|
|
Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
|
posted September 01, 2011 02:54 PM |
|
|
I agree with Eloding within reason of course ( ). You have to understand that an undisciplined parent will never be able to raise their children to be disciplined no matter how much they 'beat' them.
Punishment is not the only factor to being a good parent and establishing discipline, this is obvious, but still I see some of you incapable of grasping that.  .
I've had numerous discussions as to whether compulsory education is 'good' or 'bad'. It would be logical to assume that if all kids are educated then this would breed a 'smart' nation, a place where even a bricklayer or the bin-man knows science and arithmetic.
Knowledge comes from experience, because the results are irrefutable. (to yourself of course)
It would be the greatest of errors to assume that an uneducated man is unintelligent, to do so would be like spitting your ancestors in the face.
That's something to ponder.
As for you JJ:
Quote:
You spoil a child by treating them like kings and queens, while mom and dad are the servants.
"Children today are tyrants. They contradict thier parents, gobble their food, and tyrannize their teachers."
Socrates (Greek [Athenian] philosopher, 470-399 B.C.)
____________
"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
|
|
TheBaron
Promising
Known Hero
dreamer of dreams
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 03:44 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
I've seen in my lifetime how the biggest problems in public schools went from being talking in class and an occasional spit-ball to murders, rapes, and domination of schools by gangs where teachers are afraid to teach and the "good" students live in fear.
"Children today are tyrants. They contradict thier parents, gobble their food, and tyrannize their teachers."
Socrates (Greek [Athenian] philosopher, 470-399 B.C.)
Elodin's been alive a looooong time
____________
"My favorite" - Jean-
Baptiste Emmanuel Zorg.
|
|
Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 04:33 PM |
|
Edited by Fauch at 16:34, 01 Sep 2011.
|
Quote:
some things are inescapable, and it's unimportant whether you like it or not - there is just no other option.
sounds like slavery. but well, that's probably what slaves were told. I guess it depends what you call inevitable. if you are talking about the social order for example, it's like telling them :"don't try to improve things, you are just going to fail anyway"
Quote:
I've had numerous discussions as to whether compulsory education is 'good' or 'bad'. It would be logical to assume that if all kids are educated then this would breed a 'smart' nation, a place where even a bricklayer or the bin-man knows science and arithmetic.
actually that is one of the problem. people studied sciences, are smart, and end up working as a "bin-man" because there isn't work for everyone. of course realising that, some students come to the conclusion that it's not worth wasting their time in school.
another problem is that working as a "bin-man" is considered lowly, or even as a failure. people who studied seriously don't want to work that kind of jobs because it's not enough prestigious, or enough paid.
there is a problem with values nowadays where it seems that the most important isn't the usefulness of the work (the most fundamental jobs are far from being the best paid) but the amount of money generated by the work, despite that money by itself has little utility value (ok it is used for exchange, but everything can be used for exchange. a car is useful because you can drive it, but what can you do with money? make piles of it?)
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 04:45 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
some things are inescapable, and it's unimportant whether you like it or not - there is just no other option.
sounds like slavery. but well, that's probably what slaves were told. I guess it depends what you call inevitable. if you are talking about the social order for example, it's like telling them :"don't try to improve things, you are just going to fail anyway"
No, Fauch, it's called DEPENDANCY, because that's what children are, bause that's what we are talking about. And because they are dependant, they have no other option than to do what they are told and go to school, because that's the way to become independant.
|
|
Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 05:17 PM |
|
|
that's not the way to be dependant as if it was the only one.
it's like for spanking, you could very well say that school is actually bad and achieves the contrary of what it is supposed to do.
actually, you hear some stories about children who live in harsh conditions and can't go to school because they are too busy trying to survive and who would be much more mature and independent than children who go to school.
we could even reverse things. doesn't school actually teach you to be dependent? people like saying they are independent, but it's such an illusion, you are always dependent on someone else, unless maybe you built your house yourself, you make your own clothes, you produce your own food, etc... actually, I think it rather aims at teaching you how to make other people dependent on you.
on the subject of spoiled children, what about advertisers? it's in their best interest to encourage the spoiiling of children. all day they are reminded of all the sweet things they can have if mom or dad agrees to open his/her purse. desires usually don't come from nowhere.
|
|
Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 05:29 PM |
|
|
Quote:
another problem is that working as a "bin-man" is considered lowly, or even as a failure. people who studied seriously don't want to work that kind of jobs because it's not enough prestigious, or enough paid.
