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| Thread: Forfeiting my 2nd Caesars game |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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fiur
Promising
Supreme Hero
Map Creator
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posted July 19, 2008 09:35 AM |
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Edited by fiur at 18:02, 19 Jul 2008.
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I'm on my way to bed now... but did I mention that I had to close battle against this "so called mighty" Strider....
ask him if you not believe me...
even a tiny Bard can to miracles from time to time so be warned all you so called "high" level players....
and I also said that SQ79 is for sure the most scary player in the whole ToH..... you never know what he gonna do....! (I like that)
well of to bed... fellas.... have a nice day (one way or another)
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Zilonite
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 09:49 AM |
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Gees...
1.Regarding "Strider knew map before" - so this means I showed him map before, may be even put some special Strider-secret-joiners here??? This is just ridiculous and I'm really, really sad to hear things like this. To clarify it once and for all: map was sent to both players 1 hr before the game, then I guided both players through the map, then they started playing.
2.Regarding "map is orkish" - learn to play this game, dear emperors lol As I can't back my words with game here, I hope Strider will be ready to play it as 2nd Ceasars game from reversed sides and prove that map has nothing to do with the outcome of the game.
3.Regarding "map was not playtested" - if you take some great maps from ToH (e.g., Battlezone or all Fiur's maps), you can see that most maps are going through the series of updates as more and more games are played on them. Therefore, of course, I'm spending much of my time updating Twilight World in case anybody else might want to play it (and Fiur, Sq and Strider made lots of good coments in that sense). Yet this doesn't mean that map is not playable right now and reversed game between Strider and Sq should serve as the best prove.
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Towerlord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 19, 2008 10:23 AM |
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Nasty argument, we've got in here ...
I remember when I saw the matchup between Strider and Sq , I first thought ... woow Sq as Sylvan , he's got a big chance to win this game.
After that I thought about the map ... could that map be trouble to Sylvan ? and also something crossed my mind ... is Sq crazy , choosing a Zilo map, when Zilo and Strider are clan-mates and good friends ? but I stopped that thought right there, and limited my comment to this:
Quote:
I just hope it's not a small map , that Twilight Zone, so you can benefit from Sylvan's full potential
I can understand Sq's frustration, he played a blind map ... and he feels that map was a sure loss. Also Strider pushing for that map hardly during negociation, makes things even worse.
Oferring a reversed situation rematch would have made things better, but since it was outside the Caesar Tournament, it didn't make a difference.
Starting things over from ground zero would be perfect , since it would eliminate Sq's suspicion, but it is only up to Strider to decide that... it would be a gesture of great courage and honor, and a little crazyness.
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jorko80
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 10:28 AM |
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Well let's not involve Zilo here, it's about Strider. I'm sure that he found a way to look at the map, by "ACCIDENT power or internet disruption" of the game.
And Fiur : you are a good and honorable player, but you just can't recognize the DARK side of Strider and maybe he never showed it to you. Just read the bad experience of the others and try to understand it.
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sq79
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 10:39 AM |
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Quote:
Starting things over from ground zero would be perfect , since it would eliminate Sq's suspicion, but it is only up to Strider to decide that... it would be a gesture of great courage and honor, and a little crazyness.
And to accept that would be a great shame on myself.
Ever since i decided to make this post 1/2 drunk yesterday night, the decision was firm on a forfeit 
And for this "fake gentleman" to have the chance to even offer it, would be even more disgusting, since its a 100% he will offer such a rematch after this thread.
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 11:59 AM |
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Mmm, facinating breakfast reading hehe I see that almost all Balkan mafia (as I call them tenderly) has gathered in support of our Orient Star. It's good to have so good online buddies, Sq  Sadly, Ves has been right about drama element after all...
First of all, thx a lot for your support, Fiur Btw, in all his "naiveness" Fiur probably has life experience for 2 elits  Anyway, mafia guy's, better leave your attacks solely for me and skip offending other ppl...
I'll try to make a structured reply to cover most of accusations:
1. Map was chosen BEFORE generating random pairs. According to msn logs I spent 22 minutes on deciding whether to ban Vinrael-Kilghan or Rutger-Nebiros... Now imagine the whole situation if I played some other race. Sq still suicides walking around with hunters not arcanes in week 4 (lol). Would it be inferno, haven etc. map then?
