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| Thread: Dragons as champion units. |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Brukernavn
Hero of Order
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posted September 03, 2014 12:06 AM |
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ChrisD1 said:
do you care about the storyline of the game or you just play for the fun of it?
Both, but a fun game trumps storyline. A fun game with a bad story will still have a lot of re-playability, but I'll barely play through a bad game once, even though it has a good story. IMO the Ashan world is a hinder for both, but I understand Ubis desire to create a uniform world in which all of the M&M games take place. I just don't find that world very interesting.
Edit: I do not mind a "huge skeletal creation", as Elvin put it, and some of the examples on the previous page look rather nice.
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 03, 2014 10:05 AM |
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Brukernavn said:
ChrisD1 said:
do you care about the storyline of the game or you just play for the fun of it?
Both, but a fun game trumps storyline. A fun game with a bad story will still have a lot of re-playability, but I'll barely play through a bad game once, even though it has a good story. IMO the Ashan world is a hinder for both, but I understand Ubis desire to create a uniform world in which all of the M&M games take place. I just don't find that world very interesting..
Although you are right about gameplay "beating the storyline" i don't think that it's gamebreaking to not have dragons, since you mostly mind fun. the units replacing them will be surprising thus fun.
But for a person minding the story a little bit, having it trampled for sheer fan service is kinda annoying.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted September 03, 2014 01:54 PM |
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ChrisD1 said:
Although you are right about gameplay "beating the storyline" i don't think that it's gamebreaking to not have dragons, since you mostly mind fun. the units replacing them will be surprising thus fun.
In my book, a Heroes without dragons isn't a Heroes
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 03, 2014 02:58 PM |
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Storm-Giant said:
ChrisD1 said:
Although you are right about gameplay "beating the storyline" i don't think that it's gamebreaking to not have dragons, since you mostly mind fun. the units replacing them will be surprising thus fun.
In my book, a Heroes without dragons isn't a Heroes
those books must be really musty and old 
come on seriously now, dragons are not a core feature of heroes. if you put out a game of heroes without any dragons, no one would say "what game is this?it looks like heroes but no dragons".
they are cool and i like them don't get me wrong, but in this installement they just don't make sense with the lore. that's all. change the story about the dragon gods and then bring as many dragons as you like.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted September 03, 2014 03:03 PM |
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They are one of the most iconic creatures of HoM&M saga. They've been featured in all six installments of the series, always among the most powerful creatures of the game.
There are a bunch of creatures that you simply can't take away from the game. So yes, for me they are like a feature of the game.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 03, 2014 03:09 PM |
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ChrisD1 said:
they are cool and i like them don't get me wrong, but in this installement they just don't make sense with the lore. that's all. change the story about the dragon gods and then bring as many dragons as you like.
Here is the problem with this argument. The lore setting has been there since HeroesV. We've had at least 2 Heroes games with Dragons. We've had several spinoff games with Dragons. As far as Dragons go, there has not been a problem with them being used as Champion Creatures so far and there have not been any retcons regarding the nature of Dragons. So therefor there is no reason to give the boot to Dragons.
It is very simple God=Dragon; Dragon=/=God.
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Brukernavn
Hero of Order
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posted September 03, 2014 03:38 PM |
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ChrisD1 said:
change the story about the dragon gods and then bring as many dragons as you like.
Edit: In that I would like them to change the story...
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted September 03, 2014 03:40 PM |
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Am I the only one who reads WO posts and has played previous Ubisoft M&M titles? 
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foxxxer
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted September 03, 2014 03:45 PM |
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War-overlord said:
It is very simple God=Dragon; Dragon=/=God.
Pretty much this.
As others stated the problem is not the dragons but the amount. In particular the amount inside the factions.
For me it's enough 2 dragons in the factions as champion units - Dungeon and Necropolis. If there are more dragons I prefer them as neutral units. Ubi can even revive the old Dragon City which may function as a Dragon Utopia and Dwelling adventure map building for dragons (Green, Red, Gold, Black for instance). When 'break' the Utopia you receive artifacts and afterwards you can hire dragons every week.
