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| Thread: Mistakes of Heroes I to VII |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · NEXT» |
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted October 03, 2015 11:38 AM |
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Edited by EnergyZ at 11:52, 03 Oct 2015.
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Mistakes of Heroes I to VII
Since the dawn of time (aka release of Heroes I), I can't help but feel there are still some ongoing mistakes we still suffer to this very day. I am just going to put some "mistakes" here. For example:
* logistics remains a skill. It is overused (well, maybe not in H7) and no matter how much it is being changed, I consider it a mistake.
Proposal: move it to the primary skills, along with attack/defense/spell power/knowledge.
* knowledge has little use after becoming 30+. Usually there are ways where one can replenish the mana, either by magic well or visiting the town with mage guild. Raising the cost of casting the spell could work, but it won't fare well for the start of the game.
Proposal: let it also add a magic resistance value to the creatures.
* three tier system. While not an ongoing feature, it is absolutely scoffed and needs to be changed.
Proposal: change back to 7+ tier system.
* useless skills. Well, it might be misleading to say useless, but it is certainly unfair to have a hero with Navigation on a map with no water. Similar goes to Eagle Eye/Scholar, which adds an insignificant part of hero's development.
Proposal: merge Eagle Eye and Scholar, add some additional bonuses, while have Navigation also add some bonuses, like increasing creature's speed by +2.
* AI. Most have complained the AI is still bad. It is certainly better to see the AI making smarter decisions, but, wouldn't that make the game even more difficult, even unsolvable?
Proposal: let tougher difficulties have the AI receive even more bonuses or have the player receive some penalties, like max. movement, number of XP gained etc.
* additonal platforms. Maybe not a major issue, but it might be a step to make the strategy games even more popular. But this also requires more money than H5 had for development. There have been instances of Playstation 2 (Quest for the Dragonbone Staff) and GBA (Heroes I and II).
Proposal: introduce the Heroes series to xbox, Playstation and other platforms.
* actual factions. I feel it is getting boring to have a normed faction, like sprites belong to Sylvan, angels to Haven, black dragons to Dungeon etc. Even adding new creatures won't change much, and such attempts have been mostly rejected (like that votes for line-ups).
Proposal: make different factions and mix creatures (e.g. humans with elves, demons with undead, mages and dwarves etc.)
Remember, these are just mistakes and proposals, mostly to make some variety and balance between factions and heroes. Please, if you think of something that still is bothersome, then post here.
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Come and visit the Might and Magic Wikia!
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TD
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 03, 2015 01:41 PM |
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Edited by TD at 13:46, 03 Oct 2015.
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Abandoning h5 initiative system. It's great even in its current form, but with more polishing it could've been perfect. Instead they reverted to old system in h6 and copy-pasted that to h7 to make the games easier and more simple.
Fog of War from h4 gave extra layer in strategy and tactics in form of needing vision and avoiding enemy vision.
Terrain penalties/boosts in battles are lacking after h3 and h4.
Unique abilities got lost from skills other than racial after h5.
Different type and style racials are missing after h5. Some should have more use outside battles, some in battle, some between. Also there shouldn't be much overlap between racials in the game!
Lack of creature abilities that work on map like bandit with stealth or peasant with gold production.
Lack of patrol for creatures since h4.
Heroes cannot be effected by spells/effects since h4(don't need to be on battle-field).
Heroes limited to 1 per army after h4. They should be less powerful overall, but something you can use to take troop slots.
Lack of good AI! It gets extremely boring and tedious to do battles when enemy doesn't give you good/high challenge. Just increasing enemy numbers doesn't really do anything if enemy can't make use of them because of bad AI. It just doesn't feel rewarding to beat enemy 10 times your size because it kept running up and down because it didn't understand how to run past a rock...
For team games possibility to have multiple armies fight together like in Heroes Online. This is something I would've definitely expected to see on sorts of dual mode given that devs copied flanking from heroes online(though it wasn't done as well in h7).
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted October 03, 2015 01:53 PM |
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EnergyZ said:
* knowledge has little use after becoming 30+. Usually there are ways where one can replenish the mana, either by magic well or visiting the town with mage guild. Raising the cost of casting the spell could work, but it won't fare well for the start of the game.
