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| Thread: OMG You Guys Won't Believe This: Mother Owes For Illegal Downloads |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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mvassilev
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posted June 22, 2009 07:16 PM |
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We don't have to give up capitalism if we have nanotechnology. What gave you that idea?
And capitalism doesn't do anything to sharers. Under anarcho-capitalism, there would be no intellectual property at all.
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No software without a container for its data befor you can install it.
Yes, but if you copy something into your container, you own it.
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Eccentric Opinion
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TheDeath
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with serious business
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posted June 22, 2009 07:19 PM |
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We don't have to give up capitalism if we have nanotechnology. What gave you that idea?
People make such a fuss for duplicating software, imagine duplicating hardware. And then (less likely) any object!
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Under anarcho-capitalism, there would be no intellectual property at all.
Yes that is a strange form (that is, not mainstream) of capitalism. I'm talking about corporate capitalism here.
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del_diablo
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posted June 22, 2009 07:22 PM |
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Yes, but if you copy something into your container, you own it.
You own the CD, the content depends.
Look at it another way, if you bought it then its yours. You may have a infinetiv number of CD's with the content, but selling that would be plagiarism if the content is not yours. Copyleft = rule of the world.
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TheDeath
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posted June 22, 2009 07:25 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 19:26, 22 Jun 2009.
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Yes, but if you copy something into your container, you own it.
Mvass let's use a more basic analogy that everyone, not just software experts, can understand.
Do you know of a term called plagiarism? (it also remains after death of owner...) Right?
Ok. Some dude writes a book. His book is in the library. You rent it, share it, copy it, whatever. And give it back.
Yes you own the copy. So what you did was plagiarism? NO
I mean seriously... what is so hard to understand?
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mvassilev
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posted June 22, 2009 09:58 PM |
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People make such a fuss for duplicating software, imagine duplicating hardware.
To duplicate hardware, you need raw materials, so, if you were going to create, say, a Toyota Prius, you would need all the raw materials that go into a Toyota Prius - which is quite a lot, and would be beyond the reach of the average person.
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Yes that is a strange form (that is, not mainstream) of capitalism. I'm talking about corporate capitalism here.
Anarcho-capitalism is the purest form of capitalism there is.
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Yes you own the copy. So what you did was plagiarism?
No, because you don't claim it as your own original content.
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del_diablo
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posted June 22, 2009 10:07 PM |
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No, because you don't claim it as your own original content.
Neither does the file sharers.
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mvassilev
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posted June 22, 2009 10:23 PM |
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So is it okay to sell a burned CD if I don't claim that the content on it is my creation?
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
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posted June 22, 2009 10:44 PM |
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So is it okay to sell a burned CD if I don't claim that the content on it is my creation?
No.
Giving away/whatever in the same lane = Ok.
Selling it as empthy CDs = Ok, but they might get angry once they figur out he CD is used..........
Selling the content you do not own? That is the definition of making money of other peoples work.
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TheDeath
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posted June 22, 2009 11:31 PM |
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No, because you don't claim it as your own original content.
Exactly. And mind you that wasn't supposed to be a question because I already answered it 
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So is it okay to sell a burned CD if I don't claim that the content on it is my creation?
You can only sell what you own. I already said that before.
Finally starting to make sense uh?
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Rarensu
Known Hero
Formerly known as RTI
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posted June 23, 2009 10:54 AM |
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Edited by Rarensu at 10:57, 23 Jun 2009.
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We don't have to give up capitalism if we have nanotechnology. What gave you that idea?
People make such a fuss for duplicating software, imagine duplicating hardware. And then (less likely) any object!
Duplicating objects requires energy, even when using nanotech. Electricity will still have value and therefore capitalism will be based on ownership of potential energy. Solar panels won't help because sunlight rights will be bought and sold like mineral rights.Quote:
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"If a person accepts free pirated music, then even if there had been no pirate, they would still not have paid money. Instead they would simply go without the music."
Is this really a fair assumption? Do you really believe that this is 100% true?
Look at it another way:
*With youtube you listen to all sorts of music
*Would you have discovered that good music if there was no youtube?
*Most likely, very little of it
*Thus you would not have bought that much of it
Youtube is not much different from file sharing, it does the exact same job.
*no I don't, I listen to high-quality MP3s. youtube music sucks.
*I didn't use youtube to discover it
*there's very little that i find worth listening to on youtube
*I asked if the assumption was 100% true and so far it isn't
you are right though about that youtube is very similar to file sharing
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Sincerely,
A Proponent of Spelling, Grammar, Punctuation, and Courtesy.
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stankelbenet
Adventuring Hero
bringer of nostalgia & darknes
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posted June 23, 2009 12:14 PM |
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@Death: I'm glad that you took your time reading what I wrote and commented everything, but couldn't you at least answer the question I gave you? Quote:
What is your substitute to capitalism? Communism? Anarchism?
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LOL what do you mean we can't see atoms?