To think only that I even offered you a reload after suicide... pff
2. About conspiracy theory... I wonder what guys with such suspicious hearts do in tournament of HONOR at all?
3. Sq statements about hod, dml, ability and 50% of my games are conveniently twisted. Indeed, very first 5 games were with Deleb against Havez and remote control (except Fraudatio) on DML. In HOD I played with Grok against his Ingvar in HOF times. Funny to hear this as that pair IMO is advantageous to Ingvar Ability... I lost 2 games there out of 4, lol Most importantly, these games were more than a year ago.
Only now I realize how sore Sq has been about these losses. After all, during last year I've been listening to his whining regularly...
4. For ~1,5 years I've been playingFULL RANDOM only. As for maps I've played some blind ones and NEVER a map that is familiar to me but unknown to opponent.
5. "strider never starts a 50/50 game". Gee, full random only on mutually known maps for a year +. Games in last spring were arranged after NEGOTIATIONS. Players do talking there and then turn from words to deeds in actual combat. One must learn to live with one's decisions and STOP WHINING AFTERWARDS.
Same here in the Caesars. Negotiations... with your councillors behind the scene you offered me HG and BZ - maps I've never played, lol... I never proposed a map unkown for you! Twilight world was the only blind and quality map. Let's fight was other that both of us were vaguely familiar with. Generated pairings - we followed other participants' path. I offered you 2 generating models and YOU CHOSE the one.
How is that a non-50/50 game? 
6. To Elit: when we played our game on Ashes both of us had 1 game there according to TOH rankings. Get over it! Does the fact I won mean that I knew map perfectly? hehe
In Twilight world I didn't have logistics at all, doh
7. Jorko... Do I know you at all, who are you? You are talking like we have history though I barely remember our encounters. You "tricked" me into playing inferno against your sylvan on the map where inferno has small chances to break phoenixes or blackies (in any case that was not a game in my favour)... Then you pushed me to play impossible...well, neither of us agreed and that is also a result for negotiations. Not all games can or should be played if both behave so competitively. Is that a reason to write all what you have? 
Jorko said: "I'm sure that he found a way to look at the map, by "ACCIDENT power or internet disruption" of the game." What is that? IMO, persons like you should be banned from TOH.
Conclusion. I repeat, none of this arguing would have happened if I kept silent. Sq pride got damaged and he snapped. That's it. I seriously doubt that Balkan mafia would demand this game void if I had lost with sylvan hehe
Suggestions. Yeah, we can play a reverse for 2nd Caesars game and leave Let's fight game for 3rd. Sq, you do understand that it was random factor that brought us this pair? I'm 99% sure that you would whine your way out of it even if I had other race than orcs (and I was so close picking inferno pair).
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 12:05 PM |
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Darn, I regret a lot my righteous tongue.. I must learn to keep it shut when other person is boiling... Sq was one of my beloved opponents and very nice guy indeed. We have had many interesting conversations besides heroes. Where did that all go? Was it really full moon influence? 
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Elit
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 12:17 PM |
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Edited by Elit at 16:37, 19 Jul 2008.
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Quote:
I see that almost all Balkan mafia (as I call them tenderly) has gathered in support of our Orient Star.
That's it. I seriously doubt that Balkan mafia would demand this game void if I had lost with sylvan hehe
Quote:
Really mature post. Yes i have problems with you but i have never said you are "stupid Latvians" or someting like that. You use several times my nationality to offend me in this forum...so you are pure racist.
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 12:25 PM |
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Quote:
You use several times my nationality to offend me in this forum...so you are pure racist.
Doh, Balkans historically have been considered one of the tastiest regions in the Europe as it's placed in strategic location cotrolling trade routes, rich in resources and beautiful. Being a Balkanian is more a compliment  You better turn attention to "mafia" part hehe But that's not the subject of this thread...
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Elit
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 01:28 PM |
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Edited by Elit at 16:37, 19 Jul 2008.
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Quote:
Quote:
You use several times my nationality to offend me in this forum...so you are pure racist.
Doh, Balkans historically have been considered one of the tastiest regions in the Europe as it's placed in strategic location cotrolling trade routes, rich in resources and beautiful. Being a Balkanian is more a compliment You better turn attention to "mafia" part hehe But that's not the subject of this thread...
LoL
I think to be Latvians is not bad at all but if i use "stupid" and "Latvians" together its look different
For sure you are funny Strider 
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Towerlord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 19, 2008 03:13 PM |
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hey Strider, we are all humans here ... you cannont go ahead and ban Jorko for making a mean comment at you. Probably you did nothing wrong, and all has been a bad coincidence, but the tension of the tournament and not being able to agree on map easily, and maybe that made Sq feel like he is being pushed to play something he doesn't trully want to...
now, that you have done a very generous offer to Sq, with reversed sides for Caesat Tournament I expect him to continue, and prove his point that the map is bad for Sylvan... and then you two kiss and make up , and provide us with some nice replays!
