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| Thread: Which faction is hardest to master in multiplayer? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted February 28, 2008 06:16 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 18:17, 28 Feb 2008.
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Yes, you are...
Ok. Maybe you didn't master it, but you have done a really important step to do it- you have made an alternative strategy which is just abusive and perfectly matches the enemy...
What's more- I think, that with using normal strategy you also rock...
If you didn't, you wouldn't also invent another one I pressume...
But who knows O_O
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ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
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posted February 28, 2008 06:31 PM |
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Still, imho fortress is the hardest, esp in heroic, their key building price is too insane
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted February 28, 2008 07:24 PM |
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dungeon has 2 totally awesome units imo : brisk/grim raider with lizard bite and black/red dragon, extremly powerful. I doubt it sucks in endgame.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 28, 2008 07:36 PM |
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they are strong by stats. They never felt strong in the game. Other factions' lineups easily outclassed them. The lack of defense and supportive spells meant raiders were killed in the first strike, and dragons are never numerous enough to be any serious threat. You have to make a lot of adjustments to make any use of those units.
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted February 28, 2008 08:13 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 20:13, 28 Feb 2008.
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If you manage to get Light Magic there is something very funny you can do with black dragon XD
And that means- bless it. Irresistable Magic affect also light I think...
Wonder how would your friends' face look like when you would, for example haste your blackies and then, eventually ressurect them XD
But it is an extream strategy. Light has only 2% to appear -_-
But witches' huts can help ;P
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carcity
Supreme Hero
Blind Sage
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posted February 28, 2008 08:49 PM |
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I think academy is very hard to master. once i played against dungeon and i had about 13 titans and they got pwned by the furies of my enemy.
@lesij the blackies are immune to ALL kinds of magic even blessing ones.
and finally a little question: what is creeping?
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Why can't you save anybody?
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unixmage
Known Hero
Demon Slayer
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posted February 28, 2008 09:21 PM |
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Definitely Fortress. Academy is the faction of experts though.
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted February 28, 2008 10:19 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 22:20, 28 Feb 2008.
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Quote:
I think academy is very hard to master. once i played against dungeon and i had about 13 titans and they got pwned by the furies of my enemy.
@lesij the blackies are immune to ALL kinds of magic even blessing ones.
and finally a little question: what is creeping?
Irresistable magic takes their immunity down...
Try to cast empowered armaggedon having balckies only and see by yourself... That's why I said this strategy is funny, cuz anyone would even think, that your balckies can be blessed...
Creeping is killing dudes guarding mines/treasure chests/artifacts etc., not other heroes...
One question: Is there Empowered Divine Guidance O_O? It deals magic damage, but is kinda specific O_O
If so, then Light Warlock rulz O_O
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 28, 2008 11:47 PM |
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No, even irresistible spells won't allow you to bless blackies nor curse them.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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86wyp
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 12:09 AM |
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academy. once you are a master of academy you are a master of every faction. That is 90% true.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 29, 2008 12:22 AM |
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So when I master the art of magic I will gain all-pwning powers?  Academy plays a lot differently to most other factions, why do you think that its mastery will help you master the rest?
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Map also hosted on Moddb
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 01:58 AM |
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Quote:
they are strong by stats. They never felt strong in the game. Other factions' lineups easily outclassed them. The lack of defense and supportive spells meant raiders were killed in the first strike, and dragons are never numerous enough to be any serious threat. You have to make a lot of adjustments to make any use of those units.
maybe but I could say you need to make adjustments with every faction
and I don't understand how you can say black dragons aren't a serious threat? unless you play sylve (for example) and kill them before they play with emerald dragons and extremly unbalanced arcan archers, you have few chances to stop them before they act and blow up 1 or 2 of your stacks (since they are immune to magic)
and grim raiders don't seem to care that much if the enemy have far more defense  (but I'm not sure about their real power since I used mainly the brisk raiders)
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 29, 2008 02:03 AM |
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You could be surprised, incredibly good attackers. When they charge for 5 tiles they hit against zero defense.
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Map also hosted on Moddb
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Cleave
Promising
Famous Hero
Raging Blood
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posted February 29, 2008 10:50 AM |
bonus applied by Elvin on 29 Feb 2008. |
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I believe that whatever faction you play dark magic helps a lot (except against the undead of course).
-IMO Haven is very easy to play but it can't compare to Sylvan in terms of power. Sylvan is harder at the beginning though.
-Stronghold is easy to play as well until you face some hero who can cast dark magic spells. Then all your skill will be useless (unless you have legions of witch doctors and a foe who hasn't got swift mind or sorcery).
