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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted January 31, 2015 03:59 AM |
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@Stevie
First of all, wiki-sites can't be used as argument because anybody can write what they want on wiki-pages. Giovanni never asked Arantir to turn Ornella through the Kiss. His direct quote: Might I call your attention to the exploits of Lady Ornella, my apprentice, who felled the gates of Illuma-nadin. She is my gift of allegiance to you.
Then, wikia saying that Arantir finished the ritual doesn't mean a thing. Literally. I can go to wikia and change that sentence.
And Nar-Heresh is somewhat of a second capital of Necromancers. Officialy its Nar-Ankar (at least in Arantir's time), but Nar-Heresh is used as a main base of operations.
Stop looking for inconsistencies in places where there're none.
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Let's play poker game, lich-style!
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 31, 2015 04:19 AM |
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Edited by Stevie at 04:29, 31 Jan 2015.
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Except that the Wikia is based on actual gameplay, and translates the scenes exactly as they are understood.
Are you saying that it's not the same Kiss ritual? Then you just prove my point that it's a different ritual.
Then, if it's finished or not:
- if it is, then there were no Namtaru involved;
- if it isn't and it needs the Namtaru's Bite, then why does he send her in Nar-Ankar when all the Namtarus are in Nar-Heresh? Still no Namtaru involved;
And the lore Jeff and Erwan wrote says that Nar-Heresh is the capital whereas the wiki says that it's actually Nar-Ankar, so which is it? And I need you to provide a source for Nar-Heresh being the main and Nar-Ankar being the secondary as you suggested.
All in all, I'm pointing out that Jeff and Erwan wrote the lore during Heroes V development, and then the actual gameplay contradicts it, even in ToE which is released years later. So I'm actually conceding retcon in that direction, lol.
Ubisoft.
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Zombi_Wizzard
Famous Hero
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posted January 31, 2015 08:56 AM |
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Ummm so let me get this straight. In HoMM universe you can't become Vampire if another Vampire drinks your blood?
Also do stake through the hearth work? Idk, I'm not reading much of lore, so I always pictured Vampire as ... well ... Vampire.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 31, 2015 09:03 AM |
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I'll just leave this here..
In tribes of the east, Arkath, a winged red dragon-God appears as a giant bipedal fire dragon. The fact that fire dragon's model is bipedal is entirely coincidental.
In shades of darkness there are no sylvan models. The fact that elves do not appear is entirely coincidental.
In tribes of the east there is no namtaru model. Is the fact that they do not show in the ritual also coincidental? 
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted January 31, 2015 10:18 AM |
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maybe the Namtaru is dead by then?
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Pawek_13
Supreme Hero
Maths, maths everywhere!
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posted January 31, 2015 10:27 AM |
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Edited by Pawek_13 at 10:36, 31 Jan 2015.
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kiryu133 said:
maybe the Namtaru is dead by then?
They are presnt in Dark Messiah, so some of them are left after Shades of Darkness.
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Kimarous
Supreme Hero
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posted January 31, 2015 10:34 AM |
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kiryu133 said:
maybe the Namtaru is dead by then?
Here's hoping this topic of discussion is dead by Monday. 
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted January 31, 2015 10:38 AM |
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Sandro400 said:
Kiss of the Spider Goddess IS the ritual of becoming Vampire through Namtaru poison. So only 2 ways of becoming a Vampire.
Ritual of the Night brings a soul back to recently deceased body. Not instantly deceased.
Even in victory you manage to fail with lore
This I am willing to concede.
GenyaArikado said:
Warlord darling dont bother. You're right but given that stupidity is an incurable disease, they will continue talking. The less they're adressed the better. .
And this I am willing to concede as well.
Since Stevie obviously does not care about the lore unless it gives him arguments for his ulterior motive, debating him is less fruitfull than debating a wall.
I should have acknowledged a long time ago that my time, effort and good will are better spent elsewhere.
I hope Stevie on day finds the joy that HoMM evidently does not bring him anymore.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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GenyaArikado
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
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posted January 31, 2015 11:01 AM |
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Zombi_Wizzard said:
Ummm so let me get this straight. In HoMM universe you can't become Vampire if another Vampire drinks your blood?
Also do stake through the hearth work? Idk, I'm not reading much of lore, so I always pictured Vampire as ... well ... Vampire.
No but in theory (idk if actually said) given that in the vampire bloodstream fliws venom instead blood irc, they should be able to turn others by cutting and feeding said venom
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I wish that at some point we get another bull duchy story. I love them italian-spanish vampires
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Pawek_13
Supreme Hero
Maths, maths everywhere!
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posted January 31, 2015 11:12 AM |
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GenyaArikado said:
I wish that at some point we get another bull duchy story. I love them italian-spanish vampires
I presume that Giovanni and his undead mercanaries will play quite a role in the story of Ivan's rise to power.
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Sleeping_Sun
Promising
Famous Hero
Townscreen Architect
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posted January 31, 2015 11:26 AM |
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GenyaArikado said:
In other topic, I really hope Lucretia returns. If she betrays Sandro (which she may do given she should be alive in H5 era) and he replaces with someone called Vidomina i wouldnt be angry at all.
