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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted December 13, 2012 09:26 PM |
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted December 13, 2012 10:08 PM |
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No, Israel's official religion is Judaism. Its right wing politicians are quite extreme about it too. Part of the fight is their concept of the "promised land" which is a very core image of the religion.
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted December 13, 2012 10:18 PM |
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Wrong level playing Jews who said they were Jews.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted December 13, 2012 11:55 PM |
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Quote:
Wrong level playing Jews who said they were Jews.
Do you know that your level of english is abysimal?
The language of this forum is ENGLISH.
I dont know from which frickin country you are, but please MAKE SENSE or DONT POST AT ALL.
Its snowing annoying to read your broken comments that absolutely make no sense.
I wonder how moderators allow this type of trolling to be allowed in forums.
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted December 14, 2012 07:51 AM |
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In short:
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
Another what? The Jews are not the chosen people.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070304085018AAFVG2G
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Geny
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 14, 2012 09:00 AM |
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Sadly, Israel is not a secular state. Religion is hardwired into some of the laws here. On the other hand, don't make the mistake of thinking that religion drives every decision here. All the religious parties are indeed right-winged, but not all the right-wing parties are religious. The biggest right-wing party - Likkud Beytenu, which is a recent merge of Likkud (Netanyahu) and Israel Beytenu (Lieberman) is more secular than religious. Especially after the merge.
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
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Geny
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted January 25, 2013 08:06 PM |
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Well, this Tuesday Israel had its elections. Despite Netanyahu's efforts to emphasize the Iranian issue, the elections were accented on internal issues. So it's a bit hard to say how exactly the elections will affect the Palestinian issue.
Anyway, in case anyone's interested here are the results (the numbers are mandates in the Knesset out of 120):
31 - Likkud Beytenu (Netanyahu)
19 - Yesh Atid (Yair Lapid) - a former news reporter, Lapid got into politics only a year ago and promised lots of changes in internal affairs. Many voted for him, because they felt tired of the more seasoned politicians.
15 - Labor (Sheli Yehimovich)
12 - Habayt Hayehudi (Benett) - a typically right-wing religious party, their new leader tried to show a more liberal approach and got some more votes for this.
11 - Shas - the ultra religious party.
7 - Yahadut Hatora - another ultra religious party.
6 - Hatnua (Tzipi Livni) - the party that was formed right before the elections by former Kadima leader Livni. Most of her campaign revolved around saying that Netanyahu will bring Israel to war and isolation while she will get a settlement.
6 - Meretz - the ultra left-wing party.
4 - Ra'am-Ta'al - an Arab party.
4 - Hadash - ditto.
3 - Balad - ditto.
2 - Kadima (Mofaz) - what's left of the party that was the biggest party in Knesset and the ruling party in times of II Lebanon War and Cast Lead operation.
Soon, Netanyahu will have to form a coalition. The only thing that is known for certain at this point is that Lapid will be a major part in it. I'll update this as soon as a coalition is formed.
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 26, 2013 10:27 PM |
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 26, 2013 10:30 PM |
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Edited by xerox at 22:30, 26 Jan 2013.
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well it's sort of understandable (but sad and a flaw of democracy)
your country would probably be even more nationalistic if your neighbours kept launching rockets in your face too
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted January 26, 2013 10:44 PM |
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Yes, it's a shame to drop rockets if the other appropriates your homeland inch by inch and consider killing relatives as collateral damage. What would you do, kiss their feet?
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xerox
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 26, 2013 11:07 PM |
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it's a spiral of hatred on both sides
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted January 26, 2013 11:41 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 23:46, 26 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
Yes, it's a shame to drop rockets if the other appropriates your homeland inch by inch and consider killing relatives as collateral damage. What would you do, kiss their feet?
No. Dialogue must be pursued. Even if your are being wrecked by bombs, missiles and rockets.
"The parties concerned in the conflict should seek, by peaceable means, through dialogue and adherence to the international law, a solution that respects the principles and purposes of the UN Charter."
"Israel and Gaza should continue the dialogue to find common ground that will be acceptable to both parties."
"A peaceful solution for the issue of Palestine must continue to be sought through dialogue and negotiation, under the auspices of the UN."
My reaction: "Yeah, as if the UN is worth a damn or has done anything worthwhile during its miserable existence except making the lives of countless people even more miserable.
When it comes to politics bullsnow, the least and the most provocative one could say is to "Remain calm and make dialouge"...
Thats because mostly the sides that partake in the dialouge want sqeeze the living bejesus out of each other. Also, its quite the lackluster "I dont give a snow so keep talking" attitude.