A failure? their providing a valuable service to the community, they are needed, I don't consider that as a failure. Those that have the ability to achieve more however, have no excuse in taking jobs from those who can only do so much.
____________
"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 05:37 PM |
|
|
Huh?
You ARE dependant as a child, Fauch, whether you want that or not, and your parents plus the society you live in make it possible that you can visit a school with the purpose to learn all the things necessary that will allow you to become your own man or woman in the future.
If that wasn't the case, you would have to work for your survival: prostitute yourself, weave rugs, beg, steal, whatever.
Going to school is basically the work you do INSTEAD, while your parents make sure that you are ed and clothed and you have it nice and comfy.
For advertisement, that's called capitalism, and it doesn't spoil only children, but grown-ups as well: Lots of people nowadays can imagine better things than caring for children - or work, for that matter.
|
|
Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 05:37 PM |
|
Edited by Fauch at 17:52, 01 Sep 2011.
|
ah? and what do you mean with "achieving more"?
Quote:
Lots of people nowadays can imagine better things than caring for children - or work, for that matter.
funny that they get to work more for it
so clever from capitalism, making people work more so that they can buy what they need to forget the boredom of work
yeah of course, you are dependent as a child. you are always dependent, that's what I was saying. if you want to call yourself independent, go live on your own in the middle of a forest and see how long you can survive.
children have to learn things. but why from school? why not from parents? of course some parents can't be bothered, and I guess that doesn't make them very good parents, or they don't have the time because they have to work. that's funny how we make children, or friends, or decide to live with someone, but we don't have time for them because work is more important. it's like people are more faithful to their work than to their wife or their children. you might say that work is a contribution to the society, but if each individual in the society is sacrificing himself for his job, neglecting people that should be important to him, how does it make ths society better??
|
|
markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 05:59 PM |
bonus applied by Corribus on 01 Sep 2011. |
Edited by markkur at 18:16, 01 Sep 2011.
|
I was an abused child a few times, so, I'm not in favor of "let the beatings commence" As a matter of fact, I mentioned "age" but that drew zero notice. I think any sensible parent is about breaking any bad links in the parental-generational-chain and perserving anything good.
Dispite the extreme stuff, I survived with a mixed bag of goodies and not-so-goods. The reason was; I was too old to be getting physical discipline and I began to revolt due to my sense of justice. I never hit my Father but I began to think about it and came very close.
I don't know how many Parents are commenting here but I will share more details about my view of the "rod".
1. The rod is in existance before your children. It was a ping-pong paddle for me. My Hands were never to be used (chain-breaker)for anything but loving. Some here may scoff at this, but sadly i think it an important safe-guard in this <imo>violent-age. (c'mon, killing and beating is highly-accepted entertainment...GIGO anyone?) Too many people cannot switch roles, and if a guy is having a tough time of it on the job they HAVE to swtich when Daddy is called on to act like an intelligent Father and not dish out his life's frustrations at the moment of discipline. Also the Paddle is a fixture in the house just like there is a Police department in a neighborhood. Any person that has anger issues must never consider the Rod. Period. Do the much beloved time-out, you've no choice, because the time-out is for the parent in this case.
2. Again, age is all-important and spanking is defined as a couple of smarting swats to the butt. Nothing more. This is for a small child and not to be considered for an adolescent. I think that is where things head south...very fast.
Parenting 101 should follow something like this;
a. The child is 4-6 years (supposed to be the all-important defining years)of age and has done something...very bad for the first time. You council the child on why that is unacceptable behavior and state;" I will tell you this once" and mean it. None of that "I'm not going to tell you again"... as you do so for the umptenth time. You prove yourself a lier.
"Broken-record" means the child knows you are not going to say or act any different about discipline. There is not going to be a summit-meeting every time the child thinks their justice and not the parents should be ruling the world.
OK, then the child does not give a flip, does the act again and hurts another kid anyway.
b. You remind them of the previous warning and paddle the defying butt and send the child to their room. They have to stew for about 15 mins or 1/2 hr.
c. You then come in, sit down and leave the paddle and the Warden outside the room. Retrace the collective actions and show affection to your child by teaching about the separation of people and actions. There are volumes written about this, but the bottom-line is to inform the child they are loved, this was about their actions, not them. You make it clear the incident is over and then convey that you "expect" them to listen to your warning and avoid this event.
