discuss artifacts.
What artifacts do you think Supplement Orc the best?
This is what I currently have. (vs Academy)
Armor of the Forgotten Hero
Helm of Chaos
Ring of Broken will
Dwarven Smithy Hammer
Boots of Magic Resistance
Golden Horseshoe
Necklace of Victory
Dragon Scale Shield
Cloak of Sylvanna
I finally seem to have a decent artifact assembly for my main. Typically I get screwed on artifacts in Heroes (with things like Lighting protection) But anyways, if you could actually CHOOSE what artifact or artifact sets, which do you think would suit stronghold the best?
Personally, I don't think the Barbarian armor set is that great...at least not unless you get both. It's one of the few sets that has a negative penalty, and a -10% to your own units initiative, when they already have some crucial low init units seems to be a sacrifice not worth taking. (Although the set bonus seems nice)
I personally like the Dwarven Kings armor. Not only does it provide immunity to certain spells (like frenzy and Slow), but offers magic restistance if you have 2 pieces, and even casts good defensive spells.
Of course the Dragons' Power set is awesome for any faction...just too bad it's rare to get more than 1 piece from any set.
P.s. How do you get the selection in an artifact merchants wagon to change? I thought it would change every week, but it seems to remain the same forever
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phoenixreborn
Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
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posted January 05, 2008 02:29 AM |
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Quote:
P.s. How do you get the selection in an artifact merchants wagon to change? I thought it would change every week, but it seems to remain the same forever
Start of every month it changes.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 05, 2008 02:59 AM |
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I have not really thought about it but typically you want resistance, attack, luck and knowledge. Armour of the forgotten hero is one one the best artifacts you can get and so is dwarven king armour. Dragon talon crown is a great boost to your ballista but also allows for more warcries which I consider essential. Against a warlock I'd say elemental resistance arties as cloak of Sylanna though you can do without it if you have a good rage combo. And naturally initiative increasing artifacts.
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted January 05, 2008 07:53 AM |
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Some helpful tips on creeping with Stronghold. Ok we all know some of the tricks to help creep. Single unit stacks, warmachines, ect. Well Stronghold actually benifits from this a bit more. First not only do the single units stacks block walkers (or can run up to block archers) but when killed they generate rage. Doesn't matter how many were in the killed stack either. Generates the same ammount of rage. Goblins are the best for this, as they are cheap and plentiful. Also since waiting and defending lowers rage, and you have to worry about them going treasonous (until upgraded) they are also the best pick for the duty. It doesn't matter if they don't retaliate, they won't live so it is a moot point. Doesn't matter if they might go treasonous for same reason.
Even if you loose 5 goblins a fight, it is not a big issue. They are plentiful. Once your slots start to fill up they will have other jobs to do anyhow. (Like trapping). Absorbing a retal AND giving your creatures rage is a huge advantage for Stronghold while they are split into 1 unit stacks however. All other towns may get a small boost from creatures that get frenzy or such, but all of stronghold benifits.
Single goblin units are ignored by casters and shooters, so can rush up pretty good to block them. Even if not, it just adds rage for the rest of the army.
Shamans. Absolutely essential to good stronghold creeping. These lovely ladies can haste/slow. Always, and I mean always a good thing. I never invoke chain lightning, so I choose earth over sky. That mana is better spent hasting and slowing.
Warmachines. Since it is wise to go the flaming arrows route, the best thing for them is tripple balista and tent. Limits deaths, and causes more of that for the enemies. Again, always a good investment.
Centaurs, the upgrades. The choices are interesting. One more hp with less damage but no melee penalty. Or one less hp, with more damage, and chance of running right into the enemy. However you can do a ranged retaliation vs a melee attacker..which is interesting. Depends if you need the extra hp, or the extra damage.
Possible scary thoughts. Goblins + Frenzy (+1 damage) + Expert Attack + Blood Claw Necklace. Since it is easy to get huge numbers of them, the extra damage can have them doing huge ammount of damage. Add in hordes anger, and the goblins become a WMD. Creatures with less growth just don't benifit as much as they do from this.
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Jukeboxhero
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 05, 2008 09:54 PM |
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Quote:
Possible scary thoughts. Goblins + Frenzy (+1 damage) + Expert Attack + Blood Claw Necklace. Since it is easy to get huge numbers of them, the extra damage can have them doing huge ammount of damage. Add in hordes anger, and the goblins become a WMD. Creatures with less growth just don't benifit as much as they do from this.
These are some AWESOME thoughts Mytical. I like the idea of Goblins being a force to be reckoned with! Dont forget about Vitality and ring of life too!
Just curious, if you have like 600-700 goblins against academy and you Defile magic the hero (Who's 19-20)..is that pretty good odds she won't be casting anythng for awhile??
