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| Thread: The Perfect Stronghold |  This thread is pages long: 1 ... 8 9 10 11 12 ... 20 27 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted August 29, 2006 11:18 AM |
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I have a suggestion for the moat. They arent' spikes but the remains of dead soldiers on a totem of sorts with skulls and tribal stuff hanging from it. It damages anybody that touches it and has a chance of causing fear. Ie. the unit that hits the moat might run and head for the edge of the map. The more units in a stack the higher the chance of dodging this ability.
A moat with a special ability? That sounds a bit too radical, don't you think? Besides, if the undead moat doesn't cause fear, why should some corpses do that?
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Crashnburn
Hired Hero
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posted August 29, 2006 02:37 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
I have a suggestion for the moat. They arent' spikes but the remains of dead soldiers on a totem of sorts with skulls and tribal stuff hanging from it. It damages anybody that touches it and has a chance of causing fear. Ie. the unit that hits the moat might run and head for the edge of the map. The more units in a stack the higher the chance of dodging this ability.
A moat with a special ability? That sounds a bit too radical, don't you think? Besides, if the undead moat doesn't cause fear, why should some corpses do that?
Both the Sylvan and Dungeon moat have special abilities. Sylvan's holds them for one extra turn and the Dungeon's places some dark magic effect on them (I can't remember which one though).
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted August 29, 2006 05:33 PM |
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Really? Cool, I haven't noticed that. But I still think that if the necro moat doesn't cause fear, orc moat shouldn't do that either.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 29, 2006 10:02 PM |
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Because the way the corpses have been torn up and hung on the totems. The enemies lose their nerve. Thats why they run... Either that or CrashBurn's acid pit idea. I like that one too...
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted August 30, 2006 12:58 AM |
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I don't know, I would rather go with WarOverlord's idea of the roman-type moat with no special abilities, but if I have to choose, I'd choose the one with brutally carved corpses on totems above the one with acid. However, imagine a conservative redneck dad who gets in his 10 year old child's room while he/she besieges an orc castle, sees the ransacked corpses on totems, gets mad and calls a few independent organisation numbers (especially native American ones)... Next thing we know we'd have a bunch of hippies protesting around burning Heroes dvds and taking their clothes off to express their dismay...
LIVE ON CNN:
"I now stand at the crime scene where a young worker from the Nival game development company massacred some young people claiming they destroyed the game supposed to make him hundreds of thousands of dolars. He carved their bodies horribly with a chainsaw and stuck them on his house's fence yelling 'Here's your Stronghold moat you bastards!'. After this man was arrested, he admitted that he didn't know the names of those people but only their nicks: Crashnburn, SBlister, War-Overlord and Baklava. Stay tuned to see the latest weather forecast - inluding 75 more hurricanes in the region of Florida."
Ok, maybe I overreacted a bit.  But I'm still against the idea of corpses on totems.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 30, 2006 02:17 AM |
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A spiked barricade for the Orcs... Isn't that EXACTLY the same as the Haven? Any kind of spike barricade with holes or none is gonna be the same as the one in the Haven' town. Which is why I suggested the tribal thing. Hell, there doesn't need to be a corpse there, just a bunch of scary voodoo stuff like what the Trolls use in Warcraft on these cursed totems. They can look like scarecrows with a voodoo twist.
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted August 30, 2006 12:17 PM |
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I agree with the tribal moat 'cause it sounds good.
No spike barricades!!!Haven has them exactly!!!!
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted August 30, 2006 01:00 PM |
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Ok, ok, scary voodoo stuff it is, then.
Now that that's settled, what about the stats/creature growth/cost?