Does this work? For some kids it can work well. I did it once (about a rebellious electrical experiment)and never had to do it again. Does it work for every child? No. You can have a child where nothing seems to make an impact. It's like trying to make a Golem, sensitive to others.
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 06:00 PM |
|
|
You have been to school, or are still at it, while your parents have made sure you can, and that's the only reason why you can sit now in front of your pc and complain about how sucky school is.
If you want your parents to teach you - who's going to earn the money for your family while they are at it? Who has taught your parents what to teach you?
That's how it was made in earlier times without school, and that's how animals are doing it.
If you want to back to that state or times, be prepared not to find many who want to join you.
That doesn't mean, school cannot be better.
But that's no reason not to go. If it WAS a reason, nothing would ever be done, because everything can be made better, and nothing is ever perfect.
However, changes don't happen from one second to another - they take time.
|
|
Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 06:23 PM |
|
Edited by Corribus at 18:29, 01 Sep 2011.
|
Indeed, Elodin, you are right that I have not cited any studies in support of my opinion about spanking. That's because I know that citing studies I haven't read is useless and often misleading, particularly in a scientific field I know little about.
See, the difference between you and I, Elodin, is that I recognize when my opinion on a matter is... well, just an opinion. I've no idea what the collective body of social science says about truancy or spanking children - and I don't try to represent myself as knowing. You, on the other hand, find a single media report of a single study and think yourself an expert, and you speak as if scientists have reached a consensus - based on a single study.
But OK, I’ll humor you, Elodin. I did a quick literature search with only a single word: spanking. On the first page of hits, I turned up several research articles which link spanking or corporal punishment with negative outcomes. Here they are, along with abstracts.
(1)
M. A. Straus, D. B. Sugarman, J. Giles-Sims. Spanking by Parents and Subsequent Antisocial Behavior of Children. Arch Pediatr Adolesc Med. 1997;151(8):761-767.
Abstract: When parents use corporal punishment to reduce antisocial behavior (ASB), the long-term effect tends to be the opposite. The findings suggest that if parents replace corporal punishment by nonviolent modes of discipline, it could reduce the risk of ASB among children and reduce the level of violence in American society.
(2)
Z. Strassberg, K. A. Dodge, G. S. Pettita and J. E. Bates. Spanking in the home and children's subsequent aggression toward kindergarten peers. Development and Psychopathology (1994), 6: 445-461.
Abstract: Although spanking of children is almost universal in U.S. society, its effects are not well understood. We examined the longitudinal relation between parental spanking and other physical punishment of preschool children and children's aggressive behavior toward peers later in kindergarten. A total of 273 boys and girls from diverse backgrounds served as subjects. The findings were consistent with a socialization model in which higher levels of severity in parental punishment practices are associated with higher levels of children's subsequent aggression toward peers. Findings indicated that children who had been spanked evidenced levels of aggression that were higher than those who had not been spanked, and children who had been the objects of violent discipline became the most aggressive of all groups. Patterns were qualified by the sexes of the parent and child and subtypes of child aggression (reactive, bullying, and instrumental). The findings suggest that in spite of parents' goals, spanking fails to promote prosocial development and, instead, is associated with higher rates of aggression toward peers.
(3)
R.E. Larzelere. Moderate spanking: Model or deterrent of children's aggression in the family? Journal of Family Violence. 1986, vol 1, #1, 27-36.
Abstract: Previous research has rarely distinguished among the effects of minimal, moderate, and severe physical punishment on children''s antisocial aggression. Using a nationally representative sample, this study compared the effects of different frequencies of physical punishment on children''s reported physical aggression against other family members. In addition, the interaction of parental reasoning with physical punishment was examined. All analyses were repeated for preschoolers, preadolescents, and adolescents. The results generally indicated a linear positive association between physical punishment and child aggression. For preadolescent and adolescent aggression toward the parent, however, this association depended upon parental use of reasoning, such that spanking had a minimal effect on aggression for frequent reasoners. The combination of infrequent reasoning and frequent spanking was associated with dramatically increased aggression. The conclusion emphasizes additional unresolved issues about the effects of spanking, particularly the ambiguous direction of causal influence between parent and child.
