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Oh no, Moonlith thinks I'm an abomination.    I am amazed to this day you even read my comments, with me being one of the barbaric Americans you take just about every opportunity to snipe at, and even more surprised that you seem to think I care what your opinion of me is.

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Oh, as to the part about America pushing Japan into attacking the US, that has to be one of the most insane conspiracy theories I've come across.  Then again, I suppose anything is possible for the evil Americans.  

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Oh one last thing, Japan attacked the U.S.A. but YOU didn't hit them back. YOU don't have any relations to what happened back then. Keep that in mind and we don't have to suffer yet another stupid war.

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First thing it says is, that it is okay to kill so many civilians in a war, until a government is pressed to surrender.
Killing civilians in order to bring a country to surrender is no war, but terror. Justifying it is justifying terror.

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While the actual course taken is a shame - it may have saved a lot of lives indeed, but not Japanese and American, but those of half the world: without that awful demonstration, sooner or later someone WOULD have decided to drop the freaking thing, and "later" would have meant, it might not have been done with two.

In my eyes this is the ONLY redeeming thing here. Hiroshima and Nagasaki may have saved the world a nuclear holocaust later on - not that the Trumaan government could claim that as a merit.

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Fact is that you have not presented any evidence that most historians say FDR provoked Japan into attacking the US. And I dispute your claim. Frankly I find "Pearl Harbor truthism" to be about as loony as "9-11 truthism."

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The Pearl Harbor Controversy

This, Vidal concludes, gave Imperial Japan no option but war. Furthermore, FDR knew exactly what he was doing.

James’ response was thorough and devastating. In his formulation, “Japan was provoked into war by the Japanese Army.” FDR did not demand that Japan withdraw from China; he demanded that Japan withdraw from French Indo-China (today’s Vietnam) which they had invaded the year before in order to block all imports into China. In return, FDR offered to stop interfering in Asian affairs altogether. Furthermore, the Axis powers were obliged to enter into war on each other’s behalf if they were attacked first. If Japan attacked the US unprovoked, Germany and Italy would have no obligation to attack. In fact, Japan did not support Germany against the USSR after Hitler invaded that country during “Operation Barbarossa” in June 1941

James had a reason to be passionate on this point: a native Australian, he lost his father in the war, and was well aware throughout his childhood that Imperial Japan had its sights set on his home as well. He had another reason as well: Clive James regarded Vidal as one of his greatest influences, and was horrified to see his mentor fall so low. As it happened, Vidal had lower to go yet. A year after the exchange between Vidal and James, the United States was attacked again: on September 11, 2001, in Pennsylvania, Washington D.C., and New York City. Once again, Vidal was there to claim that the U.S. government saw it coming all along.

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Since you have not retracted you claim I took the effort of doing the research to prove you wrong. The person Bush allegedly made the comments to denied that Bush said what was attributed to him, and of course Bush denied that he made the statements as well. Unfortunately anti-Bush liars have continually repeated the lie that you apparently heard.

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I encourage you to do actual research instead of saying, "to the best of my knowledge Bush/America did..."

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@Moonlith: Please stop referring to anyone with the word sheep. It seems to have become a new favorite word for leftists and it has been thrown around much too carelessly to be allowable in any kind of discussion. I just feel that some of the Democrat supporters have become a flock themselves shouting "SHEEP!" at everyone else and that just eclipses the truth and correctness of the policies they stand for.

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How is putting me in the "leftist democrate" box any different from me putting others in a "sheep" box?

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Your claim that Americans should have just let more Americans die at the hands of Japanese aggressors is worse than simplistic.

Sorry, but the job of the American government is to preserve American lives. The war was of Japan's choosing, not America's. Japan is the one that attacked America to start the war. America ended the war with the bombs and saved both American and Japanese lives.

Millions of lives would have been lost in an American invasion of Japan, which is what would have occured had not Japan surrendered, as it did after the second atomic bomb was dropped.

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This is simply a lie.

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You are wrong with the axis. Strategic bombing egainst Britain was straight against military targets - airfields, early warning stations, airplane factories - with the sole purpose to destroy the RAF to get air superiority over the Channel.

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The Blitz was the sustained bombing of Britain by Nazi Germany between 7 September 1940 and 10 May 1941,[1] during the Second World War. The Blitz hit many towns and cities across the country, but it began with the bombing of London for 76 consecutive nights.[5] By the end of May 1941, over 43,000 civilians, half of them in London, had been killed by bombing and more than a million houses destroyed or damaged in London alone.[6][7]

London was not the only city to suffer Luftwaffe bombing during the Blitz. Other important military and industrial centres, such as Aberdeen, Barrow-in-Furness, Belfast, Bootle, Birkenhead, Wallasey, Birmingham, Bristol, Cardiff, Clydebank, Coventry, Exeter, Greenock, Sheffield, Swansea, Liverpool (the most heavily bombed British city outside London),[8] Hull, Manchester, Portsmouth, Plymouth, Nottingham, Brighton, Eastbourne, Sunderland and Southampton, suffered heavy air raids and high numbers of casualties.

Smaller bombing raids were made on Edinburgh, Newcastle, York, Exeter and Bath. Oxford was not bombed because Adolf Hitler wanted it to be his capital; Blackpool also escaped heavy bomb damage as Hitler wanted to use it for his entertainment.[9][10] Hitler's aim was to destroy British civilian and government morale.

