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| Thread: Dwarves are creatures, not a race! |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 25, 2007 10:25 PM |
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Even if they are dwarves one must consider that short dwarves are just the norm. For instance it's not normal for a man to look like a sumo wrestler and bee queens are a lot bigger than the regular ones.
Not much point in thinking about it in a rational manner cause ubi probably didn't. Or didn't care to explain anyway.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted January 25, 2007 10:28 PM |
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HEY NOW!!
Yall whined & cried ever since heroes 5 came out about Dwarves.
Even before it came out.
Before the Expansions yall still cried.
Now they bring them & yall still cry.
Does nothing make yall happy anymore?
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Dreaming of a Better World
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Lith-Maethor
Honorable
Legendary Hero
paid in Coin and Cleavage
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posted January 25, 2007 10:30 PM |
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surprisingly enough...
what Aculias said... some people will never be happy
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You are suffering from delusions of adequacy.
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Geny
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted January 25, 2007 10:31 PM |
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Unfortunately, no. That poor yall....
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yasmiel
Supreme Hero
Former Chessmaster
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posted January 25, 2007 10:37 PM |
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Indeed, some will never be happy..
On the other hand, I'm very happy about development of H5..
What I'm unhappy about is that i really need a newer computer but thats not the problem for this board 
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Shauku83
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted January 25, 2007 11:00 PM |
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Quote:
As for the "giant dwarf"  issue, I'm afraid those are simply... giants. Just like the entire Dungeon faction is a Warhammer rip-off, so is the Fortress faction. Take a look at the Mountain Clans from Disciples 2, for example.
The devolopers said that the inspiration for Dungeon came from Dark Elves of Salvatore, who are based on Forgotten Realms (D&D campaign), not from Warhammer. Here is a part of the interview.
Quote:
What were your inspirations when creating this new faction?
We somewhat based ourselves on the classical fantasy descriptions and general idea of Dark Elves, yet changed it to fit the Heroes of Might and Magic V universe. Actually, we were inspired by two ideas: the conception of Dungeon in the previous HoMM games and the conception of Dark Elves in various fantasy worlds, especially those Dark Elves that live in the city of Menzoberronzan described by R.A. Salvatore.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted January 25, 2007 11:12 PM |
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Seriously, if you don't like dwarven faction's design, don't play it. Or go play digimon.
DI-GI-MON DIGITAL-MONSTERS!
-_-
(btw, it still annoys me that a supposed dwarf is taller than me  )
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relentless
Known Hero
Shadow Elemental
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posted January 25, 2007 11:29 PM |
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Quote:
...it still annoys me that a supposed dwarf is taller than me )
Well, there are tall people and short people, so why whouldn't a tall dwarf exist? Most of the race is shorter than the average humans, that's why they call the race "dwarfs". However, it is possible that some dwarfs are a little taller than others and rarely even as tall as a human.
I do agree Thanes are not Dwarfs though... They are Thanes.
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted January 26, 2007 07:34 AM |
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So what if this race is not perfect? But we got a TOTALLY new race... That made me happy, we have only seen dwarves with axes and hammers, boring little ones. now we got a lot of new dwarves and its fun finally to play something new.. And if we havn't had a new race this game would have been worse, because we got a lot of old guys with us. so all we needed was new stuff and we got it! Forge and Fire!
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted January 26, 2007 08:20 AM |
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Edited by Vlaad at 08:25, 26 Jan 2007.
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Shauku83:Quote:
The devolopers said that the inspiration for Dungeon came from Dark Elves of Salvatore, who are based on Forgotten Realms (D&D campaign), not from Warhammer. Here is a part of the interview...
You are right, of course. I was talking about the actual creature design though. Take a look at Warhammer's Dark Elf Assassin, Witch, Cold One Knight, Sorceress... even War Hydra and Black Dragon are included in the lineup.
Relentless:Quote:
I do agree Thanes are not Dwarfs though... They are Thanes.