(4)
H. L. MacMillan, M. H. Boyle, M. Y.-Y. Wong, E. K. Duku, J. E. Fleming, C. A. Walsh. Slapping and spanking in childhood and its association with lifetime prevalence of psychiatric disorders in a general population sample. Canadian Medical Association Journal. 1999, vol 166, #7, 805-809.
(This one you can read for free, actually: http://www.cmaj.ca/content/161/7/805.full?ijkey=5ecceff672d8128717d871d9d6a0038e31d4b858)
Abstract: There appears to be a linear association between the frequency of slapping and spanking during childhood and a lifetime prevalence of anxiety disorder, alcohol abuse or dependence and externalizing problems.
(5)
E. P. Slade and L. S. Wissow. Spanking in Early Childhood and Later Behavior Problems: A Prospective Study of Infants and Young Toddlers. Pediatrics Vol. 113 No. 5 May 1, 2004. pp. 1321 -1330.
Abstract: Conclusion. Among white non-Hispanic children but not among black and Hispanic children, spanking frequency before age 2 is significantly and positively associated with child behavior problems at school age. These findings are consistent with those reported in studies of children older than 2 years but extend these findings to children who are spanked beginning at a relatively early age.
----
So. Does that mean that the verdict has been rendered? Not really. I did not post any articles which conclude the opposite, that spanking is NOT linked with negative outcomes – although from a very informal evaluation of the search results I’d have to say that the former outweigh the latter fairly significantly. In fact, of the first twelve hits, only one (the Gunnoe study) appeared to find a lack of association between spanking and negative outcomes. Furthermore, I'll readily admit that I have not actually read any of those articles – although I did read the abstracts. I think these articles lend support to my position, but given that scientists haven’t reached any absolute consensus on the issue (there are still studies going on, after all), it seems silly for me to declare the matter to be scientifically settled.
That aside, however, I’d like to know what Elodin has to say about the topic now. He posted a media report of a single study and seems to be willing to rely on that in order to render final judgment. I’ve now posted FIVE articles which conclude the opposite - and none of them are filtered through the media. Are you willing to rely on those, Elodin, and reverse your opinion? Or at least acknowledge that you might be wrong and that spanking maybe isn’t the best way to punish children? That maybe the scientific literature doesn’t, on the whole, support your opinion? That maybe spanking could be associated with negative outcomes in many cases?
Well, I think we all know the answer to those questions, don’t we? <grin> I suspect that, just as Elodin didn’t reply to TheBaron’s analysis of the Gunnoe study, he’ll not respond to these five studies either.
Fact is that enlightenment is as much about what you don't know as it is about what you do. Understanding the limitations of one's knowledge is the first step toward self-improvement. Respecting the complexity of scientific problems helps a person keep an open mind, allows one to change his or her behaviors in the wake of new information.
You can boil it down to this: the enlightened man acquires information and then forms a conclusion supported by that information. It is a fool who forms a conclusion and then specifically looks for information which supports it.
|
|
Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 08:40 PM |
|
|
Quote:
You have been to school, or are still at it, while your parents have made sure you can, and that's the only reason why you can sit now in front of your pc and complain about how sucky school is.
don't exagerate, school is indeed useful to some degree, but after a while you spend most of your time learning things you don't care about, will never need and will forget.
of course it can be beneficial to present a vast variety of subjects to children, but if they aren't interested, why bother them? it's not like they can't learn about it later if ever they get interested one day.
though, we can see that many people just stop learning anything as soon as they leave school. there are also people who seem to think it is too late to learn once you left school.
what if you just let the children look for what interests them instead of making them bored by forcing them to listen to stuffs they don't care about?
you might say that if you leave them free, they'll just spend the whole time watching their TV or computer. yeah maybe. that's funny because people who work have no time to learn, but when they stop working, it's like they can't be bothered?? does it mean the force or the necessity would be the only way?
but that's pointless. why are you working, or learning, if you are forced? you aren't interested in what you do, you aren't going to give your best.
Quote:
If you want your parents to teach you - who's going to earn the money for your family while they are at it?
why do they have to work so much anyway? and it's not like they should spend years teaching you advanced mathematics, but they probably can teach you the basics. though it's true that school works well too, so a combined action of both could be for the best.
