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| Thread: Which faction is hardest to master in multiplayer? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 05:27 PM |
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Doomforge is bored and really tired after a serious training in the gym. My way of relaxing is writing long posts 
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Anakrom
Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
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posted February 29, 2008 05:32 PM |
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Quote:
Unfortunately Fortress need extreme hybrid build...
They don't have to much Spellpower- but they need to take destructive to be very efficent...
No
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Result matters
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sq79
Famous Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 05:42 PM |
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Quote:
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Many of us started as haven players (yea the good old castle), just to figure that it's not the easiest castle to play. While stats and light magic are promising, the racial is not very intuitive. It fails on many maps, and is a great toy for hourglass-type rich map fanboys only. If you want to play something less abundant, you will find yourself really poor. So in fact you often fight with no racial against good racials, like gating or avenger. Not very noobfriendly. The creeping requires a lot of ingame knowledge - some creeps can be taken easily by dark magic, some by marksmen, some by warmachines. There is no straight path. You may want to know the map before playing to adapt; Otherwise, you may end up underleveled and with poor arties. Still, a solid lineup makes the faction more noobfriendly. Experts enjoy Maeve a lot, but you may find yourself sucking in the creeping department if you get poor levelup choices. Well, there's no fun without risk. I wouldn't recommend this faction for noobs....
No
Unfortunately, they are one of the weakest race in HG 
The only chance is 1 town map with 10k income
Retaliation strike is important spell for their early creeps i feel ..
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 05:51 PM |
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I didn't mean the hourglass map itself, I meant general type of opulent maps 
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 06:29 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 18:37, 29 Feb 2008.
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Doom, you said somethin about evry faction...
But you didn't say WHICH is the hardest to master... You said some are hard, or noob-unfriendly...
But which in your opinion, is hardest to master?
For all, who thinks that creeping with fortress is really scary- take Karli and try to get harpooners as fast as you can. Today I managed to take down Lots of Blackbears in the week two ( on HOA:Complete there are no Wights  ). Also horde oif warriors/warmongers is NOTHING really threatening unless you are unlucky and they have extreme morale 
In creeping, fortress may seem quite hard in the first week ( especially if the mines are guarded by some shooters) but later on the creeping is manageable...
EDIT: About harpooners: They have quite good att of 5 and stunning damage , if compared to Skirmishers, 3-5, also, while fighting shooters- harpoon strike may help your melees a lot to reach them...
I have also invented one cheeky combo in the late game especially for those annoying close-to wall staying mele creatures...
Under the siege you can use your harpoon to make enemy's creature walk in your moat and then block his escape with firewall casted by Rune Patriarchs...
Then- he would have to choose- firewall or moat, or useless stain his ground and waitinng for a miracle like demolished wall...
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Anakrom
Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
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posted February 29, 2008 07:55 PM |
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For all, who thinks that creeping with fortress is really scary
It is "scary" only to the point you get Blackbears - so until week two (unless you choose Ingvar). Then you can creep quite effectively, especially with Karli because of Soldierīs Luck. And if you choose Karli, better choice to creep is imo Spearwielders - Cripple lowers initiative, which helps while using Paw Strike. And lowered speed of killer creeps saved me alot. Moreover, upgraded dwelling of Spears cost much ore and 3 crystals, which hurts on higher difficulity.
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Result matters
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 08:01 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 20:18, 29 Feb 2008.
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If you move wise with your economy and take always gold from treasure chests- then you won't have really financial problems at the beggining...
And, dude, I was talking about shooter creeping. So only Shields and Harpoons... You can really easy run out of your gold if you hire blacks each week, and can be really easily cheated by computer if use you base on both shooters and melee fighters. (you can just can have badluck and crippling wound won't appear when it is needed. The same about Paw Strike)
I know that from creeping with Garuna. And with bears it is even more tricky, because they are large creatures (they are far more reachable than Warriors for example).
With slow/weak (hydras, berserkers) creeps- using bears will be easier, but, when for example you have to deal with pallas- Harpoons take the lead.