So, Sq please change your mind about forfeit, I know that is hard for you, but there is no honor in quiting, and on the long run, there's alot to gain from this, alot of fun games with Strider , maybe you two will even play Hourglass toghether in the future
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samiekl
Supreme Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 04:28 PM |
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I don't like violence, i'm a businessman. Blood is a big expence.
BALKAN MAFIA FOREVER!!!!!!
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sq79
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 05:46 PM |
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When i made the thread, the decision was firm on forfeit, so please don't ask me to continue playing. The first game was a total misjudge due to lack of match practice + the sense of helplessness the map is giving me.
Maybe i was abit too harsh on the comments and probably no one will ever play me again. So I've practically quitted this game.
The start of this thread comments and decision was practically a 1/2 drunk SQ + a quarrel in msn yesterday night with strider and his cockiness triggered all this.
But here is Mighty Strider trying to act like a nice man again with his powerful english 
Sure you're a great player, as i said prolly the best, so you must feel proud of it. But its just too bad I can't bring myself to playing you again.
I can imagine how angry you must be seeing such a post, but trying your best to hold your cool. Yes you did it well. I've tried it, and it just happens the chain explosion started for me last night.
To fiur : Yes , i never imagine i would do this as well lol
To Zilo : No offence mate. I've not hard feelings with you at all and i never mentioned anything of a conspiracy.
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted July 19, 2008 07:46 PM |
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Edited by vesuvius at 19:50, 19 Jul 2008.
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I think its time for a random picture.
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 08:39 PM |
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Quote:
The start of this thread comments and decision was practically a 1/2 drunk SQ + a quarrel in msn yesterday night with strider and his cockiness triggered all this.
Exactly right. Not the rules we both agreed on or map or random pairs were the real reason for this very unpleasant incident. The reason was our last msn coversation were I appeared arrogant to you.
I have one excuse though - remember how you played orcs single and declared for these 3 nights that you could do it with orcs 10 out of 10 times but not sylvan? And in response I argued back that map is not the scape goat and it could be done with sylvan as well... on that darn occasion I sent you screen of Vinrael that was as successful as Kragh and claimed I could do it also 10/10 times... I guess that's where you perceived me as crossing the line. I won't mention here your exact words but I guess I should have never responded to the challenge. Just kept the mouth shut.
Anyway, if you could lose the best of you yesterday, maybe today being sober and thinking it over you could find the best of you again and continue on
Bottomline, if not my will to prove the point, we would have already started our second game and having immensely hard time of creeping in Let's Fight...
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Elit
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 10:38 PM |
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Its time for you to talk with Val about game rules Strider. What is done is done. I dont think SQ79 will play with you. Continue "fool ppl with rules" and more ppl will do same like Sq79. Enjoy your won.
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 10:50 PM |
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Quote:
hey Strider, we are all humans here ... you cannont go ahead and ban Jorko for making a mean comment at you. Probably you did nothing wrong, and all has been a bad coincidence, but the tension of the tournament and not being able to agree on map easily, and maybe that made Sq feel like he is being pushed to play something he doesn't trully want to...
now, that you have done a very generous offer to Sq, with reversed sides for Caesat Tournament I expect him to continue, and prove his point that the map is bad for Sylvan... and then you two kiss and make up , and provide us with some nice replays!
So, Sq please change your mind about forfeit, I know that is hard for you, but there is no honor in quiting, and on the long run, there's alot to gain from this, alot of fun games with Strider , maybe you two will even play Hourglass toghether in the future
You're right about the case with Sq and future positive implications should we try rebuilding the bridge. Surely, I'd have to swallow a lot of bitter emotions as I honestly believe ALL accusations were simply unfair and have been addressed in previous posts. But then again Sq position is pretty similar... If both of us try... 
About Jorko... It amazes me how dogs come barking out from nowhere sensing the smell of blood. Especially, the ones I simply DON'T KNOW. And that foul breath of them surely doesn't contribute to the Tournament of Honor. Some say that it's sensible to judge one's personality from accusations he or she targets to others... 
On final note, Sq, don't rush your decision. Provide yourself with several days of contemplation - there is no deadline to the Caesars. Let's leave this shameful thread behind and, if you find the strength within, resolve the future course of action in msn. I'll be waiting for one week...