On one side we have a religiously motivated military steamroller and religiously motivated jihadists(Who preach for the miserable sharia laws).
If religion was not the case here, I could defenitely say that the palestinians deserve a state. Point is, I have no clue what powers, influences and whatnot play a role in palestine.
As for Israel... They need more liberal people in charge, in fact the whole middle east needs more liberty and less totalitarian islam and refrain from using bombs. Thats only if the want peace. Not a political solution.
There is never a good political solution with the wrong people in place.
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"Science is not fun without cyanide"
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted January 26, 2013 11:56 PM |
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It is unlikely a dialog can be constructive between "something which does not exist-no man's land" and a powerful state. Why talk when you can grab in all impunity because it belongs to nobody?
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted January 27, 2013 12:15 AM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 00:21, 27 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
It is unlikely a dialog can be constructive between "something which does not exist-no man's land" and a powerful state. Why talk when you can grab in all impunity because it belongs to nobody?
For peace to exist, both sides must be ready for dialogue and peace and the more powerful side must refrain from using military or economic means to influence the other faction.
In otherwords, both israel and the palestinian need a regime change.
If this does not happen, people will keep dying.
But since nobody gives a damn, and muslims rather gather and make some joint initiatives for peace and prosperity, they would rather build bombs and commit suicide because some dude 10K kilometers away burned a quran or told the truth about the warlord muhamed.
In essence, there is only war there. No peace is possible unless one party is wiped out or subjugated. Before Israel existed, most people of other faiths were subjugated by Islam as dhimmis.
Neither the Jews or the muslims ever heard of making peace for the greater good. At least, muslims certainly never did.
On the other hand, Israel has really no reason to give palestinians any rights. Sure, it would lead to a one sided ceasefire for a short time again, but this state of constant war and skirmishes allows israel to fund military programs and increase its territory before a "Final" solution is made.
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"Science is not fun without cyanide"
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted January 27, 2013 12:39 AM |
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I wonder if someone still believes Israel wants peace. The last decision to pursue colonization in response to Palestine obtaining an observer member status to UN is indicative of the real goal behind (shut up or be punished). Talking about a peace process is giving cover to israeli nationalists who are determined to grab everything the palestinians have and reduce them to refugees (again).
Israel does not accept Palestine’s right to exist, even though it is constantly demanding that everyone, including the displaced and occupied Palestinians, recognize Israel’s right to exist, does this sounds fair to anyone?
Although most US media is a cheering section for the Likud, in fact the world is increasingly done out with Israel’s aggressiveness. Boycotts and sanctions will likely grow over time, leaving Israel with a deficit. With the US next recession coming out, there is no doubt one day Israel will not have anymore the financial possibility to aim at a bigger state which they would want to include all the territory once held by the british mandate of Palestine.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted January 27, 2013 11:26 AM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 11:43, 27 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
Although most US media is a cheering section for the Likud, in fact the world is increasingly done out with Israel’s aggressiveness. Boycotts and sanctions will likely grow over time, leaving Israel with a deficit. With the US next recession coming out, there is no doubt one day Israel will not have anymore the financial possibility to aim at a bigger state which they would want to include all the territory once held by the british mandate of Palestine.
You are saying a lot of bogus things about the Israelis. You cant assume that it is their "Wish" to expand. Of course we are having here a discussion, but I find this a bit to prejudiced.
Also, the US recession is a lot less worse than advertized in the media. Sure, people lose their jobs and the social norms do collapse, but that is simply the way how our economic system works.
Its just the usual cycle of recession inside a capitalist economy.
Thats at least from my experience.
That said, the US will contuue to fund Israel as it is its closest Ally in the world.
As for the whole conficlt...let me say this. Nobody gives a damn nowadays about Israel. Some people do, most have other things to "Worry" about.
You can look at it in any way you like, its just the way of life. People will die, nobody will care. If you are upset by the injustice of Israel towards palestinians, then rest be assured that that wont change unless the US stops supporting Israel.
This type of snow has repeated itself over human history many times.
Its simply the price people pay for being slaves or second class citizens or hereticall
Also, the palestinians have cornered themselves on the moral background by supporting totalitarian islam.
And one more thing, gaza has no value what-so-ever. Even if a foreign military power were to intervene in gaza and force israeli cease-fire, what would they gain?
Nothing at all.
Evil Prevails When Good Men do Nothing
Evil prevails
edit:
About the whole israeli conflict...
Even if Israel does conquer and wipe out all arabs in the Middle East.
Again, why would YOU care?