-Necropolis is not that difficult but you need to get some boost with your creatures because its quantity versus quality (back in the old days haunted mines allowed you to get loads of ghosts easily, now its over so you have to be creative). Immunity to mind control and poison is useful nevertheless.
-Fortress is hard in the early game but the combination of Runes and Magic is really powerful. Yet it all depends on the runes you get (rune of charge, magic control, etheralness, resurrection, battle rage...) you don't have to but you can add light and (IMO even better) dark magic and it becomes very hard to beat them.
-Dungeon can't just rely on destructive to defeat might armies, hence the need for dark. I'll second what posters said, it's not the easiest faction to master by far.
-Inferno is very tactical in the early game and it is more demanding in terms of gameplay. What I mean by that is you have to be extra careful in order not to lose key stacks like hellhounds and familiars so that gating won't be crippled. It's not as easy as it used to be because the AI will ignore your gated creatures (and that's what a sensible player is likely to do). In the end game however you get that nice feeling when your troops start to take over the battlefield.
-Last but not least, the Academy, IMO it's quite hard. Buildings are expensive (the artifact building for instance, or the Rakshasas...) and you really have to pick up some magic skills or it's not going to work. Getting Arcane Omniscience is really swell and it may look awesome on paper but the Academy is as good as the Wizard who is in control. Problem is, with low attack and defense, creatures won't be that resistant when facing enemy heroes. Artifacts compensate that but they are so expensive. In a way they can be compared to runes, but consume artifact still needs to be activated by the hero. I don't find it that difficult to creep with a Wizard (even large numbers of assassins on the adventure map are not that scary). Still when it comes to big fights I really find them hard to play. Perhaps I find the Academy harder to play because I haven't played them as much as the other factions, anyway that's just my opinion as a regular player.
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samiekl
Supreme Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 11:44 AM |
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With academy i have the most fun while creeping. Followed closely by inferno.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 29, 2008 01:59 PM |
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Edited by Elvin at 14:00, 29 Feb 2008.
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Good post cleave
I feel that Stronghold is not THAT much hurt by dark. Sure it will give you a hard game but I believe you have your chances.
Necropolis sure needs some creativity, they and academy can have some interesting combinations both early and lategame.
Fortress certainly seems to need the rune/magic combination and that also brings up some cool strategies. The available runes and spells in each game can give a good variety.
Dungeon also has good melee potential. Even more now that the memory mentor was introduced, you can go magic in the beginning and take a more might approach later. Be it retribution, power of speed or luck you can sure deal some sweet damage, even more with chains and the runeforce set. Tried it the other day - double chains are insane
Inferno is very tactical indeed. You MUST find ways to exploit the neutrals and you can, thing is that I feel like wasting my time. If you attack a horde of zombies day 2 you will be forced to use a few hellhounds running around while your hero kills them one by one.. Covering your familiars, gating, making extra protective formations etc in the beginning really gets to me. This is the main reason that I favour warmachines, they take some of the excruciating boredom away since they make sure it is over faster.
Academy is by far my most fun creeping. Either taking down creeps or fending off rushing heroes academy is efficient and fast, only hampered by the lack of logistics. They are also pretty good again powerful creeps though it took me a while to adjust with the new changes in gameplay and new spells.
The effective combinations against high tier creeps seem to be:
a)Destructive focus with elemental gargoyles.
2)Summoning(firetrap, wasp , blade barrier, arcane crystal, hive, phoenix, elementals if you have fire warriors) - damn all have good creeping value 
Dark(mass slow/confusion/decay, puppet, frenzy, blind, vampirism)
To a lesser extent light with regeneration and buffs which works great with phoenix.
You typically kick @ss with phoenix boosted through other schools, high lvl curses, firetrap or destructive(buy a few arties from town to boost power). The thing is that the available spells will have to modify your strategy in each game. No phoenix on guild can make lots of lava dragons hard on week 2, immune to the good dark spells  And no, might approach won't work. Well unless you have flaming arrows That and one type of magic is successful as well.
Tough creeps such as thanes and shadow witches seemed hard to defeat week 3 but a few colossi with regeneration can tackle them.
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Map also hosted on Moddb
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Adrius
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
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posted February 29, 2008 02:31 PM |
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Edited by Adrius at 14:32, 29 Feb 2008.
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Another proof of how noob I am, I never thought of boosting phoenixes with light...
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 04:06 PM |
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thinking about it, the demons seem pretty hard to master.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 05:07 PM |
bonus applied by alcibiades on 01 Mar 2008. |
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Mastering a faction.. well, not many of us can use that sentence lightly 
And when you actually get your titans slaughtered by furies.. umm, better for you to return to "how to learn the basics" thread. Not that it exists, but..
