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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted November 05, 2020 02:18 PM |
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Actually you should assume that the elections are rigged by default in each and every case because that's what they usually are unless one side has an overwhelming support that is visible not only in polls (they are all manipulative) and in official propaganda throughout the media, but in everyday life. Even in the latter case there are usually frauds. Casting a vote "freely" is just that - casting it. Counting that vote is what matters but, as the legendary saying (most likely wrongly) attributed to comrade Joseph Vissarionovich puts it, it's about who counts it. I'd also add "and how it is counted". The US is obviously split 50:50 at the moment and frauds and dirty tricks are not just possible, they are mandatory, especially given that how each side sees this as a life-or-death choice.
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 03:08 PM |
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this election, as the last one, is different. Trump is not part of their usual program.
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Blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted November 05, 2020 03:21 PM |
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Zenofex said: Actually you should assume that the elections are rigged by default in each and every case because that's what they usually are unless one side has an overwhelming support that is visible not only in polls (they are all manipulative) and in official propaganda throughout the media, but in everyday life. Even in the latter case there are usually frauds. Casting a vote "freely" is just that - casting it. Counting that vote is what matters but, as the legendary saying (most likely wrongly) attributed to comrade Joseph Vissarionovich puts it, it's about who counts it. I'd also add "and how it is counted". The US is obviously split 50:50 at the moment and frauds and dirty tricks are not just possible, they are mandatory, especially given that how each side sees this as a life-or-death choice.
Oh dear.
You go on and on and on. Just a wall of text with epic claims and no substance behind your claims. Where is your evidence Zenofex? How did they intercept the ballots? How did they forge enough signatures to tip an election? How are they using hundreds of thousands or millions of people's personal identification information without being caught?
https://www.cnet.com/news/mail-in-voting-fraud-is-nearly-impossible-to-commit/
The main question among serious people is if certain submitted ballots are valid or late, i.e. that they were submitted within the legal timeframe for casting a vote, but that is something that will be investigated based on state laws. The other threat is if millions of gullible people believe in their imaginations that fraud on a mass scale is a supposedly easy crime to commit and should be assumed, which of course is entirely unsupported.
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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Gandalf196
Disgraceful
Supreme Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 03:32 PM |
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Blizzardboy said: The other threat is if millions of gullible people believe in their imaginations that fraud on a mass scale is a supposedly easy crime to commit and should be assumed, which of course is entirely unsupported.
I'd rather say that a real threat to democracy is if millions of gullible people believe in their imaginations that fraud on a mass scale is a supposedly difficult crime to commit and should not be assumed, which of course is entirely unsupported.
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Blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted November 05, 2020 03:34 PM |
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RerryR said: That was not the point I was trying to make. I wanted to say that Trump had already questioned the legitimacy of the election in advance by claiming that the Democrats were rigging the election. And this, of course, without proof.
Now the election is over and it seems (so far) that everything went relatively fair and peaceful. To the conclusion comes by the way also the OSCE (https://www.osce.org/odihr/elections/469440). That is, everyone could at least, vote more or less freely. That is for me a free and fair election, differently than what is claimed here in the forum.
I am not talking about the American electoral system and how the parties nominate their candidates. That is what you mean and I don't disagree with you there either.
Yes, thank you.
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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Kipshasz
Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's Darkside
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posted November 05, 2020 03:36 PM |
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Gandalf196 said:
Blizzardboy said: The other threat is if millions of gullible people believe in their imaginations that fraud on a mass scale is a supposedly easy crime to commit and should be assumed, which of course is entirely unsupported.
I'd rather say that a real threat to democracy is if millions of gullible people believe in their imaginations that fraud on a mass scale is a supposedly difficult crime to commit and should not be assumed, which of course is entirely unsupported.
Given the tech of these days, election fraud is even more easy to commit, with the classic "crashed computers method". They've yet to pull this, only pulling the "missing ballots" and allegedly siphoning votes from the lolbert candidate.
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"Kip is the Gavin McInnes of HC" - Salamandre
"Ashan to the Trashcan", "I got PTSD from H7. " - LizardWarrior
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 03:38 PM |
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@ Blizz
I haven't got the slightest clue why you are still arguing - they won't even consider what you are saying. This board, when it comes to US issues, is a mirror of what is happening in the US now: polarization and the death of all dialogue.
This is what the Trump administration has brought to the country - THEM and US.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 03:44 PM |
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Weird I have never heard this election fraud argument before Trump, if it truly is such a common practice. Or mayhaps, mmmhh, could it just be, that some people are just veeeeeery sore losers
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Gandalf196
Disgraceful
Supreme Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 03:49 PM |
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I'd like to say, though, that I understand two hundred year and also dead people voting for Biden, I get that feeling represented is important.
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 03:55 PM |
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i can see this conversation is steering towards snow that gets certain people penalyzed and blocked.
i'm sick of dealing with childishness. i'm out.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 04:06 PM |
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Gandalf196 said: I'd like to say, though, that I understand two hundred year and also dead people voting for Biden, I get that feeling represented is important.
Surely you can provide your source?
