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| Thread: Random M-sized maps - are they good enuff for TOH ?!? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted July 20, 2002 02:45 AM |
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my short answer
-I played Lone Chinchilla once, when expansion came out, we played a random medium. He suprised attacked me and beat me on week 1 day 4 from a portal.
-I reported my loss.
-Even though random mediums may be fast games, the risk of losing is the same for both parties.
-Random Medium will not be banned from ToH, nor any other medium maps.
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Lews_Therin
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 02:46 AM |
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I do not doubt that Andi is good at the Heroes3 game, but he certainly isnīt at logical thinking and coherently arguing in general.
A good player blah - everyone plays the way he or she likes, Iīve seen good players picking and bad players going all random often enough. Personally I myself usually prefer random heroes&towns, too.
Back to the discussion, whether he picks towns or plays them random doesnīt matter much if he is fixed on choosing a might hero as main, calls magic heroes inferior and at the same time supports rules to limit their usefulness.
Now you Motor, someone who doesnīt play randoms and fights for first rank in ToH, start a thread with the intention of prohibiting random mediums.
Both of you, itīs perfectly okay that you support your own interests, but IMO the way you are trying to wrap some morality and good-for-all-and-the-game-itself around it, you are embarassing yourself. You are ambitious, you want to win your games, and you want to achieve or defend first place in ToH. On that ground we could begin to seriously argue whether or not itīs sensible to allow random mediums in ToH games.
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midnight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 03:16 AM |
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random med is not a problem.
an experienced player will not use them to rort the ladder cuz the luck element is too large and restarts too many. But they shouldnt be banned just cuz veterans dont like them, newbies will like random med cuz noone has memorised the map (remember how we all lost on Battlemania the first time) and more importantly they will meet by week 6 
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andiangelsla...
Disgraceful
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 03:22 AM |
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therin therin...even you should understand that banning some stuff isnt to make magic heroes weaker but to increase the playability...you cant tell me winning with DD or arma makes for great fun, i dont buy that. if someone DDs into my not outbought town the game was kinda for nothing, or if someone has drags or efreets, splits em into tiny stacks after checking for shakles or cloak, and than burns me... thats all that is to say.
you always assume i hate those stuff coz i fear it, thats total crap, i dont enjoy it when its used, neiter by me or opponent, god thx most understand that...
and if i play randoms i play with red orb in, but also with tomes, only dd and fly are excluded coz those spells are just a huge toss...
about magic heroes, coz i play a might hero it doesnt mean i ignore magic, they get better skills, that is what matters, and dont need to run to a well each day after heavy fights...
and the main point is: trying to win the game with a magic hero planning only hit and runs with a strong spell is just no fun, heroes should be fighting, not clicking 1 button and running, that is no skill, im laughing about guys that tell me its a strategy that needs loads of thinking...i tell you what it is: i try to upgrade to the fastest unit as soon as possible and hope for a strong spell, rest of army doesnt bother me, if i dont get the spell i keep running around avoiding opponent until i get it, or until evenmy bolt was enough to smack him up...zzzzzzzz....
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Motorschaaf
Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 03:45 AM |
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Quote:
A good player blah - everyone plays the way he or she likes, Iīve seen good players picking and bad players going all random often enough. Personally I myself usually prefer random heroes&towns, too.
a player who is only skilled with one town/hero sucks bad - niothin more to say i think 
Quote:
Now you Motor, someone who doesnīt play randoms and fights for first rank in ToH, start a thread with the intention of prohibiting random mediums.
u can stick that comment where the sun don't shines therin . if im in first place - or last place in TOH . i post my opinion here whenever i want to. i hated randoms when i bought the arma blade expansion from the first day.
so and now u tell me what that has to do with my rank.
nothing !
i just wondered myslef why s maps are forbidden and why the similar m random maps not - thats it. and even u mr. therin should c that i am not the only one who thinks that way.....
Quote:
Both of you, itīs perfectly okay that you support your own interests, but IMO the way you are trying to wrap some morality and good-for-all-and-the-game-itself around it, you are embarassing yourself.
ánd which of my statements exactly u mean mr. "iamwiseas1000oldmanswithlongbeards" ?
Motorschaaf
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 03:53 AM |
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Here is an objective view since I dun even play heroes anymore
A majority of the time random medium maps end fast, but so do a few select fixed medium maps. But system has been going for years literally, so no need to change it really.