Is the israeli treatment to palestinians hitting a nerve to you? Is it about human "Decency"?
I bet that you dont care about the treatment of North Koreans, European migrants, Roma-Gypsies, Kurds and so on.
Its because of the Israeli military acting ravishingly.
It apparantly pisses people off that they are doing stuff which no other country in the world can,I guess?
So maybe, we should rename the whole problem to "Israeli military forces being too brutal" but neither you, or you coutnry can or is willing to change that.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted January 27, 2013 11:37 AM |
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Bogus?
I come to your house and I say "this room is mine". One week later I say "this room is also mine". Is a bogus to conclude I want your vital space?
Quote:
Again, why would YOU care?
I bet that you dont care
Nice argument to continue the talk. Typically Seraphim. Now waiting for JJ to say "you missed the point" and have the thread burst in no time.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted January 27, 2013 12:05 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 12:22, 27 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
Bogus?
I come to your house and I say "this room is mine". One week later I say "this room is also mine". Is a bogus to conclude I want your vital space?
I can teach you one or two things how things such as this work because of my experience with "Claims".
Firstly, forget about "What is mire or yours rightfully and focus what is yours legally"
In the west, when you buy something, you either buy a license to use it at will or buy it for real(assuming the thing you buy is material).
Most of the time its the former.
Now, imagine that you buy a house in a country that belonged de jure and de facto to the Bunny Empire.
The Bunnies go to hell, leave the place and recognize one of the states in the area,in this case Mordor. No other states.
A war happens and everything goes to hell. You reclaim your house but you soon find out that other people build houses or buldings in the area around you in un fair manners. (Windows facing the wrong side and people being able to peek inside your house)
In other words, the area you used to live in got changed a lot and is not confomring to the regulations you would expect people to follow.
Some houses have new owners now.
A new war erupts and you come back to see that your house was destroyed and new house was rebuilt thre and now has a new owner.
Since the territory you build your home is a no man's land(Not recognized or holds no power whatsoever to support its citizens) and the others "Found" the area uninhabited, it belongs to them now.
You have no LEGAL right to claim that your house belongs to you because the "Sovereignty" of the part or the country you are living is null and void to the other side and because you have no legal weight in the state of Mordor.
Needless to say, you lost your house because you cant claim anything on a ghost country.
Sure, you can say they stole my land. But beyond getting a lousy compensation, if you are lucky, is all you can hope for.
edit: No offense meant to israelis here.
Quote:
Typically Seraphim. Now waiting for JJ to say "you missed the point" and have the thread burst in no time.
You are the only guy here acting harshly against Israel.
Besides, if gaza was prosperous and not an economic warp zone, things would have been different there.
I wonder how someone, as much as you dislike muslims, dislike israel.
You know Israel could act as a stability factor in the region. Afterall, there must be a front where you face sharia and megalomanical jihadists.
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"Science is not fun without cyanide"
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted January 27, 2013 12:22 PM |
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Emm...ok, difficult for me to follow what you say there. From a strict legal point of view, even US is condemning the colonization over Gaza and consider it as illegal. Check for sources. Then we may speculate over the Bunny empire if you wish.
Quote:
You are the only guy here acting harshly against Israel.
Nope, I am saying it acts in all impunity and illegality. You finish your post by saying "evil prevails" and I am the one who is harsh toward?
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Era II mods and utilities
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted January 27, 2013 12:29 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 12:54, 27 Jan 2013.
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Quote:
Emm...ok, difficult for me to follow what you say there. From a strict legal point of view, even US is condemning the colonization over Gaza and consider it as illegal. Check for sources. Then we may speculate over the Bunny empire if you wish.
So what, some guy from the US says something and it suddenly becomes a problem?
If palestianians say "Oh no, they are stealing our landz" they can shove that garbage down their ass because they have no "LEGAL" land.
Legality is all that matters when it comes to "Claims" and of course military power(One cant simply kill the settlers in hot warzones especially when there are geopolitical interest in the settlers).
Quote:
You are the only guy here acting harshly against Israel.
Nope, I am saying it acts in all impunity and illegality. You finish your post by saying "evil prevails" and I am the one who is harsh toward?
My reaction: So what? I am a pessimist, and things generally go wrong.
The israeli-palestinian issue is a deadlock.
I dont judge the israelis, you do. Why you do so is clear but those reasons are not enough to judge israel for acting with impunity.
THey are just being clever. So they are making land grabs, good for them if they succeed.
I just cant stand it when people "Scream" injustice when in fact it is justified. It could be morally wrong but it is legal.
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"Science is not fun without cyanide"
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