Proposal: let it also add a magic resistance value to the creatures.
I still believe limiting the increase of mana per knowledge point while at the same time boosting mana regeneration could do the trick.
With +5 max mana, +2 mana regen heroes would no longer stack big amounts of mana until very late in the game. High knowledge values would encourage the hero to use lots of spells daily, without needing to get back to town or take a detour to visit a magic dwell.
It could also limit the amount of spells that can be casted in a big battle, leaving the players with the decision to either seek the extra mana artifacts/skills OR stick to a more efficient set up.
Finally, I kindly remind all of you that Heroes IV experimented with different versions of magic dwells, where they didn't fully replenish your mana, but rather a % of it.
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted October 03, 2015 01:57 PM |
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Storm-Giant said:
Finally, I kindly remind all of you that Heroes IV experimented with different versions of magic dwells, where they didn't fully replenish your mana, but rather a % of it.
Yes. But it hasn't appeared later on. That and one could just wait for a day for the rest to be replenished by visiting the same structure.
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Jormungand
Adventuring Hero
The Hammer of Hate
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posted October 03, 2015 01:59 PM |
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i've played homm2-6, still deciding if i will buy 7.
Quote:
* logistics remains a skill. It is overused (well, maybe not in H7) and no matter how much it is being changed, I consider it a mistake.
Proposal: move it to the primary skills, along with attack/defense/spell power/knowledge.
While it certainly is a good skill, it's useless in actual combat. fair trade-off if you ask me.
Quote:
* knowledge has little use after becoming 30+. Usually there are ways where one can replenish the mana, either by magic well or visiting the town with mage guild. Raising the cost of casting the spell could work, but it won't fare well for the start of the game.
Proposal: let it also add a magic resistance value to the creatures.
depends on what type of hero you're playing. heroes5 warlocks can drain their manapool in a few spells, even lategame. There's a reason why sinitar is considered one of the best h5dungeon heroes.
magicresist is a horrible idea since magic damage lategame is lackluster anyway. on a sidenote, lvl30+ is a level you won't reach often unless you are stretching the game.
Quote:
* three tier system. While not an ongoing feature, it is absolutely scoffed and needs to be changed.
Proposal: change back to 7+ tier system.
I dont think it's bad, but im definitely in favor of more creatures, so you have to decide which one you put in your army.(not the h4 4tier system though)
Quote:
* useless skills. Well, it might be misleading to say useless, but it is certainly unfair to have a hero with Navigation on a map with no water. Similar goes to Eagle Eye/Scholar, which adds an insignificant part of hero's development.
Proposal: merge Eagle Eye and Scholar, add some additional bonuses, while have Navigation also add some bonuses, like increasing creature's speed by +2.
i agree on eagle eye/scholar being useless. navigation on the other hand is something you only take on a watermap.
Quote:
* AI. Most have complained the AI is still bad. It is certainly better to see the AI making smarter decisions, but, wouldn't that make the game even more difficult, even unsolvable?
Proposal: let tougher difficulties have the AI receive even more bonuses or have the player receive some penalties, like max. movement, number of XP gained etc.
I disagree on penalties/bonuses. AI should become more intelligent if you put the difficulty higher and beat you through smart decisions rather then cheating.
Quote:
* additonal platforms. Maybe not a major issue, but it might be a step to make the strategy games even more popular. But this also requires more money than H5 had for development. There have been instances of Playstation 2 (Quest for the Dragonbone Staff) and GBA (Heroes I and II).
Proposal: introduce the Heroes series to xbox, Playstation and other platforms.
*insert PCMR comment here*
strategy games generally aren't that good on consoles (remember aoe2 ps2 version?)
Quote:
* actual factions. I feel it is getting boring to have a normed faction, like sprites belong to Sylvan, angels to Haven, black dragons to Dungeon etc. Even adding new creatures won't change much, and such attempts have been mostly rejected (like that votes for line-ups).