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted August 30, 2006 04:51 PM |
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Unit--------------Attack-Defence-Damage----HP---Mana-Shots-Initiative-Speed-Cost--Growth
Goblin---------------2------1------1--------5-----0----0-------11-------5----25?------19
Hobgoblin------------3------2----1 to 2-----5-----0----0-------11-------5----35?-----19
Berserker------------4-----"1"---3 to 4----10-----0----0-------11-------6----60?------10
Berserker Veteran----5------2----3 to 5----10-----0----0-------11-------6----80?-----10
Wolf Marauder--------5------3----4 to 6----15-----0----0-------10-------6----95?-------9
Wolf Ravager---------6------3----4 to 8----18-----0----0-------10-------6---130------9
Shaman---------------6------5----4 to 10---30----10----5-------"7"------4----275?------"6"
Elder Shaman---------6------6----6? to 11---48----16----5-------"9"------4---340*----"6"
Wyvern--------------12-----12---10 to 15---60-----0----0-------11-------7----625?-------3
Quartzhide Wyvern--"14"----17---10 to 18---80-----0----0-------11-------6---765?------3
Troll---------------22-----19---15 to 22--130-----0---"5"-------7-------4----1450?-------2
Battle Troll--------22-----21---15 to 30--140-----0---"5"-------8-------4--1850*-----2
Behemoth------------27-----23---30 to 60--150-----0----0-------10-------6----2700?-------1
Dire Behemoth-------30-----28---40 to 65--210-----0----0-------11-------7?--4500?------1
I added "?" after those I altered mostly the prices adn behemoth speed and shaman damage.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 30, 2006 07:11 PM |
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Edited by SBlister at 19:19, 30 Aug 2006.
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1. Drop the Goblin initiave to 10. Increase the damage to 1-2.
2. Hobgoblin HP increase to 6. Increase damage to 2-3.
3. Berserker stats are ok. I would increase the HP of the Veterans to 12.
4. increase the Marauder and Wolf Rider initiave to 13 and increase their speed to 7.
5. Drop the shaman elder HP to 36-40. Increase the damage of both shamans and elders by 1/2.
6. I would rather use the stats I proposed for the wyverns.
7. Increase the battle troll damge to 18-30.
8. I would increase behemoth/dire behemoth HP to 170/220.
THE DWARVES HAVE BEEN UNLEASHED!!! We need to finish this quick before the orcs are cut out completely!
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted August 30, 2006 09:44 PM |
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The scary voodoo moat is fine by me. As for any architecture, I would like to suggest that the buildings are 'rough'. Crude structures made of hardly or unhewn blocks of stone, large bones, logs of unstriped wood and stuff like that.
As much as I regret saying this, I fear we might have to rethink a couple of things, seeing the things asociated with the Dwarves.
Firstly, seeing that the Dwarves have Fire Dragons and Flame Mages, I fear we can't go with worshipping the Dragongod of Fire, if we are going to send this to Nival. I suggest we go back to my original idea of Worshipping a Dragon Demigod. We could keep the name, but we would need to rework this for the new setting.
Secondly, I fear we will have to come up with a new name for the Hero, seeing that the Warlord is already a Dwarf level 6. To keep it simple I suggest we either use Overlord or Barberian. Personaly I like the first option better, because Overlord has more ruthlesness in the name. It also suggest that the Overlord considers himself above any royalty and thus superior over, at least the Humans(seeing as it means in most dictionaries: one who lords over the lords).
Lastly we need to come up with a new name for the Berserker, seeing as this is also used for the Dwarves. Personaly I think Grunt - Elite/Veteran Grunt would be workable.
I know most of this is unconfirmed, but I think it is best to rework it, to be on the safe side.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 30, 2006 10:31 PM |
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Edited by SBlister at 22:32, 30 Aug 2006.
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I vote making the orcs ancestral worshippers, praying to the spirits of long dead warriors. I like Overlord as well. So you have my vote on that. Grunts... That's so Warcraft. How bout we give the name Marauder from the Wolf Riders to them. Marauder and Elite/Veteran Marauder. As for the wolf riders we name them Wolf Rider and use the left over Elite/ Veteran part as their upgraded name. ie. Marauder/Veteran Marauder and Wolf Rider/Elite Wolf Rider or vice versa. My other suggestion is renaming them Sentinel/Champion.
On the plus side, they said theres gonna be 15 missions, 5 of which are Haven Renengades, 5 are Dwarf and 5 more... If we quickly finish this off in a week's time and send it to Nival. We can cross our fingers and hope to see this Stronghold a reality.
