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| Thread: The best players? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Xarfax111
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
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posted June 08, 2009 02:09 PM |
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Quote:
what about xarfax and angelito do they play in leagues?
Actually the German League is down for about 2 years. Still games are played, especially intense on 2 times 4day LANs.
I dunno who is the current best player, but a good advice is not to look of how many points he has. Its better to have a look which maps this player plays. If someone has more then 20 Jebus maps on his record he shouldnt be taken any serious. And peeps that did have played over 80% on certain map/template arent good at all.
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted June 08, 2009 03:01 PM |
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Quote:
I dunno who is the current best player, but a good advice is not to look of how many points he has. Its better to have a look which maps this player plays. If someone has more then 20 Jebus maps on his record he shouldnt be taken any serious. And peeps that did have played over 80% on certain map/template arent good at all.
Acording to this statement Maretti is not good at all 
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tob
Hired Hero
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posted June 08, 2009 03:37 PM |
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Edited by tob at 18:12, 08 Jun 2009.
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Quote:
Quote:
I dunno who is the current best player, but a good advice is not to look of how many points he has. Its better to have a look which maps this player plays. If someone has more then 20 Jebus maps on his record he shouldnt be taken any serious. And peeps that did have played over 80% on certain map/template arent good at all.
Acording to this statement Maretti is not good at all
Certainly there is no good players at all!
well i think the thing about 20 jebus games is a very subjective opinion . But i understand that you think skill can only be shown by playing different maps....
PS; I thought i have heard you mention Maretti as a good player in other threads? .
Yes it seems like maretti prefers jebus games but that doesnt take his 10:0 score away from him on true randoms and his score on other temps
@Angelito
hehe it was definetly a high score/number and i dont know what it should represent hehe
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted June 08, 2009 04:27 PM |
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Me is best player...but I am sooo old already...
But to be serious again....You hardly find opponents on other templates like Jebus or Balance. There are only a few who play stuff like TR, E1 or E2, or even Angelito's Fiesta.
I wonder what happened to my "poor Jebus" template. Some liked it when it came out, but I don't know if it is played nowadays. Anybody has more infos?
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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maretti
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted June 08, 2009 05:38 PM |
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Paladin_h3 is a player who played many years ago when the zone still existed but hasnt played for many years. Now he decided to play a bit again.
"If someone has more then 20 Jebus maps on his record he shouldnt be taken any serious. And peeps that did have played over 80% on certain map/template arent good at all."
Should be pretty obvious to anyone that this is pure nonesense. Allthough jebus is stinking rich it still requeres a lot of skill to play it well. Everything just happens faster on jebus and that is probably why its so popular but its the same things you need to do as on other templates.
I agree with Liophy that Protos is a very nice opponent. As I see it his weakness is that he dosent use any (annoying) means to get the win. Another thing I like about him is that he plays pretty fast. The trend between the stronger players seem to be longer and longer turns. Average turns of 15 min and even plus 10 min on poor temps are getting more and more normal. I have no idea what all this time is spent on, but its pretty damn annoying. The question is how skilled your are if you need 15 min in average to play well?
My "poor" jebus was never really promoted, so I think that very few people knows it and even fewer plays it. Im wondering why so much work is made on T.E. and nothing is made on making new templates.
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Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted June 08, 2009 06:03 PM |
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Edited by angelito at 18:04, 08 Jun 2009.
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All we need is suggestions.
On german H3 forum (drachenwald.net), we may try to start a bigger testing work. We want to try to determine the exact value ranges of all possible objects on the map. And probably we find out on which treasure range their appearance is the most.
The idea is:
Creating a template with 10 equal zones.
In each zone, we determine only ONE value for hi and lo (for example: 500/500) and a specific density. Each zone has determined a different value of course. We create 10 random maps for each density, and we do that for density 1-10. The treasure value steps should be 100.
Would look like this:
Map 1-10 (Hi/lo / dens.)
zone 1: 100/100 / 1
zone 2: 200/200 / 1
zone 3: 300/300 / 1
...
zone 10: 1000/1000 / 1
Map 11-20
zone 1: 100/100 / 2
zone 2: 200/200 / 2
zone 3: 300/300 / 2
...
zone 10: 1000/1000 / 2
Map 91-100
zone 1: 100/100 / 10
zone 2: 200/200 / 10
zone 3: 300/300 / 10
...
zone 10: 1000/1000 / 10
On each map, you have to count all stuff you see, write it down and check if you find a pattern.
Every tester should take care of a value range of 1000 points and create 100 maps.
