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| Thread: Debates over a new homm3 Tourney & My Role |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · NEXT» |
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted June 25, 2003 04:56 AM |
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Debates over a new homm3 Tourney & My Role
More recently, my free time has increased, as most of my side projects are in full steam and self-sufficient now.
Anyways to the point. There seems to be a lot of talk back and forth for clans/lands/core tourney etc.
I am usually on the homm3 side posting in humor or making minor suggestions, but I can step in temporarily for Mandi & Ravyn, if they wish, to solidify a completely new homm3 Clans, with all its intricacies & foundations set, with the rules and bonuses discussed in an open forum.... here.
Homm4 Clans has been flawless in my opinion, just weak on activity, when you only have about 20 active players... in homm3 ToH you would have more and an even stronger clan tournament.
A new look, with a revised system of Homm4 Clans of Axeoth, being the core of ToH tourns (like in homm4 right now) could be solid.
Once the whole thing is up and running, then the admins of homm3 ToH take over, and I go back to my business.
I just know the potential here, and it needs to be put together cohesively with a solid foundation.
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splexx
Known Hero
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posted June 25, 2003 06:02 AM |
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hmmm...
I could rub it in.....but i won't 
these tournies are for u fixed map dudes..
Damn Ves..u don't get it..
the saviour of H3 is pretty much the randoms..and discovery of the rmg file and how it can be manipulated...
so another zzzzzzzz ill beat u on zzzzzzz fixed map is doomed...
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Azif..
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Kittenangel
Supreme Hero
Lee's wifey
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posted June 25, 2003 07:01 AM |
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Ves to me it sounds like a good idea...... Everyone is wanting to see clans but no one is willing to offer raven any input. No offence to anyone but something has got to be done. I would try and help with clans but I do not know the first thing about them or even what to do I haven't even played a clan game! My best thing I know how to do is the graphics design LOL
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Never wear anything that panics
the cat.
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted June 25, 2003 07:21 AM |
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Quote:
I could rub it in.....but i won't
these tournies are for u fixed map dudes..
Damn Ves..u don't get it..
the saviour of H3 is pretty much the randoms..and discovery of the rmg file and how it can be manipulated...
Damn Splexx..u don't get it...
Where does it say it has to be fixed maps? Anyways, before you were born Splexx, I used to prefer homm2 and homm3 random maps with my hot seat friends. The fixed map thing came later with the hardcore ToH'ers.
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tewilligar
Famous Hero
Just another willigar
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posted June 25, 2003 08:27 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
I could rub it in.....but i won't
these tournies are for u fixed map dudes..
Damn Ves..u don't get it..
the saviour of H3 is pretty much the randoms..and discovery of the rmg file and how it can be manipulated...
Damn Splexx..u don't get it...
Where does it say it has to be fixed maps? Anyways, before you were born Splexx, I used to prefer homm2 and homm3 random maps with my hot seat friends. The fixed map thing came later with the hardcore ToH'ers.
in laymans terms splexx,vesuvius was jerking off long before you even discovered homm 
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ZZZZzzzzZZZZzzzz
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rychenroller
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted June 25, 2003 08:30 AM |
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I would help with any tourney if I might be needed...we just have to decide which one, clans or LoC. LoC is more my type of tourney but maybe players prefer clans because more groundword has been done.
Certain ideas I like about LoC...certain maps for every type of land (ie. rych and midnight have land x base as extreme random, kuma and vinz have land y base as blockbuster random, irnwill and pax have land z base as gw...just for some examples) Play players on their home turf to try and take their land. Rechallenges, hero decisions etc makes for a nice interactive tourney. Teams of 2 has rarely been done (if ever) As midnight said in another thread...non committed players will be ousted quickly if they have no desire to play...leaving the ones who really want to support the tourney. It has the potential to become quite a dynamic tourney, whereas clans to me is just....clans? All done before and I think we need originality.
Ves, clans has been a staple for homm ever since its inception but realistically, heroes3 isnt overly active and I think we need something fresh and new (and well run!) I would support any tourney Mandi and Ravyn decide to progress with, but I think we need something a bit newer.
Just my opinion.
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Myctteakyshd
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted June 25, 2003 10:42 AM |
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My concern is this: If a land based tourney is with fixed lands, expect it to be a short-term tourney that does not cover a whole season. Whenever you limit choices, it reduces the long term success of a tournament, I guarantee it.
With the ability to choose what map you play in your mutual setup with your clan opponents, there is never a limitation, and therefore more flexibility in the clans system.
Sorry for the cliche, but 'been there done that'... if you want a core tourney that is the main focus of the season, you need something more open to choice, one simple limitation, that is -- listen to your clan leader.