I have a suggestion for the shaman since we are moving away from Dragon of Fire. The shamans are very much in touch with the beasts. So they have crows constantly circling them. In battle, they launch these crows at their enemies who deal damage. Since these crows attack at their own free will, we can add no melee penalty and unlimited shots to the shaman. Then we can transfer the spellcasting ability to the elder shaman. Three spells, no longer fire based. We can also remove war charge from the shamans line up of abilities? what do you all think?
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Crashnburn
Hired Hero
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posted August 31, 2006 05:53 AM |
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As much as I regret saying this, I fear we might have to rethink a couple of things, seeing the things asociated with the Dwarves.
Firstly, seeing that the Dwarves have Fire Dragons and Flame Mages, I fear we can't go with worshipping the Dragongod of Fire, if we are going to send this to Nival. I suggest we go back to my original idea of Worshipping a Dragon Demigod. We could keep the name, but we would need to rework this for the new setting.
If they're going to worship any dragon at all I would suggest they worship the primordial dragon of chaos. War, destruction, chaos... kind of fits in my opinion.
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Secondly, I fear we will have to come up with a new name for the Hero, seeing that the Warlord is already a Dwarf level 6. To keep it simple I suggest we either use Overlord or Barberian. Personaly I like the first option better, because Overlord has more ruthlesness in the name. It also suggest that the Overlord considers himself above any royalty and thus superior over, at least the Humans(seeing as it means in most dictionaries: one who lords over the lords).
My vote would be for barbarian. It's traditional and belongs with the Stronghold. When you mentioned "Overlord" the first thing I thought of was the Horned Demon upgrade. Then I realized that was the "Overseer" and then thought of the Pit Lords. It just seems a little close to the demon names, but hey, maybe that's just me.
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Lastly we need to come up with a new name for the Berserker, seeing as this is also used for the Dwarves. Personaly I think Grunt - Elite/Veteran Grunt would be workable.
I agree with SBlister on this one. I would worry about the Warcraft comparisons/comments with having an orc unit called a grunt.
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I vote making the orcs ancestral worshippers, praying to the spirits of long dead warriors.
This is a fine idea in my opinion as well if we don't do the Dragon of Chaos.
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Grunts... That's so Warcraft. How bout we give the name Marauder from the Wolf Riders to them. Marauder and Elite/Veteran Marauder. As for the wolf riders we name them Wolf Rider and use the left over Elite/ Veteran part as their upgraded name. ie. Marauder/Veteran Marauder and Wolf Rider/Elite Wolf Rider or vice versa. My other suggestion is renaming them Sentinel/Champion.
I agree with the idea of giving the berserkers the marauder name instead of grunt. Upgrade can be ravager. Then for the former Wolf Marauders/Ravagers I was thinking we can rename them Beast Tamer and Beast Master for the upgraded form. I know Beast Master was a hero name in HOMM3 but I think it fits better as a unit. Besides I doubt Nival is going to bring back the Fortress town. Two of their best units will be gone anyways; the Hydra to the Dungeon and the Wyvern to our Stronghold.
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On the plus side, they said theres gonna be 15 missions, 5 of which are Haven Renengades, 5 are Dwarf and 5 more... If we quickly finish this off in a week's time and send it to Nival. We can cross our fingers and hope to see this Stronghold a reality.
I appreciate SBlister's enthusiasm but I doubt we could make it into this expansion pack even if we submitted what we had right now. I think the best bet is to shoot for the next expansion. I'm certain there will be a second one as the Naga haven't been introduced yet and they're planning on releasing the first expansion just six months after the game was released. Since they're on such a quick time table that leads me to believe they have more they want to get out before the product becomes stale to most consumers. Besides with shooting for second expansion that gives us more time to give our work and ideas a spit shine.
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I have a suggestion for the shaman since we are moving away from Dragon of Fire. The shamans are very much in touch with the beasts. So they have crows constantly circling them. In battle, they launch these crows at their enemies who deal damage. Since these crows attack at their own free will, we can add no melee penalty and unlimited shots to the shaman. Then we can transfer the spellcasting ability to the elder shaman. Three spells, no longer fire based. We can also remove war charge from the shamans line up of abilities? what do you all think?
