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| Thread: Bi Sexual People |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Peacemaker
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posted October 18, 2003 10:18 PM |
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Who's more sensual???
Milena --
LOL!!!
I sat here reading your post, nodding all the way through -- until I got to the part about women's bodies being more sensual than men's.
Frankly I can't think of anythimg more sensual than a man's body, particuarly one encasing an individual to whom I am emotionally attracted. To me, women's bodies are just pretty, like works of art. Men's bodies -- how they work, look, respond etc. -- on the other hand are, for me, an object of utter sexual obsession. The instant a woman's body becomes sexually attractive to me is, in fact, the moment she begins responding to the sexual overtures of a man...????
<AHEM... (tries to compose herself)>
I guess I'm even less bisexually oriented than I might have thought (which returns us to your earlier psychological observations about socialization???)
Okay. So now there's another question your post raises.
Why can women dress drag at will (Like I can war a man's tie on a suit any time I want to, and even have a couple of men's cut suits) but men who crossdress must do so in such secret???
Consider the sexy commercial snaps with a woman wearing her mate's tailored shirt (and nothing underneath) -- Why is it that this is so acceptable to be seen stamped on the side of a passing bus, but not the image of a guy in his woman's teddy???
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Lady_Milena
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Grannie Sweet Cheeks
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posted October 18, 2003 11:01 PM |
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It has been known that women have more erogene zones than men, that is, more of them spread more regularly over the body. No, it's not myths, it's the truth. A woman can achieve orgasm by petting, stroking, even a deep French kiss, while a man's ultimate way to get an orgasm is rubbing the phallus. Be it masturbation, oral sex or normal sex (or any other kind that your imagination would take you). I'm not saying a man cannot be sensual. Duh, men can be very sensual, especially the more skilled and gentle of them.
This is why while most women are happy with petting, caressing and intense "foreplay", men prefer sex. Yet again, I'm talking about the general case, okay. There are women who would not get sated by anything but sex and men who enjoy simple petting more than his partner would.
That's what I was implying anyway. Don't know what you think about it.
As for clothing, it's something very simple (and no, I had to learn all about clothes and the psychology of customers who buy them).
Women put on pants in the beginning of the previous century for a few reasons. After the WW1 and especially after WW2 women's position in society rose as a lot of men died and women had to take care of business. It was making a point. See phrases like "Chasing skirts" or "who wears the pants at home". While the skirt or the dress was labelled as something truly feminine, the pants were a symbol of masculinity.
See what happens. For centuries, millennia, men were the religious, political and actual leaders of society. They had a specific way of carrying themselves and appearance, come on, appearance is the first thing that strikes a person when they see another. So, the way I take it, women put on pants as a token of rebellion, how do you call it, emancipation. That was to prove the point they could be as strong and presentative as men. While, truth to be told, dresses were symbol of female fraility and weakness. I'm not going to start on the religious basis of this all because there's no point to waste pages and pages and quote the Bible. ANd men never took a point in presenting themselves in symbols of fraility and weakness. While women needed to present themselves visually as poweful and dominant.
Then fashion kicked in and it all went overboard.
Of course, I could go on elaborating on it. A few pages more to read. Anyone? *ducks*
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Khaelo
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posted October 18, 2003 11:13 PM |
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Edited By: Khaelo on 18 Oct 2003
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I think that a lot of what you describe in the first part of your [first]post [on this page], Milena, is culturally determined.
In ancient Greece (Athens in particular), there was an equally culturally determined paradigm which involved an older man courting a youth. It was a social ritual like any other. The roles were clearly delineated, certain kinds of sexual touching were encouraged while others were proscribed, and specific exchanges were expected from both partners. The older man was supposed to guide, teach, and mentor the youth into the adult world of the polis, while the youth offered his beauty and sexual availablity to his elder. Once the youth's beard grew in, the relationship ended, the older man moved on to marry and the youth to find his own "mentee." It was not homosexuality/bisexuality as we understand those terms today, and it doesn't really fit into the modern paradigm of intimacy described in Milena's post.