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted January 06, 2008 06:54 AM |
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Don't forget the BattleCry warcry. Adds speed and damage if I remember right. As for defilers...I don't know the exact math on that. No clue honestly. I would take about 1k just to be sure. That would probably also force them to target the goblins first.
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Duncan
Famous Hero
The Pathfinder
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posted January 06, 2008 08:45 AM |
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Edited by Duncan at 09:06, 06 Jan 2008.
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I would take about 1k just to be sure.
Beware of PM against them though! That's very likely in an MP game, or single map at Hard/Heroic, or even just against Succubus Seducer. When that happens, not just they'll go against you, but you can neither make the best use of Horde's Anger.
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But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it.
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted January 06, 2008 08:53 AM |
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*nods* though I would rather them be PM'd then say my shammies, or cyclops. At least they don't retaliate if I have to kill them, and if the enemy pms them, buys a little time.
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Cleave
Promising
Famous Hero
Raging Blood
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posted January 06, 2008 12:56 PM |
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Quote:
*nods* though I would rather them be PM'd then say my shammies, or cyclops.
That's why Expert Shatter Dark is needed. I'm thinking of a build using Divine Guidance and War Cries to make the Cyclops more effective in final battles. One of the requirements for DG is Stunning Blow so no Flaming Arrows. I wonder which hero would be the best for such a tack (Kragh using DG seems like a waste to me).
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted January 06, 2008 01:03 PM |
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Well it would probably still be Kraugh. Simply because him with stunning blow = pain for the enemy. And lots of it. DG is much better then Word of the Chief. But mix that with WotC from another source (ie one of the barbarian creatures) and you have a cyclops that just decimates.
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Cleave
Promising
Famous Hero
Raging Blood
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posted January 06, 2008 03:14 PM |
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Edited by Cleave at 15:17, 06 Jan 2008.
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That's true, Kragh would still be awesome with powerful blow.
Powerful Blow on Cyclops, Chieftains for WoC on Cyclops, then DG on Cyclops all the way. [maybe DG on Cyclops before PB if the enemy has Frenzy so the Cyclops can charge first and make Frenzy quite useless].
That could work quite nicely with Kragh:
-Expert Rage (memory of our blood + powerful blow)
-Expert Leadership (recruitment + battle elation + divine guidance)
-Expert Attack (battle frenzy + stunning blow + either excruciating strike or retribution)
-Expert Shatter dark [vital! no PM on cyclops]
Level 17 for that build, shouldn't be too difficult to get.
Then I'd take Luck (extra damage) and Defence (extra protection) or go for Shatter Destruction (corrupt destruction + fiery wrath).
-->Retribution would be a better choice with morale boosting arties (excruciating strike triggers 30% of the time).
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Jukeboxhero
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 09, 2008 11:09 PM |
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Quote:
Well it would probably still be Kraugh. Simply because him with stunning blow = pain for the enemy. And lots of it. DG is much better then Word of the Chief. But mix that with WotC from another source (ie one of the barbarian creatures) and you have a cyclops that just decimates.
Just curious...is stunning blow more painful with Kragh than any other hero? I know Exc. Strike could be, but I wasn't sure if stunning blow has a better effect with Kragh as opposed to being used by another hero.
And now some questions about PM
1.If a unit is Pm'ed, does it have the attack of it's owner, or the opponent controlling it? So for example the 1k Goblins, would they have my bonus to their attack/hp, or that of your opponents?
2. How does Pm affect initiative?
I read earlier that it multiplies it by .03 or something. So does this mean that a Pm'ed unit will move up in the ATB bar and move more frequently?
In my experience that doesn't seem to be the case. When I was playing as Academy and I controlled a Stronghold unit, it seemed to move down in the ATB bar, and move less often (it almost seemed like a waste to cast it).
Also, how is Divine Guidance better than WotC? I know it doesn't damage units, which an awesome benefit, but IMO, it doesn't move the unit as far up the ATB bar. I don't know all the factors that go into WotC's hasting effect, but I've had units move up to act immediately after I used it. Normally, it doesn't kill as much as it says it will either, since I'm assuming rage can absorb a good bit of the dmg.
Lastly, I'm wondering how one can get Ultimate Rage (not Absolute Rage) ability for Orcs? I've never had that offered to me. Do you need the Grail building or something?
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Zeromus
Adventuring Hero
and happy about it
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posted January 10, 2008 09:36 AM |
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I think you can pick Ultimate Rage once you get the Absolute rage...
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Anakrom
Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
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posted January 10, 2008 10:32 AM |
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I'm wondering how one can get Ultimate Rage ability for Orcs? I've never had that offered to me.
Only way to get Ultimate Rage is obtaining Pendant of Mastery (artifact). None race can reach their Ultimate Racial without Pendant, as far as I know.
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