I'm ok with the birds if we want to move in that direction. I like the visual of crows circling over the shamans head. Couple of ideas to spitball about that real quick though. Maybe its crows for the shaman but for the shaman elder its carrion birds like vultures -OR- maybe just have one bird (crow, vulture, whichever) sitting on the Shaman/Shaman Elder's shoulder.
As far as spells, why don't we try to come up with some new spells instead of using existing ones? I mean we can use some existing but let's make this guy unique from the other spell casters. I was thinking of maybe a soul transfer spell which would basically be a healing spell but you have to take life points from one target to give them to another. For example you drain life points from an opponent's griffins and give them to your behemoths. I think we would have to give it some limitation like it wouldn't be able to resurrect any troops though, only heal. Another idea would be that the shaman elder would be able to use the spirits from friendly units that die in combat to do a damaging spell. So the more spirits he collects the more damage the spell would do. Just some ideas.
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JoonasTo
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted August 31, 2006 03:20 PM |
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Secondly, I fear we will have to come up with a new name for the Hero, seeing that the Warlord is already a Dwarf level 6. To keep it simple I suggest we either use Overlord or Barberian. Personaly I like the first option better, because Overlord has more ruthlesness in the name. It also suggest that the Overlord considers himself above any royalty and thus superior over, at least the Humans(seeing as it means in most dictionaries: one who lords over the lords).
My vote would be for barbarian. It's traditional and belongs with the Stronghold. I agree
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I vote making the orcs ancestral worshippers, praying to the spirits of long dead warriors.
I'm with you on that
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Grunts... That's so Warcraft. How bout we give the name Marauder from the Wolf Riders to them. Marauder and Elite/Veteran Marauder. As for the wolf riders we name them Wolf Rider and use the left over Elite/ Veteran part as their upgraded name. ie. Marauder/Veteran Marauder and Wolf Rider/Elite Wolf Rider or vice versa. My other suggestion is renaming them Sentinel/Champion.
Marauder/ravager and wolf rider/beast master
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I have a suggestion for the shaman since we are moving away from Dragon of Fire. The shamans are very much in touch with the beasts. So they have crows constantly circling them. In battle, they launch these crows at their enemies who deal damage. Since these crows attack at their own free will, we can add no melee penalty and unlimited shots to the shaman. Then we can transfer the spellcasting ability to the elder shaman. Three spells, no longer fire based. We can also remove war charge from the shamans line up of abilities? what do you all think?
One bird sitting on his staff, vulture with elder and crow with unupgraded
As far as spells, why don't we try to come up with some new spells instead of using existing ones? I mean we can use some existing but let's make this guy unique from the other spell casters. I was thinking of maybe a soul transfer spell which would basically be a healing spell but you have to take life points from one target to give them to another. For example you drain life points from an opponent's griffins and give them to your behemoths. I think we would have to give it some limitation like it wouldn't be able to resurrect any troops though, only heal. Another idea would be that the shaman elder would be able to use the spirits from friendly units that die in combat to do a damaging spell. So the more spirits he collects the more damage the spell would do. Just some ideas.
no to soul transfer but the idea of collecting spirits is great
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted August 31, 2006 06:14 PM |
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Shaman's being circled by crows and using the spirits of the dead, that's realy starting to sound like a Necromancer(they have a bunch of crows sitting on them to). The idea of using a bird to attack from a distance is realy nice, but we either stick to a vulture al the way or upgrade a vulture to a condor. Transferring the spellcasting to the upgrade and giving them both unlimmited ammo is fine by me, but giving the Shaman no melee penalty is a bit to much. Trolls already have that ability and it would leave us without a real shooter.
About the Grunt, the comparrison to Warcraft slipped my mind, but still grunt is military slang for infantryman and has been around since the Vietnam-war at least. Naming them Marauders would indicate that they are mainly used as raiders and shocktroops and while that would suit the wolfcavalry, it isn't an appropriate name for the infantry in my opinion. It's also an idea to keep it realy simple and use Warrior - Elite Warrior. It'll also mean we could keep the names for our cavalry.
As for new spells for the Shaman, the idea of soul transfer-/draining sounds realy cool. On the other hand, collecting souls of the dead for using a damaging spell, sounds needlessly complicated.