With 10 testers, we could create 1000 maps and determine the ranges 0-10,000
With 20 testers, we could even determine the ranges up to 20,000, which is already relic area.
All results should be filled in in a excel sheet and I am pretty sure we would be able to create better templates with all those informations....
If anyone of HC wants to participate in that testing, please drop a line.
P.S.: Sorry for being quite off topic
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted June 08, 2009 06:11 PM |
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About Angelito's poor Jebus.
First - i didnt check it. So i will comment just in theory.
But the idea of the original Jebus is to have a lot of everything. So its quite hard to make the judjement what exactly to pick, and what to left out.
In most of the "true and good" templetes, where you are poor on resourses - you just dont have anything to choose from. You have only one option. You make certain fight. You do them or die. But its only ONE path of play. Only one option every time.
On Jebus - you have at least several options on every move. Thats what makes it interesting.
The problem of Jebus, as i see it, is the absolutely simple desing. You have only 1 way to meet you oponent. Only one road to break and go.
So this make the surprises very rare. And you dont need to decide wich way to go. On Balance and BB you have at least 2 ways to go.
So - on a Poor Jebus - you still wiill have the simple desing, and not much to do in your starting area. So - less decision to make.
In addition to that - the poorer the map, the bigger the chance of unbalance. Sure, on Jebus you still can have onesided map. But the chanse is that it will be generaly pretty much equal.
On poor map just 1 thing can become overwhelming advantage.
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maretti
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted June 08, 2009 07:19 PM |
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Its poor compared to jebus, but its average compared to other temps. And since you have a big starting area you have plenty of money to work with. You just have to work for them instead of picking them up. I played Protos on it a few times and we broke around 131 with big armies including lvl 7s from week 1. Trade posts are very rare, so gold mines naga banks, medusa strores etc are important compared to jebus, where you wont even waste half a day getting a gold mine.
And to make things clear: The idea to this temp is mine. Angelito made it after my instructions, because I didnt know how to do it. In my book that dosent make it his template, but I guess there are diffrent opinions about that.
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Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted June 09, 2009 09:45 AM |
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I never wanted to claim the "copyright" of this poor jebus template...just to get things straight here.
If someone (Tim for example) creates a map called "Lord of the Rings", he will also say "It is my map", even though the idea is from Tolkien..
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted June 09, 2009 10:03 AM |
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Edited by liophy at 10:03, 09 Jun 2009.
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Hehe, i managed to put Angelito and Maretti into an argument.
I feel happy 
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xlnt
Known Hero
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posted June 09, 2009 11:24 AM |
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Personally i'd like to have a 'True Random' with better Dwells. The one thing i don't like in this awesome temp is that you may have an unreasonable number of dwells.
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Pavelismus
Hired Hero
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posted June 09, 2009 11:31 AM |
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@angelito
i would like to make some efforts on this project and i can write it down(in german) on the drachenwald.net forum i only need the rmg.txt file from somewhere where all is configured cus i have no excel and lost this fitting prog for the rmgenerator...still i would love to test and look at the objects out of curiosity and for better template knowledge at all.. 
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted June 09, 2009 11:39 AM |
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Quote:
Personally i'd like to have a 'True Random' with better Dwells. The one thing i don't like in this awesome temp is that you may have an unreasonable number of dwells.
Make a player agreed rule - maximum dwellings = 3(example). And no 2 dwell of same kind (unless level 1).
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted June 09, 2009 12:39 PM |
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Edited by angelito at 12:39, 09 Jun 2009.
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Quote:
Personally i'd like to have a 'True Random' with better Dwells. The one thing i don't like in this awesome temp is that you may have an unreasonable number of dwells.
I also did an updated True Random (was maretti's idea ). As far as I remember, he liked it. Not sure how well it is known by other players than him...
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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tob
Hired Hero
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posted June 09, 2009 01:13 PM |
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Edited by tob at 13:13, 09 Jun 2009.
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Quote:
I agree with Liophy that Protos is a very nice opponent. As I see it his weakness is that he dosent use any (annoying) means to get the win. Another thing I like about him is that he plays pretty fast. The trend between the stronger players seem to be longer and longer turns. Average turns of 15 min and even plus 10 min on poor temps are getting more and more normal. I have no idea what all this time is spent on, but its pretty damn annoying. The question is how skilled your are if you need 15 min in average to play well?
But isnt that a matter of taste?? in chess some people play fast and others not and actually it is two different games the way i understand it.
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted June 09, 2009 01:21 PM |
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Quote:
But isnt that a matter of taste?? in chess some people play fast and others not and actually it is two different games the way i understand it.