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 03, 2014 03:46 PM |
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Storm-Giant said:
Am I the only one who reads WO posts and has played previous Ubisoft M&M titles?
Likely.
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Brukernavn
Hero of Order
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posted September 03, 2014 03:47 PM |
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I don't mind dragons with the current lore, as I agree with WO. But I also wouldn't mind if they changed the lore, since some people obviously find it contradictory. At the same time they could do away with race based factions to allow for more creature diversity!
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 03, 2014 03:49 PM |
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Brukernavn said:
At the same time they could do away with race based factions to allow for more creature diversity!
They can make more variety by simply giving us more than 7 creatures per faction (not counting upgrades). We're getting 8 now, but that's not that many more.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted September 03, 2014 03:56 PM |
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War-overlord said:
Brukernavn said:
At the same time they could do away with race based factions to allow for more creature diversity!
They can make more variety by simply giving us more than 7 creatures per faction (not counting upgrades). We're getting 8 now, but that's not that many more.
Give me some tasty subfactions, please! 
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 03, 2014 04:03 PM |
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Storm-Giant said:
Give me some tasty subfactions, please!
That or do what they did to champions, give us 1 more creature in each tier than we can build around.
Give us 4 cores, 4 elites and 2 champions. And allow us only to build 3 of the cores and elites and 1 champion. And of course the ability to tear down the buildings we don't want.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted September 03, 2014 04:29 PM |
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Indeed, that could work too, no doubt about it.
But still, I'm very keen to the subfaction idea. Committing to a subfaction would give your army a specific theme, instead of taking creatures without any relation aside from the faction itself.
Likewise, I think it could beneficial for game balance too. You could work with each subfaction, giving them weakness and offering distinct gameplay (whereas the free-to-pick creature system could be 'exploited' and pick the best creatures of each tier, or the ones who sinergize more...)
Imagine a Cult vs Void Necropolis, with basic necro units being Skeleton, Ghost, Vampire and Lich. A Cult based Necropolis would have more range firepower (Champion spider ladies), but the Void theme could have some cool units and/or abilities (based on the Void stuff)...
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 03, 2014 04:36 PM |
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Yes, well, I never tried to make it out to be a bad idea. I'd like to see it as well, it's just a lot more work and therefor less likely to happen.
But both ideas have been discussed at length, so let's not repeat them here.
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 03, 2014 04:49 PM |
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Storm-Giant said:
Am I the only one who reads WO posts and has played previous Ubisoft M&M titles?
WO does make fine argument but still it's not solid enough to convince me. the fact that there was no problem before with dragons(although i did see somewhere that there was a slight complaint about them being overused in heroes 5,lack of creativity etc) does not mean that they are the best answer as a champion unit since most people just find them "fun" and disregard the lore.and ubi knows
and lets be real the only reason the faceless wasn't a champion unit in heroes 6 was to try and calm down the angry fans about the fiasco H6.
however the dragon=\god does make sense at a certain angle which i hadn't thought before so i won't be displeased at all when dragons swarm this game. but i'd rather see smth new and unexpected. that's my angle. need to see smth new for a champion like with swordbearer.
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radar
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Castle/Haven player
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posted September 03, 2014 06:01 PM |
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I vastly enjoyed the diversity of dragon types back in H3, but maybe because there were so many neutral ones amongst them I did not feel that they were at any point overused.
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blizz
Known Hero
of temper grace
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posted September 05, 2014 11:31 PM |
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I don't mind black, emerald and even bone dragon at all. Those are one of the most iconic creatures of the series, just like titans or angels.
I just hope they come up with a better design for them. H6 Black dragon was just horrible. It reminded me of a digimon.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 06, 2014 12:16 AM |
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blizz said:
H6 Black dragon was just horrible. It reminded me of a digimon.
Ahahaha, especially the way it flies, kind of comic 
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