Of course, if you mean by "light", you are extremely ignorant of physics. Atoms are the building blocks that absorb and reflect light. It is because of atoms that you see the stuff you see. Also, visible light has a much larger wavelength than is possible to see atoms in resolution. You can see atoms with electron microscopes. (those use electron waves, not light, to detect them)
And sorry even if we can see or not atoms, if you can build anything out of air (i.e arrange air atoms into other atoms) then it doesn't really matter if you can see them, it matters that you can do "magic"
I would be happy to do this discussion with you but it's getting offtopic
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No I'm asking for PRECISE REASONING, not arguments like "law says it's ok, therefore it is ok". I'm asking WHY and I'm asking for PRECISE definitions. Saying "law says it's wrong" for me is lik saying "Bible says it's wrong, therefore it's wrong"
The strength of an argument is determined by the number of people supporting it. The source of this was "We're all thieves. We all breathe." as an answer to "My definition: acquiring a good without having produced or paid for it." A good has been created by mankind. Air is thereby not a good. Neither is water. If you mention the carbondioxide in the air I will track you down and slap you for your insolence Quote:
The thing is, you can. The exibithio creates the "people THEN know"-thingy, so you may sell it. How its sold is another matter(online auction is an example), heck you could have your own online store for it included in your homepage.
With the internet, its tricky because its too big. But if somebody likes it, they will spread it. That spreading is publicity, and there are collectors or people wanting art. It the correct treads hit correct, you got buyers. Its basicaly the same as the collectors friend went to your exibhition and stuff, and then told the vivid collector about it.
you are Probably right. Nothing compares to music industry.
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted June 23, 2009 03:42 PM |
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The strength of an argument is determined by the number of people supporting it.
Lol?
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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mvassilev
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted June 23, 2009 04:47 PM |
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You can only sell what you own.
*sigh*
You do own it, you just aren't the one who created it. If you buy a car, you haven't created it, right? But you still own it and can sell it.
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TheDeath
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posted June 23, 2009 04:56 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 16:56, 23 Jun 2009.
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Duplicating objects requires energy, even when using nanotech. Electricity will still have value and therefore capitalism will be based on ownership of potential energy. Solar panels won't help because sunlight rights will be bought and sold like mineral rights.
I absolutely do not see your point here. Are you suggesting that duplicating CDs or uploading stuff to the internet doesn't require energy too? (not to mention access to the internet, which requires an ISP or something)
So why do people make a fuss then?
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*no I don't, I listen to high-quality MP3s. youtube music sucks.
*I didn't use youtube to discover it
*there's very little that i find worth listening to on youtube
*I asked if the assumption was 100% true and so far it isn't
you are right though about that youtube is very similar to file sharing
I'm a soundtrack fanatic, and I wouldn't know about the music if I didn't watch movies for free (mostly at the TV mind you). Also quality DOES NOT MATTER because he was talking about a PREVIEW of the song.
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The strength of an argument is determined by the number of people supporting it.
haha so the Bible is true if enough people believe in it? If 99% of humanity says that the Earth is a square, you can imagine why I wouldn't assign that argument credibility at all, and neither would science or any objective measurement, right?
And mind you, most of the people with computers share. So your argument just turned around against you.
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A good has been created by mankind.
We cannot create anything, we can just arrange stuff that's already there. So, basically, someone must use air to make air products. Except that, you know, he uses more air than us. So does he steal more air? Is air free? Are all resources free? Nope. So who decides? Why does he have more right than me?
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del_diablo
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posted June 23, 2009 05:21 PM |
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You can only sell what you own.
*sigh*
You do own it, you just aren't the one who created it. If you buy a car, you haven't created it, right? But you still own it and can sell it.
But you can sell your copi, but not your addition of infinetiv amount of copies(unless you mesh em together or something).
Do we agree?
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TheDeath
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posted June 23, 2009 05:32 PM |
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*sigh*
You do own it, you just aren't the one who created it. If you buy a car, you haven't created it, right? But you still own it and can sell it.
Are you being constantly ignorant of what I say?
You only own the blank CD. You are not the owner of the "intellectual property". So yeah, you can sell it, for a blank CD. NOT for the data inside.
Because if you WERE owning the data, you would be committing plagiarism, the thing I mentioned before. This was the ENTIRE FREAKING POINT.
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mvassilev
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posted June 23, 2009 06:22 PM |
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You are only committing plagiarism if you claim the work as your own. If you say, "This CD contains data that was not my work" then it isn't plagiarism.
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TheDeath
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posted June 23, 2009 06:44 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 18:45, 23 Jun 2009.
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If you say, "This CD contains data that was not my work" then it isn't plagiarism.
*sigh*
I'm speechless. Let's take it easy:
1) You CANNOT sell what you do not OWN.
2) You can't commit plagiarism.
These two simple rules would explain what you ask. If you say that the data is not your work, then it's not YOURS, so you can't sell it.
It would be like selling an entire house, which was yours, but also with all the furniture in it, which WAS NOT YOURS. You CANNOT sell such a house full, you must get the furniture out first.
As for your question, yes it would not be plagiarism. But you would be 'violating' rule 1. The rules must apply BOTH at the same time, not EITHER one of them.
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mvassilev
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posted June 23, 2009 07:10 PM |
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1) You CANNOT sell what you do not OWN.
But if the institution of intellectual property would not exist, then you would own it, wouldn't you?
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TheDeath
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posted June 23, 2009 07:12 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 19:13, 23 Jun 2009.
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But if the institution of intellectual property would not exist, then you would own it, wouldn't you?
See rule #2. Seriously are you doing this intentionally?
Do that and it is plagiarism and you violate rule #2. Do the opposite (not claim it as your own but still sell it) and you violate rule #1. BOTH MUST APPLY.
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