You need, as you said, quite a lot of luck to succed (crippling wounds and paw strike to appear)...
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Anakrom
Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
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posted February 29, 2008 08:24 PM |
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If you move wise with your economy and take always gold from treasure chests- then you won't have really financial problems at the beggining...
I was talking about resources, not gold.
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And, dude, I was talking about shooter creeping.
Using Rune of Charge is decent in these occasions.
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So only Shields and Harpoons...
Versus shooters? Week one? Then just with Shields + Rune. Why expose your precious shooters to such a threat, when you have tanky fodders.
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I know that from creeping with Garuna
What has Garuna creeping to do with playing Fortress?
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You need, as you said, quite a lot of luck to succed (crippling wounds and paw strike to appear)...
I said you need Soldierīs Luck. With it, Paw Strike triggers everytime you travel longer distance to your target. Unless you are charging enormously big stack, it will work. And Spears usually help too. Battlefrenzied Shields and Luck do the rest.
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Result matters
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted February 29, 2008 08:31 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 20:40, 29 Feb 2008.
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I was talking about resources, not gold.
I know that. I said if you move wise withe THE ECONOMY as everything.
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Versus shooters? Week one? Then just with Shields + Rune. Why expose your precious shooters to such a threat, when you have tanky fodders.
Was I talking about shooters somewhere there O_O?
That's natural you use shileds to deal with shooters...
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What has Garuna creeping to do with playing Fortress?
Garuna is a hero which cannot stand with shooters only. That's why you need warriors to boost her creeping...
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I said you need Soldierīs Luck. With it, Paw Strike triggers everytime you travel longer distance to your target. Unless you are charging enormously big stack, it will work. And Spears usually help too. Battlefrenzied Shields and Luck do the rest.
Are you sure that it works everytime?
And leaving that alone, do you always know how many stacks would there be to make sure you won't get lots of casualities with bears?
You can stun for example, one vampire, then another reaches you, if you don't have luck enough to cripple him... and 5-6 bears kapput.
EDIT:
Question to all Sylvan Players...
Any nice creeping strategies if main hero isn't Ossir?
He bored me a lil'
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Anakrom
Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
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posted February 29, 2008 08:51 PM |
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Was I talking about shooters somewhere there O_O?
"And, dude, I was talking about shooter creeping" - here?
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Are you sure that it works everytime?
No, but after some playing you can get a picture of what you can and canīt - same for example with Orcs, which are familiar to you, assuming to your another posts on forums - I guess you donīt hesitate if you are playing them. Just rely on SL, Runes, Morale, Buffs like Haste or anything else and you will rarely have losses.
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Result matters
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DarkShadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted February 29, 2008 10:27 PM |
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IMHO the Inferno is totally hardest to master since their unit's die quickly and you need focus total on attack and nothing else or other faction's will stomp you, their creeping isn't much good either (don't start babbling about deleb, that ballista is stupid)only firehounds can do some real stuff and their magic's are among the weakest, unlike usually though their dark can't really do much and destruction is distant dream.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted March 01, 2008 01:37 AM |
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@Doomforge
Boredom is a good source of creativity Interesting reviewing the factions from a newbie's point of view.
@Lesij
Meh, most factions can clear those week 1. Karli was my favourite but alas spearwielders are nowhere near as good as shieldguards.
Using a firewall like that would be a waste. Moat is worse so he will leave and whether you cast the firewall on him or have him pass through it is one and the same - he will not remain in it.
I don't see where luck is needed, bears alone(after week 1) can do everything and they are not costly. No need for luck, as long as you take the longest route paw strike will usually trigger. Use a few hit and runs and hitting one stack after the other to keep them from playing - easy as pie. Especially with mass haste or leadership. When I creep with bears my casualties are few while most battles are flawless. Soldier's luck or not.