Proposal: make different factions and mix creatures (e.g. humans with elves, demons with undead, mages and dwarves etc.)
completely disagree here.
this is the reason one of the coolest towns in the series disappeared(h3fortress ofc). towns should keep their identity above all else. also, black dragons removed from dungeon? really?
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted October 03, 2015 02:08 PM |
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Jormungand said:
Proposal: move it to the primary skills, along with attack/defense/spell power/knowledge.
While it certainly is a good skill, it's useless in actual combat. fair trade-off if you ask me.
Quote:
* knowledge has little use after becoming 30+. Usually there are ways where one can replenish the mana, either by magic well or visiting the town with mage guild. Raising the cost of casting the spell could work, but it won't fare well for the start of the game.
Proposal: let it also add a magic resistance value to the creatures.
depends on what type of hero you're playing. heroes5 warlocks can drain their manapool in a few spells, even lategame. There's a reason why sinitar is considered one of the best h5dungeon heroes.
magicresist is a horrible idea since magic damage lategame is lackluster anyway. on a sidenote, lvl30+ is a level you won't reach often unless you are stretching the game.
Quote:
* three tier system. While not an ongoing feature, it is absolutely scoffed and needs to be changed.
Proposal: change back to 7+ tier system.
I dont think it's bad, but im definitely in favor of more creatures, so you have to decide which one you put in your army.(not the h4 4tier system though)
Quote:
* useless skills. Well, it might be misleading to say useless, but it is certainly unfair to have a hero with Navigation on a map with no water. Similar goes to Eagle Eye/Scholar, which adds an insignificant part of hero's development.
Proposal: merge Eagle Eye and Scholar, add some additional bonuses, while have Navigation also add some bonuses, like increasing creature's speed by +2.
i agree on eagle eye/scholar being useless. navigation on the other hand is something you only take on a watermap.
* AI. Most have complained the AI is still bad. It is certainly better to see the AI making smarter decisions, but, wouldn't that make the game even more difficult, even unsolvable?
Proposal: let tougher difficulties have the AI receive even more bonuses or have the player receive some penalties, like max. movement, number of XP gained etc.
I disagree on penalties/bonuses. AI should become more intelligent if you put the difficulty higher and beat you through smart decisions rather then cheating.
* additonal platforms. Maybe not a major issue, but it might be a step to make the strategy games even more popular. But this also requires more money than H5 had for development. There have been instances of Playstation 2 (Quest for the Dragonbone Staff) and GBA (Heroes I and II).
Proposal: introduce the Heroes series to xbox, Playstation and other platforms.
*insert PCMR comment here*
strategy games generally aren't that good on consoles (remember aoe2 ps2 version?)
Quote:
* actual factions. I feel it is getting boring to have a normed faction, like sprites belong to Sylvan, angels to Haven, black dragons to Dungeon etc. Even adding new creatures won't change much, and such attempts have been mostly rejected (like that votes for line-ups).
Proposal: make different factions and mix creatures (e.g. humans with elves, demons with undead, mages and dwarves etc.)
completely disagree here.
this is the reason one of the coolest towns in the series disappeared(h3fortress ofc). towns should keep their identity above all else. also, black dragons removed from dungeon? really?
About primary skills, certainly better to move it into primary skills rather than having to learn one same skill over and over and over.
About magic resistance, I meant 30 or more knowledge stat. Heck, even at 20 you don't feel such need. Besides, how else do you want to play defensive against spellcasting?
AI, maybe. Don't know yet, but I just feel people are used at the current AI and improving it from H3 standards could prove a bit too much. Let us just say that people count on AI's predictability.
Platforms - this is just a thought for future devs to think of. There may just lie some value in it.
As for factions, I still hear some people complaining the current factions add little diversity between former and newer games. Besides, I am not saying to remove units, just to move them into different factions and make something new, yet still effective.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted October 03, 2015 02:25 PM |
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EnergyZ said:
Storm-Giant said:
Finally, I kindly remind all of you that Heroes IV experimented with different versions of magic dwells, where they didn't fully replenish your mana, but rather a % of it.