Uhmmm...I lost my point. I think it was a basic objection to the social interactions described above as being female or male in particular.
[Edit added]: Regarding "drag:" The above regarding Greeks is from my background as a Classics Major. The below regarding gender is from rampant speculation. Be warned. 
I think it's about power. Things that were once exclusively male are becoming unisex in our increasingly egalatarian society. It's not just clothes; names that were formerly male (Ashley, Jamie, Brett, ect) are being co-opted by females, whereas males are not taking on formerly female names and in fact tend to abandon names that have become feminized. Women want what has power, and that is the stuff men have. Because of changing attitudes, most people accept this -- women can do anything, women empowered, and all that other feminist rhetoric. The reverse, however, has not happened. While women are granted freedom to do what we want and defy gender roles, men's gender roles remain pretty stuck. The movement to liberate men to move into what was previously "inferior" territory -- women's clothing, women's names, women's jobs -- is still in its infancy because most men, quite reasonably, don't want to move down. Everyone can understand why women want to move "up" to men's things; it seems odd that a man would want to move "down" into women's things.
Basically, women can do drag and men can't because our society is still sexist and still considers men's territory superior. Kind of ironic, huh?
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Romana
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Thx :D
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posted October 18, 2003 11:13 PM |
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Quote:
It has been known that women have more erogene zones than men, that is, more of them spread more regularly over the body. No, it's not myths, it's the truth. A woman can achieve orgasm by petting, stroking, even a deep French kiss, while a man's ultimate way to get an orgasm is rubbing the phallus
I doubt that's the truth. Men like carressing also and having an orgasm isn't the same as ejaculating.
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Lady_Milena
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Grannie Sweet Cheeks
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posted October 18, 2003 11:22 PM |
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Well, let me remind you that we're talking about the sexuality of modern times, no? Take the stuff from Kama sutra. So explicit.
As for you, Romy, why don't you post what you told me in PM? Honestly, it cracked me up. You're soooooo cool.
But you're so different from most women who I know. :-)
P.S. I don't think I should post here any more (I opened the worms can, now you clean the mess :-P ). So I go on lurker mode. You girls -and guys- at each other
*Milena reserved wink*
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Romana
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Thx :D
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posted October 18, 2003 11:40 PM |
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uhmm..No i am not gonna post that LMAO *turns really red*
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Peacemaker
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posted October 18, 2003 11:41 PM |
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Yes, Romy shared the same little "tidbit" as it were with me as well. And I must say I second the "motion.."
So common Romy, spit it out!!!!
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Khaelo
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posted October 19, 2003 12:02 AM |
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Well, I'm not even close to an expert on modern time, so I talked about what I know (a little). Sorry if it was irrelevant.
Oh! You know what it is that's bugging me? The first assumption!
Quote:
Okay, now back to the question, why is girl-on-girl a turn on for people and man-on-man a turn off?
Man-on-man isn't a turn off for me. Actually, I think it's cute when guys hold hands or hug in public. I don't find the mental imagery of more intimate expressions unpleasant, either. The expression of love between people is almost always beautiful to me. There's a picture around here somewhere, of an androgynous angel and demon embracing, which I find extremely beautiful and sensual. The genders of the parties involved in unknown and unimportant; it's the clear portrayal of emotional intimacy that is so attractive.
I'd always assumed that the reason lesbian porn was so popular among straight guys was that there was twice as much female action with no interfering guys, who would be a turn-off for said straight audience. Male-male images, on the other hand, have no interesting action and perhaps hit a bit too close to home.
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Peacemaker
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posted October 19, 2003 12:29 AM |
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Khaelo, I find your post most intriguing, and perhaps right on point.
First, when I was in the Soviet Union (in the 1980's before it became Russia proper again) I noticed something in stark contrast to the way that men in the US behave. They (men) will hug, kiss on both cheeks and lips, and even wrap their arms around one another while walking down the street (something you'd NEVER see here in the US). My general experience in the Soviet Union was that men in general, as well as women, behaved more openly, I might go so far as to say, like Tribals here in the US, except for Tribals here who have been urbanized and thus "acculturated" into thinking something is wrong with expressing affection to the same sex.