The easiest way of determining the factions' "difficulty"?
Racial and magics.
And, assuming a newb player starts playing H5 and wonders what faction is the best for starters.. here's my opinion.
Many of us started as haven players (yea the good old castle), just to figure that it's not the easiest castle to play. While stats and light magic are promising, the racial is not very intuitive. It fails on many maps, and is a great toy for hourglass-type rich map fanboys only. If you want to play something less abundant, you will find yourself really poor. So in fact you often fight with no racial against good racials, like gating or avenger. Not very noobfriendly. The creeping requires a lot of ingame knowledge - some creeps can be taken easily by dark magic, some by marksmen, some by warmachines. There is no straight path. You may want to know the map before playing to adapt; Otherwise, you may end up underleveled and with poor arties. Still, a solid lineup makes the faction more noobfriendly. Experts enjoy Maeve a lot, but you may find yourself sucking in the creeping department if you get poor levelup choices. Well, there's no fun without risk. I wouldn't recommend this faction for noobs.
Inferno seems a faction great for noobs - a straightforward hero with war machines from the very start, with high probability of obtaining both tent and ballista skills within the very few first level ups, dark magic - the opposing noob's ultimate headache and familiars, great against players who do not know how to powerlevel/equip heroes to get enough mana. I wouldn't call the faction easy, though - you may find yourself quite endangered with dark magic, and you may find your creeping slow and unintuitive without Deleb. I would call the town hard to master. It takes some skill to make up counters for the inferno's obvious flaws. More than to exploit inferno's obvious strengths. So while you may succed facing other noobs with this town, expect difficulties later on. For a great player, inferno is a scary tool to pwn butts with. But hey, this is a newb-oriented review! 
Sylvan is the ultimate lategame town, but definitely not the greatest pick for inexperienced players. Basic counter-rushing often fails, and you may need to develop something more clever than the basics to survive. The faction is also quite demanding in terms of resources, so perfect creeping is more than necessary, and without war machines, your newby skills can be not enough. You may try it for rich maps, but I'd recommend something easier as starters. Definitely a noob-unfriendly town.
Dungeon is good for newbs! There isn't a lot of skills needed, because all you need is a plan. If you know the map, and know what are your priorities, there is not much skill for you to own mediocre players. Make stalkers invisible, cast fireball/firewall, repeat the latter again and again. Easy for noobs to learn, easy to predict for your opponent too, but on low level of play, dungeon is one heck of a scary opponent. I recommend this faction for newbs, personally. Straightforward way of playing makes it quite a good choice for your first castle. Mastering it requires the ability to combine its weak melee lineup and some unorthodox skills (like light, dark, attack etc) together with destructive to make the best use of every possible advantage this town offers, but against mediocre players, all you really need is destructive and enlightment.
Academy is a complicated faction. it's like dungeon deluxe, but taking completely different course. You must know what spell works best on certain creeps. This faction is good to try after learning the ways of dungeon, inferno and necropolis. Your first try at summoning magic. don't get me wrong, this is a hard faction to play, not to mention mastering it But i still find it easier to play for a newb guy than 100% might no warmachines factions. Try this if you like rock-paper-scizzors, for there is a lot of counters here. For everything.
Necropolis is widely misunderstood. It is a very difficult faction imho, although it appears easy. It needs perfect timing and a good amount of planning - otherwise you will find your army lacking in power and mobility. You may try it as a noob though, to learn the very easy way of creeping with dark magic. Once you learn it, you may try inferno or haven. Necropolis IS a faction for good players. Leave it until you get better.
Fortress is specific, requiring even bigger amount of planning, and featuring runes as additional headache. But, as a defensive orientated faction, it may be appealing to new players. Don't get fooled, though. Defensive =/= easy. Being a very costly faction, it's a challenge even to better players. I would not recommend this one for noobs.
Stronghold, finally - straightforward counters, powerful ballista, extremely easily obtainable flaming arrows, powerful and "automated" racial. It's hard to overcome the general susceptibility towards dark magic, but I'd say it's the most newb-friendly of all might factions. And a good one to start with - on pair with dungeon.
Mastering those factions is a different story, but as a master-of-none (yet  ), I can't really tell much about it. It's up to you to become the specialist.
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samiekl
Supreme Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 05:16 PM |
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Edited by samiekl at 17:24, 29 Feb 2008.
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Doomforge is looking for a qp? .
Btw, true, stronghold is a good faction for noobs. Dungeon too, until you have enough of getting your ass kicked
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