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Zenithale
Promising
Famous Hero
Zen Mind
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posted March 01, 2008 05:19 AM |
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Tough creeps such as thanes and shadow witches seemed hard to defeat week 3 but a few colossi with regeneration can tackle them.
During my first try on "Day of Colosus" I've attacked lot of Thanes start of week 2. I thought lose when I saw 2 stacks of flame thanes (+2 others stacks)...but I succeeded to win aid of the Defense skill.
Here the replay.
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IMO the hardest faction to mastery/play is Inferno, because:
-creatures too fragiles (the merest error and you lose a stack...)
-only 1 flyer and 1 shooter... Land mine is your worst enemy...
-gating needs precious time, contrary to the others passives racials skills.
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TWITCH|YouTube | NewArenas2023 MOD
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DarkShadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted March 01, 2008 09:16 AM |
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And don't forget that heroe's are bad with spell's.
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted March 01, 2008 10:09 AM |
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Edited by Lesij at 10:29, 01 Mar 2008.
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@Elvin- maybe you are right... I haven't been creeping with bears since TOTE came out.
Anyway, don't you think that using them is a bit costly and sometimes can be risky? You never know how many stacks would there be...
And another question- Ebba is the best if it comes to creeping then O_O
I have tried playing with harpooners (with haste and leader of course) and they do quite well too.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted March 01, 2008 01:23 PM |
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Yeah Ebba is pretty cool, with tactics she gets to block enemy archers easily as well. Thing is that they still fall week 1 which is a shame - at least she gets power of speed easily.
Anyway the only threat for bears is fast units as other bears, djinn sultans, grim raiders. And of course against really tough units like earth elementals you occasionally fail to paw strike them but you won't lose more than a few. On week 2 I never get more than 3 stacks against neutrals, how they are divided depends on your hero/army strength compared to the enemy you face. They must really be confident to split in 4 and that almost never happens.
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Lesij
Famous Hero
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posted March 01, 2008 01:41 PM |
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Edited by Lesij at 13:41, 01 Mar 2008.
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So how many stacks do you use???
Will one do?
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted March 01, 2008 01:47 PM |
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Of course, the more stacks you have the less total hp they have which in turn makes paw strike harder to trigger. Also it's better to kill a stack fast so you can run around, large units have limited mobility and the battlefield does not always help..
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Dreathtil
Tavern Dweller
Angels Call it Sin
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posted March 01, 2008 07:27 PM |
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Hardest Faction To play Inferno {Blarghz I Think Not}
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Tough creeps such as thanes and shadow witches seemed hard to defeat week 3 but a few colossi with regeneration can tackle them.
During my first try on "Day of Colosus" I've attacked lot of Thanes start of week 2. I thought lose when I saw 2 stacks of flame thanes (+2 others stacks)...but I succeeded to win aid of the Defense skill.
[url=http://www-physique.u-strasbg.fr/~dguincha/replay/tutoriel/3.0/thanes.sav]Here the replay.[/url]
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IMO the hardest faction to mastery/play is Inferno, because:
-creatures too fragiles (the merest error and you lose a stack...)
-only 1 flyer and 1 shooter... Land mine is your worst enemy...
-gating needs precious time, contrary to the others passives racials skills.
I Found To Playing Inferno To be fair I'm okay with it Maybe its jsut because Inferno's all about fast damage dealing rather then Defending Ground
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Craptisticula the Craptacular Craptical Crappicly Crapped Crap
No I'm not talking about me.
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Dreathtil
Tavern Dweller
Angels Call it Sin
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posted March 01, 2008 07:29 PM |
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Of course, the more stacks you have the less total hp they have which in turn makes paw strike harder to trigger. Also it's better to kill a stack fast so you can run around, large units have limited mobility and the battlefield does not always help..
I Found using Paw strike was nice during a seige or for protecting my vaulable ranged fighters i think the option of Paw strik is to move Pesky Units our of the way to keep ranged units attacking and offensive units from striking
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Craptisticula the Craptacular Craptical Crappicly Crapped Crap
No I'm not talking about me.
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