I think that Western culture in general (the globally dominating culture of Euro-Westernization) has had a hand in the overly-exaggerated maleness of our menfolk. As I have said in many posts in the past, people from other cultures (i.e. the Occident) perceive us as too "yang" in the yin-yang scheme of things.
The complexities of this mindset inflict virtually every aspect of our thinking here in the West to an extent that I think most are completely unaware of. I, like you, do not find it particularly offensive to see men being sexual with men. It is refreshing, though not a particular turn-on or turn-off (just like seeing two women for me), to see men allowing themselves that liberty.
So now the question turns to this issue: How sexually repressed are we REALLY here in the West, given the entire legacy of our overly-patriarchal culture, and how much does that affect our perceptions of what is okay with us and what is not?????? We like to think of ourselves as liberated in every sense. As a person with one foot in two cultures, I can readily identify multiple aspects of the dominant culture in which that is not the case, but there is no more telling one than this.
The reason I know this was not a product of bisexuality or homosexuality is because we talked about it with our friends when we were there in the Soviet Union. Our friends would exhibit an effusive amount of physical affection on the men in our group, which is what started up the conversation to begin with. The answer was, no, they don't do that because they are sexually attracted, but because it is simply something they have always done there, like what the hell are you talking about??? What's wrong with that?
I think our men have been so socialized to be anti whatever, that they are repressed in this way. Perhaps if they were not, and perhaps in turn if we women were not, then those of us (both men and women) would not experience the difference in our reactions to seeing two men together than seeing two women together.
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Aculias
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posted October 19, 2003 11:02 AM |
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Oh come on K no one wants to see a bunch of dudes doing sword fights & putts making hole in ones  .
With our anatomy theres special places & ways to make both sexes have an orgasm.
Some like certain areas of sex more then others & thats how they get off.
Hmm almost seems a judgemental argument on women & men AGAIN.
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Shepicker
Hired Hero
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posted October 19, 2003 08:48 PM |
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I just do not see the point of this mail. Your sexual orientation is your busines. You know just as well as I do that society says if it is good or bad. If we do happen to live in the same country and had the same culture than my opinion matters. If we do not live in the same country or share the same cultural enviroment then this thread is pointless.There are cultures that tolerate it and cultures who do not so tell me where you come from and i may tell you my opinion. Personally it seems to me that you are seeking atention cause if you are truly bi it is in your genes it is not your choice and if you do have control over it you are just selfindulgent.No society I know of promotes bisexualism, they just tolerate it because it is something regarding a minority. It is like me asking if being born romanian is good or bad just because I live in somewhere else than my homeland and represent a minority there.Awaiting your reply...
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Peacemaker
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posted October 19, 2003 10:02 PM |
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Shepicker, with all due respect, you seem to be suggesting we shouldn't even be having this discussion.
While I can understand posts expressioing negative feelings about bisexuality (after all that was the original question set forth here,) I cannot understand why you would be suggesting we shouldn't even be talking about it.
Many of us enjoy discussing our processes of self-discovery with one another, including bisexuality, whether or not we have conlcuded we fit into that category.
If you do not, then go find another thread that you enjoy.
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Aculias
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posted October 19, 2003 10:51 PM |
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There are no other threads because the kids between 1-13 yr olds have tooken them over.
As you can see theres none on this topic 
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Dingo
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posted October 20, 2003 04:09 AM |
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What is HC coming to?
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Khaelo
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posted October 22, 2003 04:43 AM |
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Edited By: Khaelo on 21 Oct 2003
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okay, I'm pretty mad right now!
First the same-sex marriage thread, and now this?!?
Quote:
Oh come on K no one wants to see a bunch of dudes doing sword fights & putts making hole in ones .
I just said that such expressions of intimacy don't bother me. Am I no one? More to the point, gay porn is awfully popular for swordplay and golf to be so universally detested as spectator sports!
Quote:
We bi-sexual people are horney 24 ours a day..