Yes. But it hasn't appeared later on. That and one could just wait for a day for the rest to be replenished by visiting the same structure.
Then make it so they can only be visited once per week or something like that. Hell, there's no need to link everything to the weeks, creature growth makes sense, but adventure buildings could simply work in days (stables giving +6 movement for 7 days, magic dwells could be used again after 4 days, etc).
Also, I don't like having lots of very little gains. Things like +3 to morale in a 100 system sucks. Each point should hold a significant value without making each one powerful. Thus why I believe resistance works very nicely in steps of 5, whereas +1 of magic resistance per level sounds iffy to me.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted October 03, 2015 03:01 PM |
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EnergyZ said:
* logistics remains a skill. It is overused (well, maybe not in H7) and no matter how much it is being changed, I consider it a mistake.
Proposal: move it to the primary skills, along with attack/defense/spell power/knowledge.
I don't disagree with your proposal (could potentially create a lot of depth) but I don't think we should remove Logistics completely. Just change it from adding flat movement to just giving bonuses such as path finding, navigation etc, tactics etc. alternatively you could spread these around the wheel a bit.
EnergyZ said:
* knowledge has little use after becoming 30+. Usually there are ways where one can replenish the mana, either by magic well or visiting the town with mage guild. Raising the cost of casting the spell could work, but it won't fare well for the start of the game.
Proposal: let it also add a magic resistance value to the creatures.
I've already said my thoughts on these things and it remains the same: magic stats should only exist on heroes. some specific stuff like mages reducing mana costs for heroes or Dwarves having a chance of blocking spells are fine but anything else and magic heroes will start acting like might heroes.
EnergyZ said:
* three tier system. While not an ongoing feature, it is absolutely scoffed and needs to be changed.
Proposal: change back to 7+ tier system.
No. Tiers work. That said, I'd like it to be 4 tiers with 2 creatures in each instead to get some of the old progression back.
EnergyZ said:
* useless skills. Well, it might be misleading to say useless, but it is certainly unfair to have a hero with Navigation on a map with no water. Similar goes to Eagle Eye/Scholar, which adds an insignificant part of hero's development.
Proposal: merge Eagle Eye and Scholar, add some additional bonuses, while have Navigation also add some bonuses, like increasing creature's speed by +2.
For eagle eye to work you need to either make spells harder to obtain or add may new spells that are useful. Eagle eye could be a great addition if developers were to try and actually implement it. Navigation is fine though I think adding an entire tree for navigation with perks and everything could be a good idea. Sure, useless in land-locked maps but that's what situational skills are.
EnergyZ said:
* AI. Most have complained the AI is still bad. It is certainly better to see the AI making smarter decisions, but, wouldn't that make the game even more difficult, even unsolvable?
Proposal: let tougher difficulties have the AI receive even more bonuses or have the player receive some penalties, like max. movement, number of XP gained etc.
Can't we just have good AI?
EnergyZ said:
* additonal platforms. Maybe not a major issue, but it might be a step to make the strategy games even more popular. But this also requires more money than H5 had for development. There have been instances of Playstation 2 (Quest for the Dragonbone Staff) and GBA (Heroes I and II).
Proposal: introduce the Heroes series to xbox, Playstation and other platforms.
Not sure about those since controlling Heroes would be an absolute pain. Could work on the WiiU though...
EnergyZ said:
* actual factions. I feel it is getting boring to have a normed faction, like sprites belong to Sylvan, angels to Haven, black dragons to Dungeon etc. Even adding new creatures won't change much, and such attempts have been mostly rejected (like that votes for line-ups).
Proposal: make different factions and mix creatures (e.g. humans with elves, demons with undead, mages and dwarves etc.)
Eh, just burn Ashan to the ground. That'll help a lot.
The biggest mistake is having a design-lead who don't know how game-design works: they introduce and mix a bunch of mechanics into a game rather than have these mechanics as the base of said game, meaning they don't work well with the rest. Start over. decide what your mechanics will be then create the game around that. Don't just add stuff that worked in the past. There's no guarantee it will work with the rest of the game.
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted October 03, 2015 04:53 PM |
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Edited by Maurice at 16:57, 03 Oct 2015.