Thane means soldier, noble or chief, so it's definitely not a race. It's not that important anyway.
emilsn:Quote:
So what if this race is not perfect? But we got a TOTALLY new race... That made me happy, we have only seen dwarves with axes and hammers, boring little ones. now we got a lot of new dwarves and its fun finally to play something new..
I agree.
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Shauku83
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted January 26, 2007 09:29 AM |
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Quote:
Shauku83:Quote:
The devolopers said that the inspiration for Dungeon came from Dark Elves of Salvatore, who are based on Forgotten Realms (D&D campaign), not from Warhammer. Here is a part of the interview...
You are right, of course. I was talking about the actual creature design though. Take a look at Warhammer's Dark Elf Assassin, Witch, Cold One Knight, Sorceress... even War Hydra and Black Dragon are included in the lineup.
Oh yes, the Assassins are look a-likes. That one is obvious. But there isn’t really that much room to play if one wants to use the classical Dark Elves.. They are always assigned with Purple and Black colours, limiting their looks quite a bit. As for the army…The assassins belong to the faction, no doubt. They are matriarchal (except in Warhammer afaik, but correct me if I’m wrong) so Witches and Matriarchs are pretty much a must in the composition.. I couldn’t think of a better place for the Black Dragon (the town is old Dungeon after all), neither can I imagine the Hydra anywhere else from the current factions except the Dwarves…if they had more chaotic nature. The Cold Ones/Dark Raiders I agree, there is a similarity for sure. But they were in D&D already, so can’t tell where exactly they have been copied.
But if you want the classical Dark Elves, one must use what they have. That is of course the designers decision, and a completely new and fresh line-up could work as well. I for one am a fan of Forgotten Realms so I have a biased view of this -> I wouldn’t have wanted them to mess the idea of Dark Elves. After all it could turn out as horrible as seeing Devils in Necropolis 
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Lith-Maethor
Honorable
Legendary Hero
paid in Coin and Cleavage
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posted January 26, 2007 09:37 AM |
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ugh
Quote:
After all it could turn out as horrible as seeing Devils in Necropolis
lets not bring that up again... even a HoMM4 defender like me can't salvage that
anyway, back on topic... design choices were made for both Fortress and Dungeon... and although i am not too happy about some of them (don't like riders, or the fact we got too more dragons*) all in all they work pretty well
* that is actually a problem of the necropolis... they should kick the dragons out and insert knights at lvl 6, pushing up the wights
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You are suffering from delusions of adequacy.
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alchemist85
Hired Hero
Disciple(s II) of Desert
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posted February 03, 2007 11:17 PM |
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Some thoughts...
Quote:
As for the "giant dwarf" issue, I'm afraid those are simply... giants. Just like the entire Dungeon faction is a Warhammer rip-off, so is the Fortress faction. Take a look at [url=http://www.strategyplanet.com/disciples2/units_clans.htm]the Mountain Clans[/url] from Disciples 2, for example.
Ouu... I see somebody was faster than me in this example. For me adding dwarven town to Heroes is surely based on Mountain Clans from Disciples. Especially including connections betwee dwarves and giants. I didn't find anywhere any info about it in mythology or RPG systems (that's maybe because i didn't search fot it )
Anyway, I feel more like elf or vampire than a dwarf opposite to my friends (which are metals, so they always play dwarves in RPGs), so dwarves aren't my favourite tow. Navertheless they added some freshness to the game.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 03, 2007 11:30 PM |
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Quote:
* that is actually a problem of the necropolis... they should kick the dragons out and insert knights at lvl 6, pushing up the wights
Bone dragons are here since heroes2, they can't kick them out for some kind of a newcomer
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted February 03, 2007 11:43 PM |
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Doomy boy is right, don't remove the Bone drakes! They were cool in HoMM2 ! and was too weak in HoMM3 but they were there.. Then HoMM4 raped them and now they are back... Nice!
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GenieLord
Honorable
Legendary Hero
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posted February 05, 2007 03:25 PM |
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Quote:
Doomy boy is right, don't remove the Bone drakes! They were cool in HoMM2 ! and was too weak in HoMM3 but they were there.. Then HoMM4 raped them and now they are back... Nice!