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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted June 25, 2003 12:39 PM |
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I wouldnt mind seeing Ves doing this clan tourney.
If nothing else i believe him to have the knowledge and experience to know what it takes to get a good TOH season going.
Quote:
Ves to me it sounds like a good idea...... Everyone is wanting to see clans but no one is willing to offer raven any input.
I dont see why you as a admin cut the players this short.
Sure, the inputs could have been more but saying that no one is offering any held is plain out stupid.
Because i know that some people are really trying and if you then say that no one cares its not...very encouraging.
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SapphireRavyn
Promising
Famous Hero
Bird of Extreme Patience
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posted June 25, 2003 09:18 PM |
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I found players input on the rules to be VERY helpful and am VERY much appreciative. I think we have a pretty good system worked out. Thank you players!!
A big part of the reason I didn't go with a land based integrated system like you did for Homm4 Ves, is there were still people that were hoping for a straight Divisions season and I didn't want to pull the stuff from Divisions. When you set up your Homm4 Clans you already knew you weren't going to run a regular Divisions season, so you set it up accordingly. I was not and am not sure that we won't end up doing a Divisions, if we can get some activity going, and don't want to mess it up.
I have asked you several times for input, and would still love to have some. In fact, I even asked for the old HOmm3 clan pages to look at, but you don't have them anymore, and pointed me to the Homm4 pages. I admit that I don't really have the skill to do the balancing, that's why I have looked for good solid input. But using the Homm4 pages doesn't really work the greatest because they are two different games with different dynamics. I don't really want to scrap my whole system and put the 20+ hours I have into it to waste. I would more then welcome some help balancing upgrades and doing artifacts though.
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It's not who wins or losses that matters, it's how you play the game. Honor before all else!
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted June 25, 2003 11:12 PM |
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LOC would be pretty short termed compared to Clans basically I dont see the problem with starting the season with LOC & then opening up Clans.
It also gives us more time to work on some of the important parts of clans we all been straying on.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Xarfax111
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
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posted June 25, 2003 11:13 PM |
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...im not really a "fan" a ves...but as i already said before: He has everything to run a nice subtourney like clans. Let him make the HPs, bonuses and rules an stuff and it will works nice.
Its not time to discuss which ones baby it will be, its time to get cool clans started and with Ves experience of 3 running clan seasons it will be easy to make it a success.
Please accept his offer.
Xarfax1
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SapphireRavyn
Promising
Famous Hero
Bird of Extreme Patience
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posted June 25, 2003 11:15 PM |
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Quote:
I say run Ves's clans since we know it will work and will be a very long and addictive tourney. No offence to you Ravyn but Ves created it all so he has the skill and knowledge to set it up. And if his clans runs no need for the other tourney divisions. So I say run his which is popular and all buggs worked out. Now we just need the decision of Kitten and Chubby and players on which to Run. Your opinion is run yours with Ves's help, Mine is Run Ves's and we just need the other 2 Admins to vote and see what players want.
Ves doesn't have the pages for his original clans Gan, so he would be resetting them up, from scratch. His clans are currently set up for Homm4 not Homm3. A lot of players WANT a seperate clans and divisions, not the hybrid of the two. And it's never been ran for Homm3 so how can you state that it is popular and that all the bugs are worked out when it's never been ran? My opinion is of course to run mine, I don't want to waste the millenium of hours I've spent on it. BUT, if the players would rather Ves came back and ran everything and he's willing to do so then so be it. And for the record, this is not really an Admin vote issue. We aren't supposed to be running things as little dictators, do it my way or else, we are supposed to be listening to players. And any Admin decisions are between Kitten, Chubby and I with the additional input of Ves, who is site owner.
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It's not who wins or losses that matters, it's how you play the game. Honor before all else!
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Xarfax111
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
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posted June 25, 2003 11:44 PM |
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You really think there is enough activity to make clan AND divisions?
In my opinion there is even not enough activity to run only divisions... and if time goes on with only talking and no decision there wont be even enough left to even run clans!!
I dont understand why u ask for help and when Vesusvius gives u the best help u can ever get why u do not want it??
Why not run a proven sub tourney first??
Then u wouldve enough time to develop this promising LOC tourney and with risen activity get this also to work!!
..geez.. i really dont get it.
Xarfax1
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Hexa
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted June 25, 2003 11:57 PM |
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Just iron out the last few items .. with Ves or Xar or anybody's help and lets get this show on the road!@
End current season end of July.
Start clans right away ,,, based on vet icons (form a small comitte for that) and lets have a JOLLY season.