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EnergyZ said:
* logistics remains a skill. It is overused (well, maybe not in H7) and no matter how much it is being changed, I consider it a mistake.
Proposal: move it to the primary skills, along with attack/defense/spell power/knowledge.
A better suggestion would be to first examine what the logic behind Logistics really is. In every day life, logistics deals with moving people and goods efficiently and timely from one place to the next, making sure there's no surplus or shortage of any kind. A subpar efficiency or excess time costs money, after all. In the context of armies, it's the skill that determines how fast an army can pack up, how efficiently they can form the baggage train and how to escort it from point A to point B, as well as how to keep your army fed and rested enough (an army marches on its belly, after all). As such, Logistics should be a derived value, not a value that you can boost like you can boost Attack or Spirit and the likes.
In that respect, I see a few points that should logically be considered:
- army size;
- organisation skills;
- scouting around/ahead for ideal paths and available resources like food and water;
- The terrain crossed by the army while travelling;
- Movement speeds of each creature composing the army as a whole, since you can't move faster than your slowest unit or risk splitting the army apart;
Food isn't part of Heroes games (and I don't think it ever should be, not by default - it's used in Stronghold mission 3, though, to mimic the effects of starvation), but those aspects I mentioned should still reflect it.
Army size has a direct influence: the larger your army, the longer it takes to pack up as well as to build camp, so that will slow down an army, in effect reducing a Hero's movement skill. Creature speed is also an issue, so there should be a dependency on the various speeds of the creatures in the Hero's army.
The ones that would fall under skills are the organisation skills (how efficient can the Hero direct his troops when it comes to building camp or breaking camp?) as well as the scouting skill. The first one should simply be a Logistics Perk that I would say falls under Leadership. As a special version, embarking and disembarking is also a logistical challenge and should be affected by it accordingly.
The second one should be a part of the Scouting skill, offering a benefit since the army can be organised in accordance to the terrain. Pathfinding is another one that influences the actual available movement, where Pathfinding is very close to Scouting actually.
Besides that, there are Spells or activated Skills (Forced March, anyone?), Artifacts and temporary boosts from adventure map objects that can affect it. I would say that even Morale would be of influence, since troops with higher Morale tend to move faster than those with less.
Quote:
* additonal platforms. Maybe not a major issue, but it might be a step to make the strategy games even more popular. But this also requires more money than H5 had for development. There have been instances of Playstation 2 (Quest for the Dragonbone Staff) and GBA (Heroes I and II).
Proposal: introduce the Heroes series to xbox, Playstation and other platforms.
No, just no. If anything, creating games for use on console has shown that the UI is usually dumbed down with a lot of bells and whistles missing that would otherwise be possible on a real PC. UI elements on consoles are also larger than normally for PC use, since people are usually sitting further away from their screen when behind a console than when sitting behind a PC.
Just to name an example: X-Com 1 (the one from 2012, not from 1993) was designed for PC and console alike and the UI was one of the elements that was heavily criticized. For X-Com 2, due early 2016, they've decided to aim specifically for the PC and not for consoles, since it gives the developers much more options to make an interesting and complex game.
Quote:
* actual factions. I feel it is getting boring to have a normed faction, like sprites belong to Sylvan, angels to Haven, black dragons to Dungeon etc. Even adding new creatures won't change much, and such attempts have been mostly rejected (like that votes for line-ups).
Proposal: make different factions and mix creatures (e.g. humans with elves, demons with undead, mages and dwarves etc.)
Again, no. Infernopolis from H4 was a mess and to be honest, I never really like the mix-match of Rampart in H3 (mainly due to the Dwarves - they should have a faction of their own). But then again, I think factions should be racially oriented - just not as heavily dominated as some of the factions have been in H5 and H6. Racial factions, but heavily filled up with mythological creatures and monsters that are somehow feeling naturally aligned with the faction. As an aside, Mages aren't a race but a role.
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hermes
Famous Hero
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posted October 03, 2015 05:09 PM |
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Heroes 7 does have about 5 distinct tiers actually.