Actually, they were in H4:
But in H3 and now, in H5, they are underpowered.
They are 7th level creature, with 15-30 damage (most of the 6th level creatures have more), 150 HP (Treants have much higher) and 6 speed.
Most of the 6th level creatures are better.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted February 05, 2007 04:45 PM |
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I rarely quote myself, but that post calls for a quote.
Quote:
I find it slightly amusing that people all the time mention how bad Spectral Dragons are compared to other level 7 units - but only a few seem to remember that you possibly receive 3 spectral dragons each week, and only 2 of the other level 7 creatures. Try to compare the stats of 1.5 spectral dragon with 1 black dragon:
1.5 Spectral Dragon: Attack 30, Defence 28, Damage 38-53, HP 240, Init/Speed 11/7, Cost 4350 + 3 Mercury.
1 Black Dragon: Attack 30, Defence 30, Damage 45-70, HP 240, Init/Speed 10/9, Cost 4500 + 2 Sulfur.
Yes, the Bone Dragons do somewhat less damage - in fact, the only level 7 creature to do less damage is the Emerald Dragon at 33-57, and it's not too gentle on your Mercury reserve, but other than that, it's not particularly lacking compared to other level 7 units. Of course, 1.5 creature is not always as good as 1 creature (because you'll only need to do 160 damage to kill the first spectral dragon) but on the other hand, the Necromancers have very easy access to raise dead, whereas other factions will need to have a hero with Expert Light magic to ressurect their units (and remember, the black dragon will not be ressurected at all).
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emilsn
Legendary Hero
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posted February 05, 2007 09:47 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Doomy boy is right, don't remove the Bone drakes! They were cool in HoMM2 ! and was too weak in HoMM3 but they were there.. Then HoMM4 raped them and now they are back... Nice!
Actually, they were in H4:
But in H3 and now, in H5, they are underpowered.
They are 7th level creature, with 15-30 damage (most of the 6th level creatures have more), 150 HP (Treants have much higher) and 6 speed.
Most of the 6th level creatures are better.
Sorry i know they were in HOMM4 I just meant that they changed the look so bad, and that i explained myself by saying Raped.
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Xazrael
![Xazrael]()
Disgraceful
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posted February 08, 2007 02:28 AM |
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You said "Dwarfs are small men and women, thats it", what the hell are you talking about.
Thats like saying Humans are medium sized men and women. Nowhere do I see all medium sized people. There are small people, normal sized, and tall, and everything in between. A human riding a bear or a goat or an eagle, is still a human. A dwarf riding a bear, is a dwarf, a dwarf 50ft tall is a dwarf. A dwarf thats 2ft tall, is a dwarf. YOu get the picture? Also as of the magic issue, who cares? There is many different ways magic is viewed. In many stories and games, magic is a trait in the blood of elves, and such. In some others, magic is something that exists within everything. And you cant relate magic to anything in RL, because sorry to break it to you, but magic doesnt exist in RL, and if it does, come over to me, and show me. Something doesnt have to look the same to still be the same race, species, etc. Now lets drop this, and move on.
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Moonlith
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
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posted February 08, 2007 07:42 AM |
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Quote:
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I don't see what one has to do with the other. Orcs are still good candidates for returning and thunderbirds will surely be with them. Unless the nagas have something to say about it! 
Dont you get it?
Thunderbirds = Thane (same powers)
Venom Spawn = Wyvern (Same powers)
Rakshasa = Naga
If one of these creatures are in, then the others won't be in it.
I can't be wrong as it never happend before, in none of the previous homm series. The only exception is the Mummy, which looks like the Lich in many things.
Blood Furies = Harpy Hags
There's wyverns in HOMM5 already???
Actually I do like the fact nagas got replaced by Rakshasas, but only because it leaves the option open for a new reptile / naga town. Bring on the tropical jungles!
As for dwarves, why can't they be a race? I don't like them but they are as much a race as elfs. Thanes aren't dwarves, but I think the faction is based mostly on Norse mythology, which also featured dwarves and giants. In such case though, I would probably have preferred to see a shooting fire giant lvl7, although the magma dragon is cool too.
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