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If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@
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Kittenangel
Supreme Hero
Lee's wifey
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posted June 26, 2003 12:24 AM |
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1: The season will NOT end until Aug 23rd so Raven and I have time to get everything situated we need done.
2: I do not think MaH will ever be active enough for a successful Divisions to run
3: I would like to see Old toh clans with a new twist which Ves is good at doing. I am not saying I want to see H4 clans on MaH side I want to see our own unique H3 clans.
4: Players have put some nice input into rules.
5: Me, Raven and Chubby will have to decide which tournaments will start first.
6: I spoke to jb and we will be getting some new refreshing maps for MaH, even a few new ones for LoC.
7: Also spoke to JB and have been thinking about bring the classic Battlefest back for the new season.
8: I think thats all LOL OK so it isn't all Edited 7:12pm
I have been thinking you know you guys are right, we have to do this as a team. So I am gonna offer my help with some clan graphics. Here is the first thing I made, it is a clan list image. 
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Never wear anything that panics
the cat.
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted June 26, 2003 01:23 AM |
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sh--t I had typed a page worth of info and lost it when i pressed the back key. 
Well I dont feel like typing it all again, but the gist was that I am good to go once everyone has given me the go-ahead. Then I will start working on the plan immediately. But only if everyone accepts and gives the OK.
Once the whole setup is done, there will be 7-8 philos, with about 5 clan slots in each. Unique clan specialties system that was started in h4 clans will also be there. So in total there will be about 40 unique clan slots, though I expect with current activity at best half of them will fill up.
The land will be what is used for homm4, as it is 70 lands, and created from scratch which cost me megadragon hours to do.
Once everything is done, with a new userfriendly look, the bonuses, upgrades & specialties will then be discussed on the message board, and perfected with community input by the time the new season arrives.
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Kittenangel
Supreme Hero
Lee's wifey
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posted June 26, 2003 01:25 AM |
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you got the all clear from me....and Gan too
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Never wear anything that panics
the cat.
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Maximus
Famous Hero
Bronzed God
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posted June 26, 2003 05:29 AM |
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hmm, well i just dun the same as ves, lose a whole page of stuff i just typed and to lazy to do it all again :\
but think the h4 clans looks pretty good but maybe drag in some ideas from the LoC that have been discussed so far.
would like to see the "lands" maybe have a map class type, ie land X is a Closed Map (then players choice) or land Y is a Random Map, land Z Open Map etc, duno if thats possible.
think the bonus levels need some looking at tho, it seems that at best so far in h4, only lvl 2 has been reached. think 32 lands (i think) is to much for lvl 5. as it stands it something like 2,4,8,16,32 outta a total of 70 lands. maybe have only 4 lvl's of bouns so 16 lands required for top lvl, or make 2,4,8,12,20 for 5 lvl. either way, gives the chance of maybe 4 clans to reach top lvl bouns's instead of maybe 2.
is hard for me to fully know what to say about clans as i have no clans experience, but think when new MaH season begins, clans should start asap. if needed then use pre-season rankings or council to decide clan leaders with maybe just 2 wks at start of season for players to get organized and to recruit etc.
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Frost. Sometimes it makes the blade stick !
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rychenroller
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted June 26, 2003 07:32 AM |
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What about Ravyns work? Disregarding all that after she has put a mountain of work into it? Seems pretty easy to brush that off and embrace Ves' version...but what about Ravyns version? looked fine to me.
From an outsiders view...ToH/MaH seems to be going split ways again...with LoC and clans conflicting. Ravyn had been working on clans for quite a while and had posted several threads to get players feedback, then Mandi decides on a lands tourney and I agreed to help, although I didnt realize Ravyn knew nothing about it. Its quite obvious that 2 team based tourneys cant be run at the same time with this level of activity. You guys need to put a bit more effort into TEAMWORK and think things through before committing to it, or getting other people who offer some input excited about things you wont even run.
I'm happy to support whatever tourney you run, but talk about it first, then release your ideas to the players and take their feedback, not vice versa.
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Myctteakyshd
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted June 26, 2003 07:49 AM |
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I dont want to infringe on Ravyn's clans, and if there is any sort of 'pressure' in replacing her clans, I will simply withdraw from doing the clan thing... even if one major player or admin is unhappy about my involvement, I will not bother.
I have been, however, sitting back for six months watching the progress of these mini-tourneys and the clan idea in homm3, making the promise that I would not interfere.
But now being an observer for so long, seeing no conclusion to a core season tourny, still no final resolution, and the momentum I see left in Homm3 ToH activity must be applied before it fizzles out.
All in all though, its always easier for me not to bother, because then I have less work to do...its simply an application of my free time that could be used elsewhere. But if I was inherently lazy, there would have been no ToH in the first place.
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