For heroes 3 games time is very esential matter. If you are not unemployed, single and a total loaf - you dont have endless time to play.
So - everything that saves time is wellcome. Thats why i love TE.
But there is other methods aswell. Like - starting 130% instead of 200. Playing always cobblestone roads instead of dirt.
And offcourse - make your turns relatively fast. Nobody say you have to do 2 min turn. Take what time is needed.
But some players seems like just waste the time. Not because they need it, but because they dont care to save time.
I suppose thats what Maretti has in mind and i support it.
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tob
Hired Hero
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posted June 09, 2009 01:28 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
But isnt that a matter of taste?? in chess some people play fast and others not and actually it is two different games the way i understand it.
For heroes 3 games time is very esential matter. If you are not unemployed, single and a total loaf - you dont have endless time to play.
So - everything that saves time is wellcome. Thats why i love TE.
But there is other methods aswell. Like - starting 130% instead of 200. Playing always cobblestone roads instead of dirt.
And offcourse - make your turns relatively fast. Nobody say you have to do 2 min turn. Take what time is needed.
But some players seems like just waste the time. Not because they need it, but because they dont care to save time.
I suppose thats what Maretti has in mind and i support it.
[/quote/]
I understand that . It was this sentence: "The question is how skilled your are if you need 15 min in average to play well?" i was commenting on.
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted June 09, 2009 01:41 PM |
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Edited by liophy at 11:30, 03 Aug 2009.
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Quote:
I understand that . It was this sentence: "The question is how skilled your are if you need 15 min in average to play well?" i was commenting on.
Obviously you need to quote only what you reffer.
As with Xarfax comment about the "more than 20 jebus game", this is exaggerated. Some person play faster, some dont.
Some people are magician with their fingers when they have to split army before battle, other dont push it so much.
What Maretti said probably is that half of the fights against the map is obvious. You must know what to do. How to do it and etc. So no need to think about it. And if you need a lot of thinking about every simple fight - obviously you are not experienced enough.
Still, i dont thing thats a major problem and its rarely the case.
I stand for my first statement. People just don care for saving the time. They waste it because they dont care. Which by the way is normal if you are in some lazy mood.
Not always the game is played as a competitive race. The important thing is both the players to be in same mood. If you play an old friend - you know him and no problem. Differences occur when you play for the first time against somebody.
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Xarfax111
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
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posted June 09, 2009 03:27 PM |
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Quote:
"If someone has more then 20 Jebus maps on his record he shouldnt be taken any serious. And peeps that did have played over 80% on certain map/template arent good at all."
Should be pretty obvious to anyone that this is pure nonesense. Allthough jebus is stinking rich it still requeres a lot of skill to play it well. Everything just happens faster on jebus and that is probably why its so popular but its the same things you need to do as on other templates.
Well if you cant see that Jebus isnt really a strategic template and as you cant see that Jebus is simply leaving MANY if not almost all aspects of heroes out of the game, shows that you are not a good player.
The varios aspects and the various strategies that this game normally provides are 90% taken out of the game.
The popularity of this stupid template does only show that it is EASY to play. On this template everything is for free. So resource management and precise chaining is gone. You can built creature building very easy even on 200%, so that map buildings dont mean any difficulty at all. So event planning is gone too. You dont have to think about your opponent until your endfight, as long as you can manage to "break thru" on a certain day. So strategic planning concerning your opponent is taken out almost totally. The endfights are lame as hell. The army at that stage are so huge that only certain spells are any usefull. The spell variety is about 5 spells in the endfight = lame. About 90% of Jebus games are decided of how many Wyvern could be drained or if you could do a double built or if your Utopia was less big then the ones of the oppenent = lame. The variety of heroes that can give you a win with huge armies is also very limited, magic heroes are taken out completely. Level 1-5 Creatures have no meaning in the endfight ...etc etc etc.. the line is endless, why this template is the lamest template ever. Its even more lame then the players that kept on playing Desert War over and over again.
If you think that you are good player cause you play this map better then other you are wrong. It only shows that you are a good player on Jebus (or similar templates), which means not much as these templates leave out too much of the game.
I know you will get angry about this, but maybe you also understand my point.
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Xarfax111
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
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posted June 09, 2009 03:33 PM |
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Quote:
As with Xarfax comment about the "more than 20 jebus game", this is exaggerated. Some person play faster, some dont.
Playing this template 20 times without finding out how boring this template is, and even specialising on this template, tells everything about the one that plays it.
The only valid point is made by Angelito. Simply that you only can find players for this template (cause its easy to play) is the only valid argue for this template.
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