So many people to love
??? This isn't universally true, either. I don't know about Milena, but I'm actually pickier and considerably less horny than most monosexuals I know. Since my attraction is primarily by personality, you'd better be *really* attractive to turn my head for looks alone.  And if you open your mouth and reveal that you've got bubble gum for brains, I'll enjoy the view for as long as you provide it, but my real interest is gooooone... 
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Aculias
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posted October 23, 2003 04:06 AM |
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Yea i mean just even thinking about it makes me want to go to the toilet lol.
I mean like watching 2 hairy apes like hair & dudes LOL.
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted October 24, 2003 09:48 AM |
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Bisexuality
So many great posts! *throws a handful of red stars*
Now my opinion.
I actually doubt whether I can be attracted to both sexes. I've been attracted to a boy when I was young, it grew from emotional attraction that we had for each other. We were both in a new country coming from similar backgrounds. I thought he was a girl! We were 13 then, so believe me, mistakes at that age are possible. He had long hair too. My english was not that good back then, and I was confused. For a few days I didn't actually believe him that he was a boy. It's very funny to remember now, when we came to my place, he introduced myself to my mother and added "and I'm a boy." LOL!!
Gradually my doubts dispelled. We started to like each other and we were very similar and had the same overseas mentality and could understand each other where others could not. At our age and at this time in local culture kids would make gay jokes by putting a hand on someone's knee to freak them out. I know I have, and many other guys use it as means of showing affection to other guys without realizing it, and not necessarily with sexual intent. Just for those who are wondering, we never had sex. We'd sometimes give each other a back rub in the park, and played tickling each other in bed. Then gradually, he started to become seriously homophobic. Even if I wanted to give him a hug, it was "gay" and "disgusting". I might have said the same things to him before, but I didn't mean it serious, and he did. I was not very skilled psychologically back then, and did not know how to stand up to double standards, and so it was that it was ok for him to show physical affection, but should I touch him, I was instantly labelled "gay" and pushed away.
The person that I loved in him I now saw less and less, until he was basically gone covered up in defences and convinced that I am some gay freak who wants to take advantage of him. So I was not allowed to show affection, neither did I get any anymore. Eventually he's turned into complete piece of snow. But I could not believe it as I ignored the crap and thought he is the person I used to know and that all this will somehow stop and we'll be happy again. When few years passed, I've learned a lot and I managed to bring him back through a conversation - it was a completely different person - it was the boy that I loved underneath all those defences. But defences strengthened, and the next morning, in a few hours, then minutes, then seconds he was gone. Then he was gone completely. Not gone, but I could not bring him out anymore. And outside was one of the most disgusting selfish people I've ever known. It took me long to realize this. But after getting hit in the face with reality again and again, for months, I finally clicked.
Very few people know this story, but now I've accepted myself and what happened, and I can speak about it freely with no shame. I think it was my first love or at least an obsession.
I find women attractive, and I don't really find men attractive. Gay men find me attractive, and at one stage I felt that I've recieved more compliments from gay men than from women. I've had a gay friend. Just friends of course. We went to swimming pool on fridays, and perhaps all the other gay guys were thinking that I was "taken", so I was safe LOL! However I really disliked physical contact from him, and got angry at his gay jokes, because he is gay, and I was repulsed by physical contact from him when I suspected intentions other than simple friendliness. He is a very interesting and intelligent person and I've learned a lot from talking to him, but there was no emotional affection from me to him.
Which brings me to my point that it is the emotional connection and open hearts that matter, and in the face of that physical gender may fade.
I find lots of porn movies disgusting, yes, the female + male ones, because they are like "**** my *****, *****", stars can be replaced with many words. There's almost hate in that sex. Machoism and complete closedheartedness.
That is why girl to girl sex is more attractive - they are a lot more open with each other, share their feelings, and it's not all about whipping some meat good. It's human, it's warm. Not always of course. And that is why guy to guy sex is repulsive, because it's percieved to be even more macho, numb, no feelings, agressive, insensitive. Personally, if I was to watch a couple of macho lesbians and a couple of men who are sensitive and open to each other, I would no doubt prefer the latter.