Quote:
Who has taught your parents what to teach you?
you could say the same about school. like corribus said, something crucial would be to teach people how to make the difference between facts and opinions. that's the best way. instead of trying to find the ultimate omniscient teacher, you should be able to disagree with him and share your point of view. from what I've seen in school, it doesn't work that way. maybe the teachers wouldn't actually mind, but the puppils are too used to just listen and register.
school should better learn you how to learn, the current system doesn't seem very efficient.
Quote:
That doesn't mean, school cannot be better.
But that's no reason not to go.
and what if you find a better way for yourself?
|
|
The_Gootch
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 09:30 PM |
|
|
Aha! I've broken the Elodin code, or at least part of it.
Liberal is Elodin code for bachelor's degree.
Loony Liberal is Elodin code for master's degree.
Loony Liberal Liar is Elodin code for PhD.
More to come later.
____________
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 01, 2011 10:14 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
That doesn't mean, school cannot be better.
But that's no reason not to go.
and what if you find a better way for yourself?
If you can go that way without depending on your parents and within the limits of the law - fine.
|
|
TheBaron
Promising
Known Hero
dreamer of dreams
|
|
posted September 02, 2011 01:35 AM |
|
|
@Corribus. I don't want to gang up on Elodin, but that really was a beautifully worded response.
____________
"My favorite" - Jean-
Baptiste Emmanuel Zorg.
|
|
Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
|
|
posted September 02, 2011 03:11 AM |
|
Edited by Elodin at 03:20, 02 Sep 2011.
|
I seem to have upset the hive mind. The drones are on the attack! Buzz buzzz angry little liberal drones, buzz buzzzz!
Quote:
Elly, isn't "Liberal" a rather political term?
I am Elodin. Elly is a female name and I am a man. I would thank you to use my name instead of distorting it. "Liberal" is the proper terminology for one who does not have the spine to be a parent and discipline his child. Generally liberals think of themselves as elitists who know best how to run everyone else's lives. They think the entire human race for all of recorded history has been wrong about how to raise children and that liberals alone have the truth of how to rear kids properly. Being caught up in liberalism is akin to being caught up in a cult.
Quote:
I have met a fair share of kids that were just... impossible. Talking to them was to no avail. The parents were actually terrorized by their own kids. It's not nice to see a parent actually insulted by a 5yo kid in public. I think a good beating can do miracles. Lol. No, they weren't ADHD - they were spoiled.
As have I. Not uncommon at all in encountering such things in law enforcement. The parents did not love them enough to discipline them and now they have a monster on their hands, as does society.
Quote:
I'm going have to go ahead and disagree with almost everything you've said there. Those last two paragraphs are especially indicative of an ignorance in the subjects you're talking about. This kind of outlook is often parroted by people who are out of touch and don't understand, appreciate or care to investigate the social issues they are commenting on. Presenting a hackneyed line and some misquoted information from a politically biased media outlet is not good arguing. You've also made a stab at 'liberals' by saying that they are failures as parents, which you have presented no evidence for.
I have raised 4 children, I have grandchildren, and I taught at a private school for two years. And as someone in law enforcement I have dealt with many products of liberal parenthood. It is you sir who appear to be ignorant of the subject. Your speech is merely an expression of the hive mind expressed by daytime TV talk show liberal drones who not only won't spank their own children but who demand that no one else should be allowed to spank their own children. Liberalism is the single most destructive force in the world today. It corrupts people and nations and hinders the advancement of mankind.
Actually, I did present evidence. Read the articles.
Quote:
The movement towards permissive parenting came from the realisation that authoritative parenting was completely unsatisfactory and inappropriate for a new age, and that generations of strict parents were producing generations of emotionally crippled children.
Oh yes, surely all of mankind were delusional idiots for all of recorded history until liberals came along to teach us how to raise children. Heeee heee.
I submit to you that it is liberalism that produces emotional cripples, not being spanked. Liberalism produces a cycle of dependence that just keeps going and going and going. Most of mankind has been spanked, by the way so you are saying most of mankin is emotionally crippled.
Quote:
It would just make me smile if you considered the possibility that beating our children might not be the best way of making them feel like school is a good idea.
Anyone who told you I ever said anyone should beat a child is a liar. Spanking is not beating.
Also remember that I have said things like grounding a child or taking away video games can be good discipline whereas you ruled out the traditional method of discipline called spanking that all of our ancestors used.