If you are worried about point hungry players who will just play for quick wins, then realize no matter what rules exist you couldnt stop them no matter what rules, since its very easy to hide it.
and here is something very ironic I have been thinking about... If so many love randoms and new exploration, how come so many were afraid to try new maps? I figure its just paranoia that the other person secretly has it memorized.. cause when B@stards did Uncharted Land tourney, which was matchin people on brand new never before seen custom maps, there was great fun.
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midnight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 03:53 AM |
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geeze, i make a sensible response and everyone ignores it and wants to flame each other instead I guess the thread topics are just conversation starters until a nice hot flaming match gets going
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Lews_Therin
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 04:22 AM |
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Motor and Andi, you didnīt get my point. It doesnīt matter at all what I believe from what you write or not. Simple fact is that those convictions of yours about what is fun and good for the game and good for the tournament and good for all of us everytime coincide with whatīs to your own advantage, regarding points and ratings.
What would you think if Frank or Tim554 made a thread with the intention of banning time limits below 8 minutes from ToH? And argue that games below are no fun, no skill, just fast-clicking?
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Patrel
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 05:13 AM |
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I like Med Random, because I can actually finish a game in one sitting. I've never played a game of Heroes thats lasted more than 4 hours, and I hope I never do. I personally just don't enjoy extremely long games.
But I understand that some people like to have those 5+ hour games, so to each his own. So I don't think they should be banned just because they don't take as long to play as Random L or XL
As for people claiming that players play Random M to rack up points:
What's the difference between a player doing that, or having to play the same player's that have been playing the same maps for years, and have them memorized. They get easy points just the same. At least on Random, both players (new and old) at least a have a chance.
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It's beer-o-clock, where the hell's my riot?! - John Crichton
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midnight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 05:21 AM |
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yeah jb, new maps can be fun too, before i played randoms i had a few players that i knew well and we played almost all the maps toh had on offer once only. The style of play is quite different, i would look for patterns on the map to try and work out what the map maker was thinking. Trouble is i ran out of maps.
What would be very cool is to be able to feed new templates into the random generator. Maybe Destro can help with this one...
btw Rych, Des, Andi, Tim etc. I come back online for gaming in about 4 weeks. until then i work like a slave
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted July 20, 2002 08:11 AM |
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*************************************************************************************
DARN!!! Ves said he NOT gonna ban all the Medium FIXED maps. I was hoping for a new generation of Large & Extra Large TOH maps. hehe
Just a silly question though Ves....... if its okay to win and Lose games on day 4. Why were small maps banned? Just curious.
Blind Map tourny was Best tourny I every participated in. ( Besides Divisions ) I hope there is another one soon!
Jinxer
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midnight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 08:51 AM |
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Quote:
DARN!!! Ves said he NOT gonna ban all the Medium FIXED maps. I was hoping for a new generation of Large & Extra Large TOH maps. hehe
Just a silly question though Ves....... if its okay to win and Lose games on day 4. Why were small maps banned? Just curious.
Jinxer
I reckon i can answer that one. You cant use Random Med as a strategy to rack up lots of points. One game you will jump through a 2 way door and take his town day 3. Next game your opponent will get the box with 50 marksmen in it on day 4 and find your town on day 6. It will give a weaker player quite a large chance of winning, unlike on a fixed map where the weaker player will always lose. Hence why to this date it hasnt been a problem in the ladder. As in earlier post, it isnt the sort of game veterans would play cuz of the massive luck factor, and the non-vets can still enjoy it in a slower paced game.
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted July 20, 2002 09:42 AM |
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How bout people just play what they like and stop worrying about what other's like to play?
Is that too radical a concept?
-Mocara
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted July 20, 2002 10:54 AM |
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Motorschaaf
Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 12:28 PM |
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Quote:
Motor and Andi, you didnīt get my point.
no, because ur posts sont seem to have one...