Its intended goal of demoralizing the British into surrender unachieved,[11] the Blitz did little to facilitate potential German invasion. By May 1941, the imminent threat of an invasion of Britain had passed and Hitler's attention was focused on the east. Although the Germans never again managed to bomb Britain on such a large scale, they carried out smaller attacks throughout the war, taking the civilian death toll to 51,509 from bombing. In 1944, the development of pilotless V-1 flying bombs and V-2 rockets briefly enabled Germany to again attack London with weapons launched from the European continent. In total, the V weapons killed 8,938 civilians in London and the south-east.[

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Millions of lives would have been lost in an American invasion of Japan, which is what would have occured had not Japan surrendered, as it did after the second atomic bomb was dropped.

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You are wrong with the axis. Strategic bombing egainst Britain was straight against military targets - airfields, early warning stations, airplane factories - with the sole purpose to destroy the RAF to get air superiority over the Channel.

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Sorry, but your apologetics for Germany fails since your statements are false. Germany bombed civilian population centers in Britian constantly. And we all know what sort of mass murder would have followed had they conquered Britian.

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Hitler's No. 17 Directive, issued 1 August 1940 on the conduct of war against England specifically prohibited Luftwaffe from conducting terror raids on its own initiative, and reserved the right of ordering terror attacks as means of reprisal for the Führer himself,[155]

The war against England is to be restricted to destructive attacks against industry and air force targets which have weak defensive forces.... The most thorough study of the target concerned, that is vital points of the target, is a pre-requisite for success. It is also stressed that every effort should be made to avoid unnecessary loss of life amongst the civilian population.[156]
The Luftwaffe offensive against Britain had included numerous raids on major ports since August, but Hitler had issued a directive London was not to be bombed save on his sole instruction.[157] However, on the afternoon of 15 August, Hauptmann Walter Rubensdörffer leading Erprobungsgruppe 210 mistakenly bombed the Croydon airfield (on the outskirts of London) instead of the intended target, RAF Kenley;[158] this was followed on the night of 23/24 August[129] by the accidental bombing of Harrow, also on the outskirts of London, as well as raids on Aberdeen, Bristol, and South Wales. The focus on attacking airfields had also been accompanied by a sustained bombing campaign which begun on 24 August with the largest raid so far killing 100 in Portsmouth, and that evening the first night raid on London as described above.[141],

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On the 25. of August 1940, 81 bombers of Bomber Command were sent out to raid industrial and commercial targets in Berlin. Cloud prevented accurate identification and the bombs fell across the city, causing some casualties amongst the civilian population as well as damage to residential areas.[159] Continuing RAF raids on Berlin in retaliation

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led to Hitler withdrawing his directive,[160] and on 3 September Göring planned to bomb London daily, with Kesselring's enthusiastic support, having received reports the average strength of RAF squadrons was down to five or seven fighters out of 12 and their airfields in the area were out of action. Hitler issued a directive on 5 September to attack cities including London.[161][162] In his speech delivered on the 4 September 1940, Hitler threatened to obliterate (ausradieren) British cities if British bombing runs against Germany did not stop.

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Your defense of Hitler makes me puke. Hitler personally authorized the development the atomic bomb and of a bomber capable of reaching New York with a nuclear bomb. The allies managed to destroy research facilities on three different occasions which perhaps helped prevent such developments from being carried out in time.

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In 1932 the shah offended Britain by canceling the agreement under which the Anglo-Persian Oil Company produced and exported Iran's oil. Although a new and improved agreement was eventually signed, it did not satisfy Iran's demands and left bad feeling on both sides. To counterbalance British and Soviet influence, Reza Shah encouraged German commercial enterprise in Iran. On the eve of World War II, Germany was Iran's largest trading partner.

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In 1931, he refused to allow Imperial Airways to fly in Persian airspace, instead giving the concession to German-owned Lufthansa Airlines. The next year he surprised the British by unilaterally canceling the oil concession awarded William Knox D'Arcy (then called Anglo-Persian Oil Company), which was slated to expire in 1961. The concession granted Persia 16% of the net profits from APOC oil operations. The Shah wanted 21%. Following a brief challenge by the British before the League of Nations, the British acquiesced.

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52.5% of the Anglo-Persian-Oil-Company was owned by thestate of Britain. State of Iran had no part. The contract would allow 16% from the PROFIT for the Iran. However, Iran had no control about the way how the profit was calculated. APOC had contracts with separate companies for transport, refinement and selling of the oil and its products which would charge APOC their "services". By determining freely the prices for those services, the profit marge for Iran could be "determined", and so it's no wonder, that the government of Britain earned a multiple from the profit share Iran got, alone from the TAXES APOC paid.

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One area of modernization his regime failed in was public health. According to historian Ervand Abrahamian, with the exception of Abadan, an oil company town, Iranian cities "saw little of modern medicine and sanitation in terms of sewage, piped water, or medical facilities" under Reza Shah's reign. "Infant mortality remained high... Even the capital had fewer than 40 registered doctors.",

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Reza Schah's fourth big task was the setup of a public health system. 1929 public vaccination against pox, malaria and trachoma started. 1926 an agency for public health was started that became the ministry of health later on. From 1932 onwards all doctors had to undergo a qualification procedure to be allowed to practise. In all province capitals, hospitals were built. The Red Lion (Persian Red Cross) was founded as were houses for orphans and widows.

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Iran is a threat because they want everyone on the globe to bow to Allah. The Islamic "revolution." They call the US the "Great Satan" and Isreal the "little Satan." They would love to destroy both and the all nations that won't bow to Allah. Iran funds and backs terrorism and their lunatic president would surely use nukes if he got hiw hands on them.

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Then again, perhaps he doesn't deserve any slack, he is a politician afterall and they all tend to be scum.

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Not that I believe all of what I am going to type here, but it's just as easy to spin this and replace countries names and still be slightly factually accurate.

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