Or has it also been deleted? Like the Hunter Biden evidence that Fox news had but they lost in mail. Such a shame, it would have been election changing
I wish future technology allows us to copy documents and files, that would surely change the world.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 04:43 PM |
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted November 05, 2020 04:49 PM |
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Blizzardboy said:
Oh dear.
You go on and on and on. Just a wall of text with epic claims and no substance behind your claims. Where is your evidence Zenofex? How did they intercept the ballots? How did they forge enough signatures to tip an election? How are they using hundreds of thousands or millions of people's personal identification information without being caught?
https://www.cnet.com/news/mail-in-voting-fraud-is-nearly-impossible-to-commit/
The main question among serious people is if certain submitted ballots are valid or late, i.e. that they were submitted within the legal timeframe for casting a vote, but that is something that will be investigated based on state laws. The other threat is if millions of gullible people believe in their imaginations that fraud on a mass scale is a supposedly easy crime to commit and should be assumed, which of course is entirely unsupported.
Educate yourself.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 05:01 PM |
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I hope you read that article too, because it's not really giving any indication of voter fraud in the US. It only indicates that a lot has been claimed but remains unproven.
The voter fraud that is currently apparent is that a valid, proven part of the voting process is claimed to be fraudulent as part of a strategy to steal the election.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 05:15 PM |
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Oh the irony of posting "educate yourself" to someone, while linking to á page where one of the first things you see is "In April 2020 a 20-year review of voter fraud in the United States, since it occurs only in "0.00006 percent" of instances nationally, and, in one state, "0.000004 percent — about five times less likely than getting hit by lightning in the United States
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Blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted November 05, 2020 05:15 PM |
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Wow Zenofex. You linked me a wiki article about voter fraud.
Anyway, so far, nobody here claiming fraud in this election has any proof to take to any court of law, so I'll just assume they are baseless bursts of passion from election anxiety. I want to know how these IDs are magically being hijacked. I want to know how my voting district and voting number would be changed despite being personally linked to me. Anybody?
Of course I'm completely open to hearing something substantiated about voter fraud because a fair election is extremely important to our country and I don't want anybody in office who shouldn't be there. Trump has every right to legally dispute things if that is what his campaign chooses to do.
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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Neraus
Promising
Legendary Hero
Pain relief cream seller
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posted November 05, 2020 05:16 PM |
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I don't get how delays like these are defensible tho, here any delays that mean counting continues until 2AM is considered Africa tier organization.
Also, how can the europeans here defend the US electoral system as safe is beyond me, they have different electoral laws on a state by state basis, without identification enforcement, is Italy the only one that requires a double identification plus cross reference on the spot? And we still have problems with tackling voter corruption.
People call out fraud because the system looks so unsafe that in my opinion it's only right to suspect someone isn't playing fair, even the way it's playing out right now, it looks fishy as hell, boarded out counts, suspicious bags coming, allegations of willful invalidation of votes and witnesses of the USPS doing fake postmarkings of mail ballots.
Then it may just amount to paranoia, but the wait is only fuelling it.
By the way, is it because halloween was just a few days ago or are people who respond to Trump's tweets some kind of demon worshippers? I don't think I ever saw some world leader get responses in obscure alphabets with creepy images, or with repeated chants.
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Noli offendere Patriam Agathae quia ultrix iniuriarum est.
ANTUDO
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 05, 2020 05:32 PM |
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The proposal to begin counting the mail ballots earlier than after election day has been refused, and for understandable reason. As a result, since each ballot must be checked for authenticity counting lasts.
Also, some States allow ballots with a postal stamp of election day, which means, ballots are still arriving in some cases...
Note, though, that States are only required in December to give their definite, official results, not asap.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 05, 2020 05:59 PM |
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Minion said: Oh the irony of posting "educate yourself" to someone, while linking to á page where one of the first things you see is "In April 2020 a 20-year review of voter fraud in the United States, since it occurs only in "0.00006 percent" of instances nationally, and, in one state, "0.000004 percent — about five times less likely than getting hit by lightning in the United States
This. And when you say to Zeno, he has a tendency to conspiracy theories, he’s all: What are you talking about, what conspiracy?
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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FirePaladin
Promising
Legendary Hero
DoR Modder
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posted November 05, 2020 06:19 PM |
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Blizzardboy said: Wow Zenofex. You linked me a wiki article about voter fraud.
Anyway, so far, nobody here claiming fraud in this election has any proof to take to any court of law, so I'll just assume they are baseless bursts of passion from election anxiety. I want to know how these IDs are magically being hijacked. I want to know how my voting district and voting number would be changed despite being personally linked to me. Anybody?
Of course I'm completely open to hearing something substantiated about voter fraud because a fair election is extremely important to our country and I don't want anybody in office who shouldn't be there. Trump has every right to legally dispute things if that is what his campaign chooses to do.
Not gonna risk my butt to do that, sorry bro lol.
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Enshackling time itself, heralds of the Ancients among their heat-depleted land.... Who could they be, who could rally the beings of the East and the North and control the mortals' fate?
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