@Baklava
Actually I am the one who was calling for civility but Corribus just told be to grow a thick skin, allowed more personal jabs,and began doing some jabbing of his own. If my fearless moderator leader prefers the OSM be a place for personal attacks there is nothing I can do about it.
@JJ
Quote:
In plain words: It's complete and utter ****.
I'd say that sums up permissive liberal parenting.
@TheBaron
Quote:
Elodin's been alive a looooong time
Yes, and that certainly is a factor in my great wisdom.
@Fauch
Quote:
on the subject of spoiled children, what about advertisers? it's in their best interest to encourage the spoiiling of children. all day they are reminded of all the sweet things they can have if mom or dad agrees to open his/her purse. desires usually don't come from nowhere.
Liberal parents need to learn the word "no" and actually use it sometimes. Instead we see liberals try to pass laws outlawing happy meals because they don't have the spine to tell their children "no."
@JJ
Quote:
For advertisement, that's called capitalism, and it doesn't spoil only children, but grown-ups as well
No advertisement can make you buy anything for yourself or your children. Look in the mirror and practice saying the word "no." Say it with emphasis. Maybe that will help you.
@Corribus and others
I'll have to reply to you tomorrow or Saturday. I'm quite busy with my largest business expansion ever. Getting up in the wee hours and often working late. Such is the life of an evil capitalist pig. But I'm taking the weekend off, including Monday so you won't need to feel neglected for too terribly long.
|
|
TheBaron
Promising
Known Hero
dreamer of dreams
|
|
posted September 02, 2011 03:21 AM |
|
Edited by TheBaron at 03:25, 02 Sep 2011.
|
I knew I was being optimistic about his attitude. 
Quote:
by the way so you are saying most of mankin(sic) is emotionally crippled.
Well if you're any example, then perhaps yes.
____________
"My favorite" - Jean-
Baptiste Emmanuel Zorg.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted September 02, 2011 03:46 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Oh yes, surely all of mankind were delusional idiots for all of recorded history until liberals came along to teach us how to raise children. Heeee heee.
Technically, the "child" didn't exist until JJ Rousseau. Not that you actually care about the status of the child throughout history.
The little "heeee heeee" with four e's is kind of sickening somehow.
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 02, 2011 10:37 AM |
|
|
If that's sickening, what would you call the rest of that post?
Anyway, modern society has more factors that play a role, when it comes to wrong education and spoiling.
For example, all double-working parents I know have a bad conscience about that and tend to be lenient because of that. They know, that somehow child or children and parents are missing time with each other, and often it's difficult for them (or they simply don't have the energy anymore) to make up for that in terms of time together in the evening and on weekends.
Consequently they tend to be lenient, since they blame themselves when the kids are "doing wrong".
Then there are the Grandparents - often a very "bad" influence. They tend to try and "make up" for everything they feel they may have done wrong with their own children. Also, they can retreat from every problem, when they want to - pick the resins, so-to-speak, since they don't have to be with the kids all the time. For Grandparents, being with the grandchildren is somewhat "Sunday" event, and they tend to hopelessly spoil the brats.
Then there may be familiar problems (ending in divorce). Parents need to have a united stance for effective education, but when it comes to trouble, cchildren and their love become a weapon, and parents tend to fight for being best-loved by the children.
These are all factors that are difficult to handle in education - factors that can't be straightend with a rod, and have a massive impact.
|
|
Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted September 02, 2011 11:58 AM |
|
Edited by Fauch at 12:00, 02 Sep 2011.
|
Quote:
For example, all double-working parents I know have a bad conscience about that and tend to be lenient because of that. They know, that somehow child or children and parents are missing time with each other, and often it's difficult for them (or they simply don't have the energy anymore) to make up for that in terms of time together in the evening and on weekends.
Consequently they tend to be lenient, since they blame themselves when the kids are "doing wrong".
double-working parents? does that mean that both parents work, or that they have 2 jobs each??
many parents say they like school because someone is taking care of their children for free while they are working. it seems to be an important purpose of school actually. allowing mom and dad to work more (not that they really have the choice most of the time anyway). both work time and school time could be drastically decreased and it would probably be better, providing we make an efficient use of the little time left. already talked about that in my previous message.
|
| |
|
|
This thread is pages long: 