P.s. Ves, are those really triplets standing beside you or everyone's face turns similar in amazement touching Bugatti?
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sq79
Famous Hero
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posted July 19, 2008 11:15 PM |
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Quote:
I have one excuse though - remember how you played orcs single and declared for these 3 nights that you could do it with orcs 10 out of 10 times but not sylvan? And in response I argued back that map is not the scape goat and it could be done with sylvan as well... on that darn occasion I sent you screen of Vinrael that was as successful as Kragh and claimed I could do it also 10/10 times... I guess that's where you perceived me as crossing the line. I won't mention here your exact words but I guess I should have never responded to the challenge. Just kept the mouth shut.
Bottomline, if not my will to prove the point, we would have already started our second game and having immensely hard time of creeping in Let's Fight...
The thing is u did not prove the point, the screen shot was a day 7 level 11 vinrael versus a day 5 level 12 kraugh.
1 day is all that is needed to win a game, let alone 2, + the map forcing another 4-5 days in returning to town and board the return ship just to collect spells which only orcs doesn't need it that badly. This is the part which totally destroys the concept of the map and i feel is biased towards orcs, its impossible to creep with only 5-6 unicorns using regen only spell, even the manicore part there was so much problems with 6 pack of fire elementals, its designed to kill hunters and other races who doesn't have easy access to warmachines. It is only with expert war machines and rage that could solve the problem in week2. With any other races, it will be an interesting encounter and fun encounter since even inferno with warmachines would find it hard to break that manicore part on week2 without suffering losses
Since we're talking about a balance of map which you find it to be balanced , i'll do a detailed explanation.
The map was full of free +1 def boosters, but +1 attack boosters are heavily guarded, so that means sylvan is condemned to less than 10 or 5 attack if we go by normal hero stats without arties at level 25 with only 15% assigned as attack , i only have 2 attack on level 21.
preset garrisons have zero orcs but one, but an impossible to take player guarded garrison in the middle of the map that comprises of 730 assassins, 55x2 chieftains, 12 black dragons,730x2 globins trappers, 25 skydaughters
So that means almost zero f.enemy for sylvan. How on earth to break such a garrison that is player guarded by week 4-5 on a single town map.
Too much protection to even have the chance to suprise orcs with dark magic, magic taking was virtually based on town guild.
There wasn't even a single option to find other magic in mage vaults, other than breaking thru the warlord/wind elmentals areas or titans area to get the guarded mage vault and sunken temple. After wasting so many days to take troops and spells, the orcs would have razed the middle part to ashes. If upgrade to arcane archers, will need to return to town and waste another 5 days just to return to town, up troops, board ship to break through the titans side and unboard, which i'm skeptical of doing it with only 2 attack all game against fast units which you need to kill fast, chaining doesn't solve the solution at all even with 8 heroes, which is so hard to buy in such a poor map.
What's more there's
Preset immue to frenzy as a start near town
Immue to slow greaves guarded
Immue to blind helm guarded
That leaves only puppet master chance.
And if resurrection wasn't offered in guild, creeping is so cute in week 3 with the superb regen spell against 6x70-85 wind elementals and 36 stormlords, zero losses ? Week4 ? Or against the potiental 880 wolves with some pathetic attack=2 hero leaded dragons and unicorns.
Unfortunately I have no desire to play anymore, you can claim the win you deserve, or let Ves decide whether a replacement is needed, from my view, since i forfeit, i could also be a straight victory for you since its considered a loss on my side.
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Strider_HL
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2008 12:11 AM |
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Let's just chill out and wait several days. Let's assume I agree on all arguments about how hard it was for sylvan. That's means that Sq was severely UNLUCKY with random pairs and striking out. But that's no news when playing random... frequently you get an underdog race compared to opponent. If you wish we can change the agreed setup and correct "unlucky" factor by playing a reverse game.
Let's pause the whole deal. We talked on msn with Sq just now and avoided any conflict. Despite his determination about forfeiting I ask there is a time at least to try renovating the bridge.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted July 20, 2008 07:43 AM |
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well I am all for trying to balance map... but with all the preset anti dark artifacts and no Orc units around map... its clear that this map was designed for Orc domination. Map makers.. love orcs??
Seems logical course of action to start to balance the map... would be to set all neutrals around map to random... so some orcs units can show up... and remove all the preset anti dark artifacts. And also change the 1 way portal back to town to a 2 way portal.
side note.... orcs are way way way to strong all on there own... even with dark spells.. they are still almost impossible to kill... they surely dont need any help lol
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