Quote:
Simple fact is that those convictions of yours about what is fun and good for the game and good for the tournament and good for all of us everytime coincide with whatīs to your own advantage, regarding points and ratings.
hmm who are u that u think u know that ?
u ever played me ?? NO
u ever played andi NO
man i play all rules - setting as long its not that dumb hero/town pick. there wasnt one game this season in toh when i insisted on a rule.sure , that i prefer rules specially when playing my buddys , BUT i prefer no rules specially when i play players i never played before because i had a lot rule disputes in the past.
i decide for me what a fun game is and so you do for yourself - but whats wrong with that ? we all wanna have fun playin.u for example dont have fun playing fixed maps - did i ever attack ya for playing only randoms ??? NO !!
so and now i ask ya to go back to my first post and read it again !!! i asked for opinions of random-expertz about my thought, because i was wandering why s maps are forbidden and random m are not. (there was a guy in zone with "s map or random medium only for toh").
also mr. therin i ask you to read the posts of stiven, jinxer and destro again. so u say they all wanna ban random mediums because of point hugging or because the wanna force others to play only what they like ? man first think - than post.
and please mr. therin i would like to hear YOUR explanation why S maps are banned. what about players that love s maps ? are they not discriminated by that toh rule ??....
Motorschaaf
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted July 20, 2002 03:36 PM |
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Wohoooo!!! :D
Random Lovers WIN!!
EXTRA! EXTRA! Motor suggestion turned down! Read all about it!
Special edition:
Motorschaafs suggestion about Random Medium maps being banned has been turned down. Some supported it, some were against it. Some thought he wanted to stop people from getting fast points so they could catch up with him, some thought that he was in it for the greater good and just wanted whatīs best for us all really.
During the discussion, the suggestion arose that fixed Medium maps like DW are the best and fastest ways to beat noobs and get easy points. The player who knows it better often wins, and itīs still a fast game. On randoms of M size the luck element is larger so its risky to play noobs. So if you wanna cherry hunt, you should pick a fast fixed M map for best results.
Anyway, with the suggestion turned down, the flames continue for a while but might die down soon when some people are finished telling it the way it is and some ppl have denied the obvious enough times.
So what will this reporter do when itīs all over? The answer is simple. I will go play as many random mediums I can, to persue my newfound freedom of choice. And if Iīm really really lucky, I might even pass Motorshaaf
Anyone for Random?
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I am the hope of the universe... I am the answer to all living things that cry out for peace... I am protector of the innocent... I am the light in the darkness... I am truth.
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 04:00 PM |
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Quote:
Blind Map tourny was Best tourny I every participated in. ( Besides Divisions ) I hope there is another one soon!
I doubt u see 1 for heroes 3 again, since its so much work, and not many make new maps anymore. for 16 players bracketed, u need atleast 15 maps made. I sorta miss makin maps..but not that bad Altho I plan to revamp many of my older maps for the heck of it in my spare time. Will any of em be played as if they are new maps? maybe, but doin it for the fun of it mostly.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted July 20, 2002 07:15 PM |
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@ Jb239
Any maps you revamp or that you make new. Can you please change the playability style??!! No more week3 rush maps. Make some Large maps. Make all guards on maps alot tuffer. i.e. put level 5 guards on mines. etc. So that the level 7 dwelling is not always guarenteed week 1
If its CLOSED style dont make a HUGE reward middle section. All that does is reward speed and race to middle wins. Basically the whole concepts of FIXED maps need a fresh outlook.
I always wanted to see if the map was closed that in order to beat the guards early you would take a noticable army loss. IF you can beat ANY guard that is serving as a Closed block with NO losses. Then they were not big enough lol.
Basically there should be some price for trying to do suprise week3 rush attack. Just some thoughts for new outlook on maps design.
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted July 20, 2002 10:04 PM |
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Sure Jinxer.. Point in editing most of these maps were. 1) no one played them, so no one would miss the old map and 2) I could do any type changes I wanted, whether very drastic or not, because basically nothing worse can happen than anyone still not playing them
but all maps are medium..Im not gonna create any from scratch since it takes too long to do, esp for a game I dont really play lol
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freakmebaby
Known Hero
Rude by nature
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posted July 21, 2002 01:59 AM |
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thank you ves
and i say lets close this tread .
p.s - dont need 2 answer but did any of u ever see andi or motor not agree about something? 
"motor"- oh andi is a gr-8 player
"andi" - motor 1 of the best players
ok we know ur both gr-8 players u dont have 2 complmnet eatch other ALL the time.
p.s.s u both r very good player
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Freak.
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