I also had the idea last night to call our hero a Chieftain, that way it is something like an Overlord, but with more obvious referance to barberians.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 31, 2006 06:40 PM |
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So its Overlord 2, Barbarian 2. we can't choose Grunt because of Warcraft. plain and simple. warrior-elite warrior sounds too bland. they made that name famous. Marauder change - everyone agrees. I would rather put Veteran Marauder for numerous reasons. One, it sounds cooler. Two, we can see why they get the no retaliation ability, because they are veterans and more disciplined. Three, it fits in with War-Overlord's description. I would leave Wolf Rider and Wolf Ravager to the wolves. Beastmaster, nope, nope. A beastmaster can't be an orc on a wolf with a sabre. they control beasts. sitting on one does not make him a beastmaster. For the shamans, it's not one bird but many birds circling around him. Like 4-5. And they're like crow/vulture hybrids, carrion birds. I'm sure nival can come up with a cool concept art. Did I type No Melee Penalty? Sorry, I meant to type no range penalty cuz it doesnt matter how for the birds are, theyre still gonna pluck out their eyes. I'm against the Soul Transfer ability. It's too Necromantic for the orcs. Chieftain would be the ultimate solution to the overlord barbarian problem of naming our hero IMHO. If you wanna leave marauder to the wolves, lemme think of a name to replace berserkers... i'll find one.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 31, 2006 06:46 PM |
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Edited by SBlister at 18:48, 31 Aug 2006.
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I got it. If you wanna leave Marauder-Ravager to the Wolves, Let's call the orcs Vanguard-Elite Vanguard...
Anyone interested in calling Shaman Elders, Shaman Oracles?
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted August 31, 2006 08:18 PM |
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Vanguard - Elite Vanguard + Shaman Oracles sound great. I'd still rather see one bird, instead of a flock of them. But perhaps we can make a compromise by giving the Shaman Oracles a spell that calls a flock of birds. How do these spells sound : Rage of Eagles, target gets attacked for X damage; Quicksand, target sinks in quicksand and becomes immobile for X turns; Oracle Insight, Shaman Oracle predicts the next action of target, giving target high chance of missing next turn. No Range Penalty sounds verry logical, which would make the abilities of the Shaman - Shooter, No-Range-Penalty, Unlimited-Ammo. The upgrade getting Spellcaster. I think we'd have to cut down on skills somewhere else though, because their is an ability limit, but it would be better to ask Gnoll-Mage such things.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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Crashnburn
Hired Hero
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posted August 31, 2006 09:40 PM |
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I got it. If you wanna leave Marauder-Ravager to the Wolves, Let's call the orcs Vanguard-Elite Vanguard...
Anyone interested in calling Shaman Elders, Shaman Oracles?
This is just my opinion but to me Vanguard and Oracle are too... clean for the orcs. I'll see if I can think of any other names for the ex-berserkers but as far as the Shamans I agree that we need to change the name from "elder" because of the druid elders. How about something more along the lines of the name witch doctor for the unupgraded and then use shaman for the upgraded form. Or you could do seer or soothsayer which to me fit better than oracle. If you do want to stick with the oracle name though I would suggest dropping shaman from shaman oracle. So shaman for unupgraded and oracle for upgraded.
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SBlister
Famous Hero
Rakshasa Commander
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posted August 31, 2006 11:25 PM |
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Edited by SBlister at 23:27, 31 Aug 2006.
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Clean? As in nice? These orcs are different. Their proud but savage yet noble who see the humans as their enemies for making them slaves in the first place. hence forming a vanguard to ensure it would never happen again. the vanguard protects the tribes. Believe me when i say that i looked for names to replace the berserkers. Seer, Soothsayer and Witch Doctor don't really do the shamans any justice. It's like saying medicine man and upgrade witch doctor. I'd stick with either Shaman Elder or Shaman Oracle or Shaman Mystic. As far as new spells are concerned, it would effect all the other factions as well, so i think we should concentrate more on the Stronghold then on stuff that would have a universal effect. For me it's either a flock of birds flying around on the shaman (which would make them small but numerous) or one huge bird.
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