I prefer girls of course. But here in NZ beautiful ones are rare and for them to have personality and wisdom... dream. Completely different in Russia, they actually exist there, and that is one thing I miss. I think most of the attractive girls have things easy in life - they don't need to suffer loneliness that makes them think and appreciate.
I disagree although that men become more beautiful as they age, yuck! LOL! I think the real beauty is in your heart. How open, caring and loving you are. Without heart, a good looking body is a posession, and I think subconciously (not all) good looking girls relate to themselves as such. They also look for a guy to look good next to them. I think it's the age thing, and in ten years there will be more like minded girl peers for me, LOL
Also, whoever said that men are not sensitive and just want to get to the "point"... generalise not.
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hamsi128
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posted October 24, 2003 12:24 PM |
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Quote:
They also say only a woman truly knows how to touch a woman. As I grow older and more experienced, I see the BIG point and validy of this statement. A lot of men would very rudely perform in bed and I don't mean because they are inexperienced or uncaring. It's just that they can't perceive any more gentle would do a better trick. I remember the last guy I was with. He really -did- try hard to make me feel good. I'd always tell him to slow down and NOT THAT HARD. He would for a moment, really -really- trying hard, then, with his male nature, go on his male ways.
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Lady Milena you are really unlucky woman .. in the example you gives us you are right to think that male nature is agressive... but all men are not like this.. in your example the boy used you like meat and there is no affection and i fear you have lots of examples and sad experience like this.. but never give up .. remember the only way to produce and continue human race we need a man and woman... all other different ways are just sexuality affairs... i dont believe full affection on that bi, lesbian, gay relations... You cant have a lovely sweet child from another woman think about that
p.s. its first time i hear from you that a woman in bed telling slow down
best regards,
regularman128
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Aculias
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posted October 24, 2003 02:23 PM |
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Yea Valiery not me but I know when most are youngins they experiment with dif thangs which they dont understand whats right or if it's wrong or if there is nothing wrong with doing somethang with the same sex.
Some just experement & a phaze which goes away eventually & most probally keep it a dark secret meaning no one will know for the rest of your life.
Now about Guys finding you attractive shoot you cant help that, it happened to ma also but heh if were good looking then shoot we cant help it if everyone wants to stare right hehe.
DOnt bother me as long they dont touch me like any crazy way hehe.
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Sir_Stiven
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posted October 24, 2003 03:16 PM |
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normally i would just have stayed out of this...
but this is just too much.
I dont know about you but am i the only one getting the feeling that milena has something against men?
Which is fine btw, personally you can hate men as much as you want but then dont try and pull off comments like
"And for you, feminists. I'm for -true- equality of genders. I have do not prefer one gender over the other."
Since thats obviously is as far from the truth as you can get. Just reading your posts there is no doubt which one you prefer since you basically label the two sexes as the beauty and the beast.
Myself as a heterosexual i agree. But then im a guy and i like girls and only girls and i claim nothing else. The only man body i think is good looking is my own.
But if you feel no sexual attraction to a mans body as a girl nor feel pleased of it then maybe you are not a bisexual. The word homosexual might suit you better.
As i said in beginning i thought id just stay out of this toss to start, but then when you kept going with your hidden male insults in basically every post it just fed me up.
Because the girls i know (yes some of em are true bisexuals aswell) do feel attracted to a mans body and how it can please em...trust me
I guess i could go on a disect every post of yours for more things like this that IMO is pure lies without any general foundation as you wanna make it sound.
Like the "aggressive" males... off course there are more aggressive males due to testosteron. But there are still aggressive girls aswell.
Like in bed when you wanna make it sound like girls are more into making love and enjoying the foreplay more and so on. I can assure you that many of the girls ive "met" hasnt shared this view of yours and is about as straight forward and "aggressive" as i am when it comes to having wild sex. Some of them didnt even care one second for any kind of foreplay, just "get it on" as soon as possible.
So once again, feel free to state your views Milena as anyone else but then stand for them and dont claim to be something your not or generalize girls/bisexual girls to something they are not.
EDIT: fixed some grammar mistakes
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