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filozof
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 03, 2015 05:10 PM |
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Race based factions aren't a mistake. There are many younger players (including me) who started with Heroes V and like Ashan with it's factions. It's only a matter of taste.
I love race based faction because everyone of them has its own well redefined identity and element. For example, my favourite faction is Academy, because they are oriental mages who can část powerful spells and make intimdating constructs. They aren't really original but I don't think they need to be. I see heroes like traditional fantasy world with everything that should be in it. Most of the people against prefer system of odler games. I don't want to argue about it because it is only matter of preference. Old factions with combined demons and undead or human and elves under one flag just don't have the same feeling for me.
I don't usually post in these forums bacuse I like newer Heroes games, even with their flaws. This isn't good place for people like me because most of the players here don't like them and are here only to complain about things that aren't like they would want them to be. I usually prefer small forums of my nation but I felt this was needed to be said.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted October 03, 2015 05:29 PM |
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Edited by kiryu133 at 17:30, 03 Oct 2015.
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Welcome! 
I don't think you quite grasp the complaint. The problem we have is that factions are only personalized through their race: sylvan are Elves and are filled with nothing but stereotypical elf things, same with Dark elf tow dungeon and dark elves and stronghold ad dwarves etc. There is no theme to the factions. just race and that's really dull. doesn't help that said race take up several creatures slots instead of much more worthy/interesting creatures like snowing blade dancers instead of snowing anything. (man, I snowing hate blade dancers  )
This doesn't apply to all the factions: Academy, as you said, is pretty great thematically and line-up wise (in comparison. it's still pretty shallow and dull compared to NWC academy) since it has more in common with NWC factions: it's built upon themes and philosophies. It's not some random race that decides how stuff look. Its the theme of the faction that does, specifically that of unhindered progress in the magical arts and development of constructs. That's a much better basis of design than "elves" and it shows in Academy being a thousand times more interesting than sylvan.
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted October 03, 2015 05:52 PM |
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hermes said:
Heroes 7 does have about 5 distinct tiers actually.
Better than 3, worse than 7-8 IMHO
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted October 03, 2015 05:57 PM |
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Galaad said:
hermes said:
Heroes 7 does have about 5 distinct tiers actually.
Better than 3, worse than 7-8 IMHO
Agreed.
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Sleeping_Sun
Promising
Famous Hero
Townscreen Architect
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posted October 03, 2015 06:25 PM |
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Well, according to Beta 2 files and several videos, I noticed that despite having 3 levels of units: core, elite and champion, the stats are scaled as if there are 7 levels of units. So, in H7 I do not think that levels are an issue.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted October 03, 2015 06:40 PM |
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Or maybe the crazy growth was the problem, deadly Pixies. 
Still in beta 2 it didn't quite feel like a 7 tier to me, shouldn't be too hard fix.
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Jormungand
Adventuring Hero
The Hammer of Hate
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posted October 03, 2015 06:46 PM |
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EnergyZ said:
About primary skills, certainly better to move it into primary skills rather than having to learn one same skill over and over and over.
I dont always take it tbh. I like it on my support/scoutheroes, but on my combatheroes, i usually just get combatskills.
Quote:
About magic resistance, I meant 30 or more knowledge stat. Heck, even at 20 you don't feel such need. Besides, how else do you want to play defensive against spellcasting?
i just know that damagespells arent that good in a long game and adding magic resist to lategame heroes will make them even worse.
if damagespells got a lategame boost with stuff like special units giving additional spellpower(x amount of dragons giving 1 spellpower for example), then that would be a different story.
Quote:
AI, maybe. Don't know yet, but I just feel people are used at the current AI and improving it from H3 standards could prove a bit too much. Let us just say that people count on AI's predictability.
hardest difficulty AI should be like a chesscomputer deciding the best possible action and thinking 5billion steps(so to speak) ahead.
cheating AI to make the game harder is just cheap...