I wouldn't mind this at all.  It would be good if Lucretia becomes more important and prominent person in Ubi lore. I think she has the potential, especially since she was Sandro's apprentice.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 31, 2015 11:30 AM |
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GenyaArikado said:
No but in theory (idk if actually said) given that in the vampire bloodstream fliws venom instead blood irc, they should be able to turn others by cutting and feeding said venom
I see where this is going 
Now then, can we please stop beating a dead horse? Ubi is aware of our complaints and they will look into it. If someone is still desparately set on discussing the lich - vampire lore he could create a dedicated topic for that. Further offtopic will be deleted without warning.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Zombi_Wizzard
Famous Hero
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posted January 31, 2015 12:38 PM |
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Now what I'm interasted in is maps. I know Ubi is working on map editor, so that it will be intuitive, but I belive H7 should come with healthy ammount of premade maps, as well as RMG. In H5 and in H6 specialy I was realy dissapointed with this. Also in H3 vanila I remember I kinda missed a few 1 vs 1 multiplayer maps. Yes RMG can save a lot, but it cannot bring the polish and balance the premade maps can give, so only option is to wait untill someone makes them or make them yourself.
In H3 I remember I made few maps just for one purpose - so that me and my friend could play 1v1 via LAN. I didn't share them with other people, since they were tailor made for how we wanted to play.
So I belive in H7, if it realy wishes to be one of the best games, this should be minimum:
- 1-3 one vs. one maps (focused on multiplayer)
- 1-3 two vs. two maps (again for multiplayer purposes)
- 3-4 medium/big sized maps that are not so much balanced, and have various number of players - atleast one balanced (for multi and single player purposes)
- 2-3 large/extra large maps, atleast one balaced, but not so important, for 6 - 8 human or AI players
in adition:
- 2-3 maps with "find grail" objective
- 3-4 maps with various scenario objectives, that are mini stories, including cinematics ... like in H5 Agrael's Trial for example.
- 1-3 other maps
This means roughly 15-20 maps imo should be in game, with adition to RMG and Map Editor. I belive this is the reasonable ammount nedeed for solid play from the get go, and not too much to be imposible to do.
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frostymuaddib
Promising
Supreme Hero
育碧是白痴
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posted January 31, 2015 12:47 PM |
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Don't forget the campaign editor 
As for maps, the main thing that I've disliked in Ubi's heroes is the feel you have about their size. Even on the biggest maps, I had a feeling that it is small, compared to how I feel when playing XL map on H3. In case of H6, this is not necessary a bad thing, as map objects were not interestin and area of control made exploring maps not important and boring.
It would be nice if they could re-create 'epicness' feel that you had when you play a large map in heroes.
Also, I agree that there should be more maps with the game release, and that RMG and Map and Campaign editors are essential.
But please, do not include campaing scenarios as multiplayer maps 
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted January 31, 2015 01:04 PM |
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also remakes of classic scenarios like three fat pigs and viking we shall go. that would be so amazing 
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted January 31, 2015 01:42 PM |
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this lore... is really a big obstecle in our way. we cant progress in discussing it/fixig it/etc etc... why does it have to be so hard to get what we want? we want skeletal lich, and thats it. a fact clear as a day. ubisoft must handle it.. how? dont matter really. demand of players matters more then a some-time-ago-written-lore. if lore says impossible, then lore should be rewritten.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted January 31, 2015 02:13 PM |
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cleglaw said:
this lore... is really a big obstecle in our way. we cant progress in discussing it/fixig it/etc etc... why does it have to be so hard to get what we want? we want skeletal lich, and thats it. a fact clear as a day. ubisoft must handle it.. how? dont matter really. demand of players matters more then a some-time-ago-written-lore. if lore says impossible, then lore should be rewritten.
Cleg, do you know when people started saying this?
Before HoMM5 was released, the moment they started releasing information.
And see how much effect this has had.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted January 31, 2015 02:17 PM |
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War-overlord said:
Cleg, do you know when people started saying this?
Before HoMM5 was released, the moment they started releasing information.
And see how much effect this has had.
Ashan wasn't burned in flames in a day
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properkheldar
Famous Hero
Keeper of books
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posted January 31, 2015 02:42 PM |
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I want elves to look like a generic robin hoods and orcs to look like strange orange pigs again. Damn you ubisoft for challenging my nostalgic childhood conception of rightness. Ashan should burn in a thousand fires for all eternity and Ubisoft is the devil and Erwan the herald of the apocalypse. The end.
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"Man spends his life in reasoning on the past, in complaining of the present, in fearing future."
- Antoine Rivarol
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DIEGIS
Supreme Hero
power of Zamolxis
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posted January 31, 2015 02:56 PM |
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As everyone knows, ubi released recently - on 29th of January - Heroes 3 HD. I was very excited to hear that, but didn't buy it, cose of the H6 experience. Well, it seems I did a good thing!
http://store.steampowered.com/app/297000/
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dacian falx behind you
-knowledge itself is power-
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This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