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Platforms - this is just a thought for future devs to think of. There may just lie some value in it.
consoles >< strategygames
Quote:
As for factions, I still hear some people complaining the current factions add little diversity between former and newer games. Besides, I am not saying to remove units, just to move them into different factions and make something new, yet still effective.
going further on the dungeon example:
removing black dragons from dungeon(and moving them to another faction) would make dungeon not dungeon anymore.
then again, i think they should just scrap ashan and build further on axeoth or go back to enroth.
ashan is a world full of generic stuff/wc3copies, while enroth/axeoth was an original fantasyworld.
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yasmiel
Supreme Hero
Former Chessmaster
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posted October 03, 2015 07:28 PM |
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Judging by "feeling", it looks like creatures in H7 are roughly corresponding to these H3 levels:
2 creatures of level 2
1 creature of level 3
2 creatures of level 5
1 creature of level 6
1 out of 2 creatures of level 7 to choose.
To me this really looks fine and doesn't feel as lacking as H6 split.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted October 03, 2015 07:45 PM |
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Logistics is fine as a skill imo, it just needs tweaking. I wouldn't mind individualized movement for each faction though, like sylvan having increased movement in forests, sanctuary in swamps etc.
Knowledge is fine. Your issue can be addressed by making higher tier spells more expensive, leaving earlygame unchanged.
I do not mind 3 tiers terribly but 4 would work much better. Or 7 like in the past.
Useless skills have no reason to exist. Later heroes and KB have found some decent solutions about traditionally weak abilities.
[It is certainly better to see the AI making smarter decisions, but, wouldn't that make the game even more difficult, even unsolvable?]
No. We do need a smarter AI.
[additonal platforms]
No. Transition to gaming consoles has diluted otherwise great series.
[actual factions]
Don't care about racial lineups, mixed races is preferable.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Nitramar
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 03, 2015 08:34 PM |
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Edited by Nitramar at 20:36, 03 Oct 2015.
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EnergyZ said:
* logistics remains a skill. It is overused (well, maybe not in H7) and no matter how much it is being changed, I consider it a mistake.
Proposal: move it to the primary skills, along with attack/defense/spell power/knowledge.
I agree with this solution. In general, I think that all skills that just add more of something that's already there should be primary skills. Secondary skills should add strategic and specialized abilities more than passive bonuses.
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* three tier system. While not an ongoing feature, it is absolutely scoffed and needs to be changed.
Proposal: change back to 7+ tier system.
I think a three (or four) tier system makes more sense on paper than a 7 tier one. Even better though: remove any explicit tiers and just have different units with stats that make sense (flavourwise) and adjust prices/growth rates for balance. Not all factions need to have the same structure.
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* AI. Most have complained the AI is still bad. It is certainly better to see the AI making smarter decisions, but, wouldn't that make the game even more difficult, even unsolvable?
Proposal: let tougher difficulties have the AI receive even more bonuses or have the player receive some penalties, like max. movement, number of XP gained etc.
NO. A strategy game should have a good AI. It is basically the most important thing after multiplayer, strategic depth and balance. Playing against the computer (in a skirmish map, scenarios are another case of course) should feel like playing against a human opponent. Adding bonuses completely changes the game and makes multiplayer too different from single player (different strategies will dominate in the two game modes). One of my favourite games, Civ5 has a terrible AI and just adds bonuses (penalties for the player) after the "normal" difficulty level. It basically forces a certain kind of playstyle which really hurts the playability (and it feels "unfair" that other players can use strategies that I can't because I get more penalties). So, as a result, after I play a game of Civ5, I get bored of it for the next month or so.
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* actual factions. I feel it is getting boring to have a normed faction, like sprites belong to Sylvan, angels to Haven, black dragons to Dungeon etc. Even adding new creatures won't change much, and such attempts have been mostly rejected (like that votes for line-ups).
Proposal: make different factions and mix creatures (e.g. humans with elves, demons with undead, mages and dwarves etc.)
What I always wanted was a system where factions had their default "faction units" (basically all "intelligent" creatures living in a society) and then additional neutral/natural creatures that depend on the geography of the town (e.g., in forests you can recruit unicorns, no matter wat faction you are). This way, you can have a strong sense of a faction while still having a nice blend of mythological beasts at the same time. Plus more variety.
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